[Vision2020] Dale has a backbone? & George W. Vader?
Steven Simmons
lowman at lowbatteries.com
Thu May 26 20:55:10 PDT 2005
I think you have to worry when you make a movie about a stereotypically
deceitful, evil emperor destroying an age-old republic and establishing
military rule, and people think you are insulting their president.
Just a thought.
Steven Simmons
tbertruss at aol.com wrote:
>
> Joan et. al.
>
> I ignored Dale's blog for a long time thinking to even respond to some
> of the crap there not worth it. But his web site keeps coming up on
> V2020 as a topic of discussion.
>
> There has been some controversy about the new Star Wars movie
> regarding what some think is thinly veiled political jabs at the Bush
> administration. Lucas denies this was his intention.
>
> George W. Vader?
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20050522/ts_alt_afp/afpentertainmentfilm_050522202005
>
> Ted Moffett
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joan Opyr <joanopyr at earthlink.net>
> To: Vision2020 Moscow <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> Sent: Thu, 26 May 2005 15:11:14 -0700
> Subject: [Vision2020] Dale has a backbone? Where? Is that it wiggling
> in the Rosauer's fish counter?
>
> Hello Ted,
>
> First, I read the article you posted on election fraud, Ted -- the one
> Dale took as evidence of your paranoia. I, too, had hoped that it
> would stimulate discussion, but I didn't start the ball rolling
> because I quite simply found the facts too grim. I'm no political
> ostrich, as most here will attest, but good grief -- our last two
> presidential elections have been profoundly depressing for the
> democrats (note the small "d") among us. This will mark me forever as
> a geek, but there's a line in the new Star Wars movie that just about
> sums it up: Padme, watching the galactic republic devolve into a
> monarchy under the cover of endless war, remarks something along the
> lines of "Thus dies Liberty, to a thunderous applause."
>
> Dale is disingenuous. He'! s manipulative. He's unprofessional,
> discourteous, he is shallow and a wimp. Yes, a wimp. Despite his
> claims to have acquired a backbone in the Navy, Dale chooses to
> "debate" us not on Vision 2020, among the elbowing, jostling
> hoi-polloi, but from the safe distance of his self-moderated weblog.
> There, Dale sets the agenda and controls the discourse. He's never in
> danger of having his ass handed to him on a plate, as are the active
> participants of Vision 2020, myself included. This danger of being
> shown up, of being corrected, of having to admit to being wrong, or
> losing an argument, or making a mistake is the reason why Doug Wilson
> and Doug Jones, et al., left us in late 2003, the Winter of Their
> Discontent. They found that they were losing too many arguments making
> too few converts. Vision 2020 was not good hunting ground for
> lock-step thinkers.
>
> If! you'll all excuse my language, Dale is a classic chickenshit. He
> nitpicks from a safe distance, tossing little bits of gravel at the
> big boys and girls. It's clear that he reads 2020 religiously, and
> then posts like mad about what he encounters here, but he does this in
> the guise of the tattle-tale tit. Dale nitpicks and runs away, living
> to pick another day. Backbone my fanny. Dale snatched a tentacle off a
> passing jellyfish and stuffed that wiggling length of slime down where
> his vertebrae ought to be.
>
> For all his faults (and they are many), Donovan, Dale's designated Roy
> Cohn, remains on Vision 2020. He fawns all over Dale on right-mind.us
> (have you considered a good tongue-scraping, Donovan? preferably with
> bleach?) but he hasn't run away or hidden his ignorant belligerence
> behind Mama Courtney's skirts.&nbs! p;
>
> Which isn't to say that I read Donovan's posts -- 15 per day and
> counting -- because I don't. I have other hobbies, like breathing.
>
> Joan Opyr/Auntie Establishment
> www.joanopyr.com <http://www.joanopyr.com>
>
>
> On May 26, 2005, at 1:57 PM, Tbertruss at aol.com
> <mailto:Tbertruss%40aol.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Hello Julie:
> >
> > Anyone on the web can go to:
> >
> > http://vision2020.moscow.com
> >
> > and see the archives of Vision2020 which should have every
> Vision2020 > post for years back accessible.
> >
> > Here are the first two hits from a simple Google web search using my
> > name "ted moffett"& nbsp;
> >
> > Ted Moffett on Pacifism
> > ... Ted Moffett on Pacifism. Ted Moffett writes:. What amazes me,
> has > always amazed
> > me, since I was a teeny tiny person, is how this moral directive is
> > so ...
> > right-mind.us/archive/2004/11/04/560.aspx - 43k - Cached - >
> Similar pages
> >
> >
> >
> > Ted Moffett's Paranoia
> > ... Ted Moffett's Paranoia. Ted Moffet posted an article called “I >
> smell a Rat”.
> > Ted, how do you reply to Anne Applebaum's post about having faith in
> > ATMs, ...&nb! sp;
> > right-mind.us/archive/2004/11/17/678.aspx - 42k - Cached - >
> Similar pages
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > As you can see, both of these hits are from Dale's web site where he
> > used Vision2020 posts I authored to create or attempt to create >
> discussion on his site.
> >
> > I can only conclude Dale is desperate to draw others to his site, so
> > he must steal controversy, as it were, from Vision2020.
> >
> > Below is a forwarded Vision2020 post I sent recently about Dale >
> Courtney's web site that generated zero comments on the Vision2020 >
> list.
> >
> > Subj: [Vision2020] Dale Courtney's Oversimplifications
> > Date: 5/21/2005 9:48:21 PM Pacific Daylight Time
> > From: Tbertruss at aol.com <mailto:Tbertruss%40aol.com>
> > To: dmcourtn at moscow.com <mailto:dmcourtn%40moscow.com>,
> vision2020 at moscow.com <mailto:vision2020%40moscow.com>
> > Sent from the Internet (Details)
> >
> > Mr. Dale Courtney et. al.
> >
> > Shortly after last fall's presidential election, I posted to V2020
> an > article about the possibility of voting fraud and/or tampering.
> I > consider this a nonpartisan issue that anyone who cares in the >
> slightest bit about the integrity of the electoral process would wish
> > to see explored and exposed. I merely posted the article, without >
> writing any text, just signing my name.
> >
> > So how does Dale Courtney respond? He places on his web site a post
> > in bold font announcing "Ted Moffett's Paranoia," suggesting that I
> > respond to another article about computer systems and paper trails.
>>
>> Regardless of the facts and arguments on the issue of computerized >
> voting, what kind of morality is behind placing on a public web site a
> > derogatory statement about the psychology of someone you don't know
> > who was merely making information available about a critical issue?
> > If Dale did not post the statement in question, perhaps he needs to
> > moderate the content on his website? But my best guess is that this
> > statement was authored by him.
>>
>> When I first discovered this juvenile and rude conduct on his web >
> site, I decided to ignore it.
>>
>> But today I found more nonsense on Mr. Courtney's web site. >
> Apparently, he feels a need to lump together under the words "left! "
> > and/or "lefty" a large group of people with widely varying view s on
> > government. Dale wrote in answer to a Joan Opry V2020 post:
>>
>> "First, I'm not Faul, or Stigmatta, or Fiat, or... That's not me. No
> > need. I don't play "hide-and-seek" games. I sign everything that's >
> mine. 20 years in the navy teaches one to have a backbone/spine. So >
> don't assign the methods of the Left (Ivan Brewski, Art Deco, JeanC, >
> Captain Kirker, R2 Privacy, Shelly, Tbertruss, DPQ, hayfields, LRR, >
> Nebar, Wocsom, ! etc) onto someone who behaves right (pun intended).
> Go > look somewhere else for your bogeymen.
>>
>> As I said previously, I do find it the height of hypocrisy that the >
> Left doesn't get bent out of shape when Lefties are anonymous. But let
> > someone they don't agree with try and be anonymous? Ah! The >
> intolerance of the Tolerant. I've come to expect nothing less."
>>
>> First off, Mr. Courtney, you need to follow the V2020 list more >
> closely if you are going to assume all those on the "left" are one >
> group that marches in lock step. Tom Hansen, no doubt in your mind >
> one of those nefarious members of the "left," once chided on V2020 >
> yours truly for not signing a V2020 post. So in fact on V2020 a >
> "lefty" chided a fellow "lefty" (this designa! tion is only in Mr. >
> Courtney's mind, because I do not describe myself as a "lefty" or a >
> member of the "left") for not signing a V2020 post. I argued once on
> > V2020 that perhaps not signing a V2020 post with a "real" name can
> in > some cases be justified. Bill London, another individual I
> suspect > you would label "leftist," argued otherwise.
>>
>> I have occasionally not signed a V2020 post when using my AOL e-mail
> > address "tbertruss," but I nearly always do. I am not trying to
> hide > behind "tbertruss." Everyone who follows V2020 knows that "Art
> Deco" > is Wayne Fox, and "Nebar" is Jasper Nance. The V2020 posts by
> these > individuals do not represent a deliberate attempt to hide
> their > identity, as Dale Courtney implied.
>>
>> "Faul," "Sigmatta" and "Fiat" were attempting to hide their >
> identities from the V2020 list, as far as I know.
>>
>> Who is looking for "bogeymen," as Dale Courtney wrote in response to
> > Joan Opry? It seems Dale Courtney's stereotyping oversimplifying >
> views of this large and varied group of individuals he regards as >
> being members of the "left" qualify these "Lefty's" as his own >
> "bogeymen."
>>
>> Perhaps Mr. Courtney is so enamored of marching in lock step >
> utilizing a form of "group think" that he projects this manner of >
> thinking onto those he imagines oppose him.
>>
>> I will let the immortal words of Dale Courtney written to Joan Opry >
> on Mr. Courtney's web site express what I think about his statement >
> "Ted Moffett's Paranoia:"
>>
>> "So instead of trying to project your bias and venom on someone you >
> don't know, why don't you go do something useful."
>>
>> Links to the info on Dale Courtney's web site mentioned above:
>>
>> http://right-mind.us/archive/2004/11/17/678.aspx
>>
>> http://right-mind.us/archive/2005/01/27/1375.aspx ! ;
>>
>> http://right-mind.us/archive/2005/01/27/1377.aspx
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> V2020 Post by Ted Moffett
>> _____________________________________________________
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> lank>
>> <http://www.fsr.net>mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> <mailto:Vision2020%40moscow.com>
>> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
>>
> Joan Opyr/Auntie Establishment
> ! www.joanopyr.com <http://www.joanopyr.com>&n bsp;
>
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> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>------------------------------------------------------------------------
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