[Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan
Paul Rumelhart
godshatter at yahoo.com
Mon Sep 11 08:49:17 PDT 2006
Proof? I don't have any. Just a guess. He's a well-known figure in
this area, anyone who was around then knows the story. Rapists aren't
generally well-treated in jail.
I could, of course, be wrong. But so what if he gets access to a
computer for a few weeks of the final phase of his 25-year sentence? I
wouldn't say they get everything handed to them. I've never been in
prison, but I understand it's not a very nice place.
Paul
J Ford wrote:
> Ok, I'm going to meet you half way on this - what proof have you read
> or heard that indicates Coe is any kind of danger in Spokane? Even
> his lawyer says the move is because the "facilities are nicer...and he
> can have access to the computers." Sounds to me like he is more
> interested in comfort than in rehab.
>
> I am not saying he or any of those creeps should be mistreated - I am
> saying that giving in to their want's or wishes is not in the best
> interest of the victim (dead or alive) or society. They already get
> everything handed to them...why add to that insult by transferring
> them just because?
>
> J :]
>
>
>
>
>
>> From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan
>> Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 20:42:21 -0700
>>
>> Why would it be an either/or type of situation? I think everyone,
>> within certain constraints, should be treated humanely. Even border
>> cases. To do anything else is barbarism. These are the same reasons
>> I think it's criminal that we torture detainees.
>>
>> That's not saying we should serve him tea and crumpets, but moving
>> him out of what could likely be a dangerous situation seems to me to
>> be the civilized way to cope with this. Likely it's killing two
>> birds with one stone, putting him in a safer place while studying him
>> to see what kind of danger he still poses.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> J Ford wrote:
>>
>>> What the hell? Are you people really blind or what? WHAT ABOUT THE
>>> VICTIMS? Where are your feelings for them? Your support? Your
>>> concern for the rest of *their* lives, what's left of them?
>>>
>>> I could care less what happens to this guy in prison, especially a
>>> guy like Coe or Sitler or even Jamin who REFUSE to acknowledge and
>>> truly come to terms with what lives they have destroyed. Truth is,
>>> a lot of the time these guys are isolated in prison due to the
>>> threats against them.
>>>
>>> Would I like to see him tied and beaten? No. But a "country club"
>>> type of institution is just not right. Guaranteed his victims are
>>> not happy about any of this either.
>>>
>>>
>>> J :]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan
>>>> Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 16:58:16 -0700
>>>>
>>>> The action that seems to have enraged you this much was the judge
>>>> granting his request to avoid Spokane County lockup and spend a few
>>>> weeks at a more humane facility. He's known in Spokane as a
>>>> legendary rapist, wouldn't it be overly cruel to make him spend
>>>> time in lockup there where his own safety would be in jeopardy?
>>>>
>>>> Or would you rather we just tie him up by his toes and beat him
>>>> with baseball bats until the time of his hearing?
>>>>
>>>> Unless I'm remembering wrong from when I was a child, he didn't
>>>> kill anybody. His mom tried to, if I remember correctly, but he
>>>> didn't. He's spent a quarter of a century in prison as a known
>>>> rapist. I'm amazed he survived at all. All the time that a normal
>>>> person would spend building a family and a career was spent in a
>>>> prison cell. He's also a convicted felon upon release, a
>>>> registered sex offender, and a notoriously infamous celebrity to
>>>> boot. Not to mention the fact that they are considering keeping
>>>> him committed past his release date. Isn't that enough? Or do we
>>>> have to make each and every request of his fall on deaf ears just
>>>> in spite? There are people who get off easy for some things, yes,
>>>> but I wouldn't count him as one of them.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>> J Ford wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> How dare you! Have you lived through being raped, molested,
>>>>> almost killed!? Huh,have you? Didn't think so. So don't you
>>>>> dare assume you know that murder is worse than living through the
>>>>> type of hell child predators put their victims through. YOU HAVE
>>>>> NO IDEA! The person murdered - their pain is over; the "survivor"
>>>>> of molestation/rape, etc. - their pain continues on and on and
>>>>> on. They never loose it - some learn to live with it differently
>>>>> than others, some take the route of suicide. A VAST majority of
>>>>> child victims are killed.
>>>>>
>>>>> According toe National Missing and Exploited Children's web site:
>>>>>
>>>>> "an estimated 797,500 children were reported missing; 58,200
>>>>> children were abducted by nonfamily members; 115 children were the
>>>>> victims of the most serious, long-term nonfamily abductions called
>>>>> "stereotypical kidnappings"; and 203,900 children were the victims
>>>>> of family abductions."
>>>>>
>>>>> THAT is a hell of a lot of kids missing and hurt. You want to
>>>>> tell them or their families that "its ok, at least you can't prove
>>>>> they've had the worst happen to them - that they are dead."? The
>>>>> worst is not knowing where they are, are they safe, are they being
>>>>> tortured?
>>>>>
>>>>> There are many, many victims of rape and child molestation that
>>>>> would and have taken death over living with what happened to
>>>>> them. Suicide does not mitigate or negate the seriousness of the
>>>>> originating crime of molestation. The fact that someone would say
>>>>> "you'll get over it - it was only molestation vs. murder" or
>>>>> "molestation is not as bad as murder - you lived through it" is
>>>>> what is asinine - and callous.
>>>>>
>>>>> Duncan is not "alleged" to be a multiple child molester - he IS a
>>>>> multiply convicted and multiply charged child molester and killer.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you talk to Adam Walsh's father, John, or anyone else who works
>>>>> to fight against child molesters they will tell you 9 x's out of
>>>>> 10, the perp has been caught doing a "lesser" crime, but has
>>>>> committed numerous extremely serious unknown ones. Duncan is NOT
>>>>> unique - he just got caught.
>>>>>
>>>>> In ref to Coe, he ASKED/PETITIONED/BEGGED the court to allow him
>>>>> to be transferred to another facility - to get him out of
>>>>> Spokane. It matters little where that place is or that he MAY
>>>>> have ended up there eventually; what matters is HE made the
>>>>> request and the court went with it:
>>>>>
>>>>> "Kevin Coe Gets Hearing Delay September 6, 2006 By Associated Press
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevin Coe, convicted of one of the rapes that terrorized Spokane's
>>>>> South Hill neighborhood a quarter-century ago, on Wednesday
>>>>> requested transfer to a special prison for sexual predators to
>>>>> spend a seven-week delay in the state's efforts to keep him in
>>>>> custody indefinitely.
>>>>>
>>>>> Spokane County Superior Court Judge Kathleen O'Connor on Wednesday
>>>>> granted Coe's request to go to the special commitment center on
>>>>> McNeil Island and agreed to the delay in the probable cause
>>>>> hearing to give his lawyers time to study more than 66,000 pages
>>>>> of documents the state submitted in its efforts to keep Coe in
>>>>> custody.
>>>>>
>>>>> Coe's attorney, Tim Trageser, said his client would like to spend
>>>>> the delay at McNeil Island, in Puget Sound between Tacoma and
>>>>> Olympia, rather than the Spokane County Jail.
>>>>>
>>>>> As a civil facility, McNeil Island has much better living
>>>>> arrangements than a crowded county jail, Trageser said."
>>>>>
>>>>> And yes, victimization does occur in prison - BUT NOT TO CHILDREN
>>>>> by molesters. People don't want to run the risk they will become
>>>>> a victim in prison, they should not do a crime that puts them in
>>>>> that position. (Before you say it - YES there are innocent people
>>>>> sent to jail or prison and YES they can become victims in jail or
>>>>> prison.)
>>>>>
>>>>> And your claim that there is only one "sex offender treatment
>>>>> provider" and they are in Clarkston is false. There are MANY in
>>>>> the area and Sitler is actually being treated by TWO providers,
>>>>> one in Pullman and one in Clarkston. And to the Sheriff's
>>>>> chagrin, his FAMILY members are taking him to both. Read the file
>>>>> - you'll see there is a letter there from the LCSD that
>>>>> specifically requests anyone BUT family members take Sitler to his
>>>>> "treatment" and the court, thus far, has ignored that request.
>>>>>
>>>>> It irks me to no end that a defense lawyer, ANY, continues to
>>>>> claim they know what a victim of their client's feels or the
>>>>> victim of any crime feels. Until you are on the receiving end of
>>>>> that crime - you have no idea.
>>>>>
>>>>> J :]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
>>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020]
>>>>>> CoetransferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
>>>>>> Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 17:24:27 -0700
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Duncan is alleged to be a serial killer as well as a child
>>>>>> molester. You
>>>>>> claim he's close to average for a sex offender and then claim I'm
>>>>>> being
>>>>>> obtuse? Please! That's a ridiculous position to take. No, it's
>>>>>> asinine,
>>>>>> absolute nonsense.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please do not compare murder to molestation and claim they're the
>>>>>> same.
>>>>>> Most people can tell they're two separate crimes, with the former
>>>>>> being
>>>>>> worse.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't think the only practice providing treatment to sex
>>>>>> offenders, which
>>>>>> is based in Clarkston, would come here to provide treatment to
>>>>>> one person.
>>>>>> If I'm wrong, which is possible, then there would be no reason to
>>>>>> let Sitler
>>>>>> out for treatment. If they won't come here, then this is a
>>>>>> reason to allow
>>>>>> him to go to Clarkston for treatment.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's obtuse to claim Coe is having his way when he is going to
>>>>>> the facility
>>>>>> where the state wishes to keep him what appears to be the rest of
>>>>>> his life,
>>>>>> in order to prepare for the hearing that will determine his future.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Actually, prison provides numerous opportunities to victimize
>>>>>> others.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sunil
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>>>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe
>>>>>>> transferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 16:05:46 -0700
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ok, now you're being purposefully obtuse. There is no way I can
>>>>>>> say,
>>>>>>> without taking a poll, what provider would be willing, or not,
>>>>>>> to go to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> jail and offer treatment. What I can say is that the ones I
>>>>>>> have talked
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in a casual manner, have said they have never been asked by the
>>>>>>> court,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> they
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> have just been asked or ordered to provide the "treatment" and
>>>>>>> told the
>>>>>>> prisoner will come to them. And no, I will not provide those
>>>>>>> names as
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> you
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> know very well that confidentiality prohibits me from doing that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Coe, through his attorney, requested that he be transferred out of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Spokane
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> to a specific facility. It was COE's choice and the court went
>>>>>>> with it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Duncan is more along the lines of the average molester than
>>>>>>> you'd like to
>>>>>>> admit. Difference is, he got caught. Whether they kill their
>>>>>>> victims or
>>>>>>> kill what childhood the victim may have had, the violator has
>>>>>>> committed a
>>>>>>> deadly sin and should be punished accordingly. Penny's idea of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> sentencing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> them to 25-life right out of the gate makes more sense than 15,
>>>>>>> with time
>>>>>>> off for "good" behavior. How else are they gonna act in prison
>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> "good"
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> since there is no opportunity to victimize anyone?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> J :]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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