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Why would it be an either/or type of situation? I think everyone,
within certain constraints, should be treated humanely. Even border
cases. To do anything else is barbarism. These are the same reasons I
think it's criminal that we torture detainees.<br>
<br>
That's not saying we should serve him tea and crumpets, but moving him
out of what could likely be a dangerous situation seems to me to be the
civilized way to cope with this. Likely it's killing two birds with
one stone, putting him in a safer place while studying him to see what
kind of danger he still poses.<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
J Ford wrote:
<blockquote cite="midBAY105-F172F147B9D283787854CC1AF2A0@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">What the hell? Are you people really blind or what? WHAT ABOUT THE
VICTIMS? Where are your feelings for them? Your support? Your concern for
the rest of *their* lives, what's left of them?
I could care less what happens to this guy in prison, especially a guy like
Coe or Sitler or even Jamin who REFUSE to acknowledge and truly come to
terms with what lives they have destroyed. Truth is, a lot of the time
these guys are isolated in prison due to the threats against them.
Would I like to see him tied and beaten? No. But a "country club" type of
institution is just not right. Guaranteed his victims are not happy about
any of this either.
J :]
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">From: Paul Rumelhart <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:godshatter@yahoo.com"><godshatter@yahoo.com></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe, Sitler and Duncan
Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2006 16:58:16 -0700
The action that seems to have enraged you this much was the judge granting
his request to avoid Spokane County lockup and spend a few weeks at a more
humane facility. He's known in Spokane as a legendary rapist, wouldn't it
be overly cruel to make him spend time in lockup there where his own safety
would be in jeopardy?
Or would you rather we just tie him up by his toes and beat him with
baseball bats until the time of his hearing?
Unless I'm remembering wrong from when I was a child, he didn't kill
anybody. His mom tried to, if I remember correctly, but he didn't. He's
spent a quarter of a century in prison as a known rapist. I'm amazed he
survived at all. All the time that a normal person would spend building a
family and a career was spent in a prison cell. He's also a convicted
felon upon release, a registered sex offender, and a notoriously infamous
celebrity to boot. Not to mention the fact that they are considering
keeping him committed past his release date. Isn't that enough? Or do we
have to make each and every request of his fall on deaf ears just in spite?
There are people who get off easy for some things, yes, but I wouldn't
count him as one of them.
Paul
J Ford wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">How dare you! Have you lived through being raped, molested, almost
killed!? Huh,have you? Didn't think so. So don't you dare assume you
know that murder is worse than living through the type of hell child
predators put their victims through. YOU HAVE NO IDEA! The person
murdered - their pain is over; the "survivor" of molestation/rape, etc. -
their pain continues on and on and on. They never loose it - some learn
to live with it differently than others, some take the route of suicide.
A VAST majority of child victims are killed.
According toe National Missing and Exploited Children's web site:
"an estimated 797,500 children were reported missing; 58,200 children were
abducted by nonfamily members; 115 children were the victims of the most
serious, long-term nonfamily abductions called "stereotypical
kidnappings"; and 203,900 children were the victims of family abductions."
THAT is a hell of a lot of kids missing and hurt. You want to tell them
or their families that "its ok, at least you can't prove they've had the
worst happen to them - that they are dead."? The worst is not knowing
where they are, are they safe, are they being tortured?
There are many, many victims of rape and child molestation that would and
have taken death over living with what happened to them. Suicide does not
mitigate or negate the seriousness of the originating crime of
molestation. The fact that someone would say "you'll get over it - it was
only molestation vs. murder" or "molestation is not as bad as murder - you
lived through it" is what is asinine - and callous.
Duncan is not "alleged" to be a multiple child molester - he IS a multiply
convicted and multiply charged child molester and killer.
If you talk to Adam Walsh's father, John, or anyone else who works to
fight against child molesters they will tell you 9 x's out of 10, the perp
has been caught doing a "lesser" crime, but has committed numerous
extremely serious unknown ones. Duncan is NOT unique - he just got
caught.
In ref to Coe, he ASKED/PETITIONED/BEGGED the court to allow him to be
transferred to another facility - to get him out of Spokane. It matters
little where that place is or that he MAY have ended up there eventually;
what matters is HE made the request and the court went with it:
"Kevin Coe Gets Hearing Delay September 6, 2006 By Associated Press
Kevin Coe, convicted of one of the rapes that terrorized Spokane's South
Hill neighborhood a quarter-century ago, on Wednesday requested transfer
to a special prison for sexual predators to spend a seven-week delay in
the state's efforts to keep him in custody indefinitely.
Spokane County Superior Court Judge Kathleen O'Connor on Wednesday granted
Coe's request to go to the special commitment center on McNeil Island and
agreed to the delay in the probable cause hearing to give his lawyers time
to study more than 66,000 pages of documents the state submitted in its
efforts to keep Coe in custody.
Coe's attorney, Tim Trageser, said his client would like to spend the
delay at McNeil Island, in Puget Sound between Tacoma and Olympia, rather
than the Spokane County Jail.
As a civil facility, McNeil Island has much better living arrangements
than a crowded county jail, Trageser said."
And yes, victimization does occur in prison - BUT NOT TO CHILDREN by
molesters. People don't want to run the risk they will become a victim in
prison, they should not do a crime that puts them in that position.
(Before you say it - YES there are innocent people sent to jail or prison
and YES they can become victims in jail or prison.)
And your claim that there is only one "sex offender treatment provider"
and they are in Clarkston is false. There are MANY in the area and Sitler
is actually being treated by TWO providers, one in Pullman and one in
Clarkston. And to the Sheriff's chagrin, his FAMILY members are taking
him to both. Read the file - you'll see there is a letter there from the
LCSD that specifically requests anyone BUT family members take Sitler to
his "treatment" and the court, thus far, has ignored that request.
It irks me to no end that a defense lawyer, ANY, continues to claim they
know what a victim of their client's feels or the victim of any crime
feels. Until you are on the receiving end of that crime - you have no
idea.
J :]
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sunilramalingam@hotmail.com"><sunilramalingam@hotmail.com></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020]
CoetransferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 17:24:27 -0700
Duncan is alleged to be a serial killer as well as a child molester. You
claim he's close to average for a sex offender and then claim I'm being
obtuse? Please! That's a ridiculous position to take. No, it's asinine,
absolute nonsense.
Please do not compare murder to molestation and claim they're the same.
Most people can tell they're two separate crimes, with the former being
worse.
I don't think the only practice providing treatment to sex offenders,
which
is based in Clarkston, would come here to provide treatment to one
person.
If I'm wrong, which is possible, then there would be no reason to let
Sitler
out for treatment. If they won't come here, then this is a reason to
allow
him to go to Clarkston for treatment.
It's obtuse to claim Coe is having his way when he is going to the
facility
where the state wishes to keep him what appears to be the rest of his
life,
in order to prepare for the hearing that will determine his future.
Actually, prison provides numerous opportunities to victimize others.
Sunil
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">From: "J Ford" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:privatejf32@hotmail.com"><privatejf32@hotmail.com></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com">vision2020@moscow.com</a>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coe
transferredtospecialcommitmentcenteronMcNeilIsland
Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2006 16:05:46 -0700
Ok, now you're being purposefully obtuse. There is no way I can say,
without taking a poll, what provider would be willing, or not, to go to
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">the
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">jail and offer treatment. What I can say is that the ones I have talked
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">to
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">in a casual manner, have said they have never been asked by the court,
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">they
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">have just been asked or ordered to provide the "treatment" and told the
prisoner will come to them. And no, I will not provide those names as
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">you
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">know very well that confidentiality prohibits me from doing that.
Coe, through his attorney, requested that he be transferred out of
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">Spokane
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">to a specific facility. It was COE's choice and the court went with it.
Duncan is more along the lines of the average molester than you'd like
to
admit. Difference is, he got caught. Whether they kill their victims
or
kill what childhood the victim may have had, the violator has committed
a
deadly sin and should be punished accordingly. Penny's idea of
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">sentencing
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">them to 25-life right out of the gate makes more sense than 15, with
time
off for "good" behavior. How else are they gonna act in prison than
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">"good"
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">since there is no opportunity to victimize anyone?
J :]
</pre>
</blockquote>
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