[Vision2020] naming names
london at moscow.com
Fri Sep 15 11:15:11 PDT 2006
Vision2020 is a non-moderated forum. Like the famous soapbox in Hyde Park, this forum is open to anyone. Those of us who helped create V2020 hoped that the discussion would be enlightening and positive and help build a sense of empowerment and community here in Moscow.
There are legal restrictions on speech that do apply, primarily the issue of libel (knowing something is false and writing it anyway with malice of intent).
Also, anyone who speaks through V2020 should expect that other posts will counter and/or ridicule.
Other than those basics, the agreed-upon ground rules (as I recall from several years ago) are:
*maximum of two posts per day
*posting using the author's real name (not an alias)
As you might have noticed, not all posts follow the ground rules. That is part of the problem of a non-moderated list.
I do not see why a candid discussion of the merits of any specific business should be off-limits on V2020.
----- Original Message -----
From: Pennsylvania Place
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 1:21 PM
Subject: [Vision2020] naming names
I have a quick question about Vision2020 policy. I was taken to task recently for several things I said. What bothered me the most about this dressing down (other than being accused of being "Surely Pissedoff" - actually, I am Jackie Woolf, don't you know?) was that it is seen by some to be "against the rules" to name names about local "reputable" businesses that I have a problem with.
Is this not a public forum for discussing Moscow? If I have a conversation with someone on the street, I am not going to say "I got screwed by a certain apartment rental company that misled my family and cost us hundred of dollars needlessly," I am going to say who they were so they don't get screwed, too. If I am talking about a recently closed Italian place, I am not going to say "that restaurant that used to be in the Moscow Hotel," I am going to say "Basilio's." And how, exactly, is it better to say "The place that used to be in the Moscow Hotel" when we all know exactly what is being talked about?
I am very committed to local businesses - I would say 90% of my "shopping" is done with local or regional merchants. I don't shop at Wal-Mart, or Hastings, or any of the junk food greasy drive-ins. I champion my favorites stores happily - but likewise, I let people know when a local business is not worth my money. Why should vision2020 be any different?
Someone accused me of bashing anti-Kirker businesses exclusively. Considering I keep being accused of being a Kirker by others, that just makes me feel like I'm getting it in the front AND the rear. For the record:
1) I complained about Palouse Properties because they screwed my family, and have screwed several of my friends. Anyone wants to know the specifics, I will gladly provide them.
2) I pointed out that I quit going to Basilio's not because I couldn't park there, but because the food was mediocre and the service was crappy. I never claimed it should be a gourmet place as someone seemed to think, but I expect food I pay for to be a) better than "from the can", and b) better than what I would cook at home.
3) I patronized Gambino's for 15 years before I walked away for the last time. Gambino's was a special place for my family, but after Pops died it went into the toilet. It was filthy on the inside, the servers (other than one long-time server, I forget her name but she was from Genessee) were terrible, and there were thugs smoking cigarettes outside the front door all the time. I can excuse a lot of faults at an eatery, but I *WILL NOT* tolerate filth.
So, according to Mr. Crabtree, my complaints about these businesses are somehow directed by Doug Wilson, whose thigh I am stroking as I type this, by the way. Well, Mr. Crabtree, would you like to know that I have not spent one dollar at Bucer's, West of Paris, Live Lovely, or any other place they own? Why? For one thing, I don't like ZEALOTS of any kind, be they religious or anti-religious. Second of all, I don't have the disposable income to eat french food or buy Le Crueset cookware. And I don't like the way it feels to step into a coffee shop dominated by bearded middle-aged men and glowing, skirted young dainties.
So, what part of the unwritten rules do I not understand? Seems to me vision2020 should be a good place to speak about our COMMUNITY here in MOSCOW. If discussion is going to center on the War in Iraq, George Bush, Global Warming, or Professional Sports, what is the effing point of this forum? We can get all that other stuff on any news or discussion site on the entire internet. If we do not discuss Moscow/Palouse specifics here, we are ALL just wasting our precious time. Or at least I am. Lord knows I would rather be bathing nude with Art Deco and G Crabtree. Preferably at the same time.They are both such manly, dignified men.
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