[Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan

Paul Rumelhart godshatter at yahoo.com
Sun Sep 10 20:42:21 PDT 2006


Why would it be an either/or type of situation?  I think everyone, 
within certain constraints, should be treated humanely.  Even border 
cases.  To do anything else is barbarism.  These are the same reasons I 
think it's criminal that we torture detainees.

That's not saying we should serve him tea and crumpets, but moving him 
out of what could likely be a dangerous situation seems to me to be the 
civilized way to cope with this.  Likely it's killing two birds with one 
stone, putting him in a safer place while studying him to see what kind 
of danger he still poses.

Paul

J Ford wrote:

>What the hell?  Are you people really blind or what?  WHAT ABOUT THE 
>VICTIMS?  Where are your feelings for them?  Your support?  Your concern for 
>the rest of *their* lives, what's left of them?
>
>I could care less what happens to this guy in prison, especially a guy like 
>Coe or Sitler or even Jamin who REFUSE to acknowledge and truly come to 
>terms with what lives they have destroyed.  Truth is, a lot of the time 
>these guys are isolated in prison due to the threats against them.
>
>Would I like to see him tied and beaten?  No.  But a "country club" type of 
>institution is just not right.  Guaranteed his victims are not happy about 
>any of this either.
>
>
>J  :]
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>
>>From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
>>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan
>>Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 16:58:16 -0700
>>
>>The action that seems to have enraged you this much was the judge granting 
>>his request to avoid Spokane County lockup and spend a few weeks at a more 
>>humane facility.  He's known in Spokane as a legendary rapist, wouldn't it 
>>be overly cruel to make him spend time in lockup there where his own safety 
>>would be in jeopardy?
>>
>>Or would you rather we just tie him up by his toes and beat him with 
>>baseball bats until the time of his hearing?
>>
>>Unless I'm remembering wrong from when I was a child, he didn't kill 
>>anybody.  His mom tried  to, if I remember correctly, but he didn't.  He's 
>>spent a quarter of a century in prison as a known rapist.  I'm amazed he 
>>survived at all.  All the time that a normal person would spend building a 
>>family and a career was spent in a prison cell.  He's also a convicted 
>>felon upon release, a registered sex offender, and a notoriously infamous 
>>celebrity to boot.  Not to mention the fact that they are considering 
>>keeping him committed past his release date.  Isn't that enough?  Or do we 
>>have to make each and every request of his fall on deaf ears just in spite? 
>> There are people who get off easy for some things, yes, but I wouldn't 
>>count him as one of them.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>>J Ford wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>How dare you!  Have you lived through being raped, molested, almost 
>>>killed!?  Huh,have you?  Didn't think so.  So don't you dare assume you 
>>>know that murder is worse than living through the type of hell child 
>>>predators put their victims through.  YOU HAVE NO IDEA!  The person 
>>>murdered - their pain is over; the "survivor" of molestation/rape, etc. - 
>>>their pain continues on and on and on.  They never loose it - some learn 
>>>to live with it differently than others, some take the route of suicide.  
>>>A VAST majority of child victims are killed.
>>>
>>>According toe National Missing and Exploited Children's web site:
>>>
>>>"an estimated 797,500 children were reported missing; 58,200 children were 
>>>abducted by nonfamily members; 115 children were the victims of the most 
>>>serious, long-term nonfamily abductions called "stereotypical 
>>>kidnappings"; and 203,900 children were the victims of family abductions."
>>>
>>>THAT is a hell of a lot of kids missing and hurt.  You want to tell them 
>>>or their families that "its ok, at least you can't prove they've had the 
>>>worst happen to them - that they are dead."?  The worst is not knowing 
>>>where they are, are they safe, are they being tortured?
>>>
>>>There are many, many victims of rape and child molestation that would and 
>>>have taken death over living with what happened to them.  Suicide does not 
>>>mitigate or negate the seriousness of the originating crime of 
>>>molestation.  The fact that someone would say "you'll get over it - it was 
>>>only molestation vs. murder" or "molestation is not as bad as murder - you 
>>>lived through it" is what is asinine - and callous.
>>>
>>>Duncan is not "alleged" to be a multiple child molester - he IS a multiply 
>>>convicted and multiply charged child molester and killer.
>>>
>>>If you talk to Adam Walsh's father, John, or anyone else who works to 
>>>fight against child molesters they will tell you 9 x's out of 10, the perp 
>>>has been caught doing a "lesser" crime, but has committed numerous 
>>>extremely serious unknown ones.  Duncan is NOT unique - he just got 
>>>caught.
>>>
>>>In ref to Coe, he ASKED/PETITIONED/BEGGED the court to allow him to be 
>>>transferred to another facility - to get him out of Spokane.  It matters 
>>>little where that place is or that he MAY have ended up there eventually; 
>>>what matters is HE made the request and the court went with it:
>>>
>>>"Kevin Coe Gets Hearing Delay  September 6, 2006 By Associated Press
>>>
>>>Kevin Coe, convicted of one of the rapes that terrorized Spokane's South 
>>>Hill neighborhood a quarter-century ago, on Wednesday requested transfer 
>>>to a special prison for sexual predators to spend a seven-week delay in 
>>>the state's efforts to keep him in custody indefinitely.
>>>
>>>Spokane County Superior Court Judge Kathleen O'Connor on Wednesday granted 
>>>Coe's request to go to the special commitment center on McNeil Island and 
>>>agreed to the delay in the probable cause hearing to give his lawyers time 
>>>to study more than 66,000 pages of documents the state submitted in its 
>>>efforts to keep Coe in custody.
>>>
>>>Coe's attorney, Tim Trageser, said his client would like to spend the 
>>>delay at McNeil Island, in Puget Sound between Tacoma and Olympia, rather 
>>>than the Spokane County Jail.
>>>
>>>As a civil facility, McNeil Island has much better living arrangements 
>>>than a crowded county jail, Trageser said."
>>>
>>>And yes, victimization does occur in prison - BUT NOT TO CHILDREN by 
>>>molesters.  People don't want to run the risk they will become a victim in 
>>>prison, they should not do a crime that puts them in that position.  
>>>(Before you say it - YES there are innocent people sent to jail or prison 
>>>and YES they can become victims in jail or prison.)
>>>
>>>And your claim that there is only one "sex offender treatment provider" 
>>>and they are in Clarkston is false.  There are MANY in the area and Sitler 
>>>is actually being treated by TWO providers, one in Pullman and one in 
>>>Clarkston.  And to the Sheriff's chagrin, his FAMILY members are taking 
>>>him to both.  Read the file - you'll see there is a letter there from the 
>>>LCSD that specifically requests anyone BUT family members take Sitler to 
>>>his "treatment" and the court, thus far, has ignored that request.
>>>
>>>It irks me to no end that a defense lawyer, ANY, continues to claim they 
>>>know what a victim of their client's feels or the victim of any crime 
>>>feels.  Until you are on the receiving end of that crime - you have no 
>>>idea.
>>>
>>>J  :]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
>>>>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 
>>>>CoetransferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
>>>>Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 17:24:27 -0700
>>>>
>>>>Duncan is alleged to be a serial killer as well as a child molester.  You
>>>>claim he's close to average for a sex offender and then claim I'm being
>>>>obtuse?  Please! That's a ridiculous position to take.  No, it's asinine,
>>>>absolute nonsense.
>>>>
>>>>Please do not compare murder to molestation and claim they're the same.
>>>>Most people can tell they're two separate crimes, with the former being
>>>>worse.
>>>>
>>>>I don't think the only practice providing treatment to sex offenders, 
>>>>which
>>>>is based in Clarkston, would come here to provide treatment to one 
>>>>person.
>>>>If I'm wrong, which is possible, then there would be no reason to let 
>>>>Sitler
>>>>out for treatment.  If they won't come here, then this is a reason to 
>>>>allow
>>>>him to go to Clarkston for treatment.
>>>>
>>>>It's obtuse to claim Coe is having his way when he is going to the 
>>>>facility
>>>>where the state wishes to keep him what appears to be the rest of his 
>>>>life,
>>>>in order to prepare for the hearing that will determine his future.
>>>>
>>>>Actually, prison provides numerous opportunities to victimize others.
>>>>
>>>>Sunil
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>>>>>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe
>>>>>transferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
>>>>>Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 16:05:46 -0700
>>>>>
>>>>>Ok, now you're being purposefully obtuse.  There is no way I can say,
>>>>>without taking a poll, what provider would be willing, or not, to go to
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>jail and offer treatment.  What I can say is that the ones I have talked
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>to
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>in a casual manner, have said they have never been asked by the court,
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>they
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>have just been asked or ordered to provide the "treatment" and told the
>>>>>prisoner will come to them.  And no, I will not provide those names as
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>you
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>know very well that confidentiality prohibits me from doing that.
>>>>>
>>>>>Coe, through his attorney, requested that he be transferred out of
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>Spokane
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>to a specific facility.  It was COE's choice and the court went with it.
>>>>>
>>>>>Duncan is more along the lines of the average molester than you'd like 
>>>>>to
>>>>>admit.  Difference is, he got caught.  Whether they kill their victims 
>>>>>or
>>>>>kill what childhood the victim may have had, the violator has committed 
>>>>>a
>>>>>deadly sin and should be punished accordingly.  Penny's idea of
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>sentencing
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>them to 25-life right out of the gate makes more sense than 15, with 
>>>>>time
>>>>>off for "good" behavior.  How else are they gonna act in prison than
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>"good"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>since there is no opportunity to victimize anyone?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>J  :]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
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