[Vision2020] RE: The Key to Helping Downtown Moscow Thrive
Pat Kraut
pkraut at moscow.com
Tue Jul 12 09:41:23 PDT 2005
I am stuck in the position of agreeing with Art Deco!! Truth is much stranger than fiction any day!
I am so frustrated with all this hiring of outside experts and than not using the info they bring us. If we are spending all the money on reports we certainly will not have the funds to do anything good that we want to do. We can do this stuff ourselves and stop wasting money on outside reports by outside 'experts'.
PK
----- Original Message -----
From: Art Deco
To: Vision 2020
Cc: JoAnn Mack ; Nancy Chaney ; Peg Hamlett ; Linda Pall ; Marshall Comstock ; John Dickinson ; Jon Kimberling
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 7:49 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] RE: The Key to Helping Downtown Moscow Thrive
Barbara,
Thank you for the information about previous work on a downtown Moscow plan. It was most informative. Perhaps you can post a précis of the major elements and goals of that plan.
Perhaps also you and/or some open-minded city council members (not an oxymoron, I hope) can answer the following questions:
After spending $50,000 and lots of effort on the part of citizens, businesses, political figures, and governmental staff:
Why has action been delayed for more than three years after the downtown plan was completed on the city comprehensive plan?
Has not some of the information gathered and recommendations made in this plan more than 3 years ago become stale?
Since the issue of allowing educational institutions and other possibly counter-productive uses in the downtown core is one with great consequences for the future of Moscow, shouldn't the current city zoning ordinances be updated only after the comp plan is updated and clear goals are set for the downtown core and its relationship to the rest of the city?
I am sure there are a large number of citizens (residents, patrons, users, visitors, etc) that want to know why the normal city planning processes are not being followed and what effort, if any, is being made to get them back on track instead of doing planning/zoning business in a crisis driven, piecemeal fashion.
Wayne A. Fox
1009 Karen Lane
PO Box 9421
Moscow, ID 83843
(208) 882-7975
waf at moscow.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Barbara Richardson Crouch
To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020
Cc: Linda Pall ; Nancy Chaney ; John Dickinson ; Peg Hamlett
Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 2:05 PM
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] RE: The Key to Helping Downtown Moscow Thrive
Everyone,
If you do not remember, Moscow and the University did complete a Downtown Plan. The Committee was the CRC and was a part of the LEDC. We solicited for consultants, hired a group and actually received and the City Council accepted a short term plan from them - they felt the long-range plan was too grandiose. This plan was the basis of the Downtown Grant and the activities happening in Friendship Square. The plan cost a minimum of $50,000 and the LEDC/Chamber used the plan to receive a grant from Verizon to hire an interim Downtown Coordinator until a BID could be done. The implementation of the Plan was left to the Chamber. The LEDC's participation ended after we supervised the interim Coordinator. In fact, First Step was kind enough to give the Downtown Association a website and free hosting. This all happened in the last three years (3). There is also a section that talks about zoning changes in the Downtown. If you would like this section (it is about 40 pages) just e-mail me and I will send it to you.
There was lots of public input sought, including a tenant at the Ren Fair and a table at the Latah County fair. The General Public Input was solicited in 2001 and 2002. Downtown Property owners and Business people met for almost a year before public input.
Moscow plans to start the public process for the Comprehensive Plan re-write this fall as part of the New Cities Initative. I would like to see the community focus on writing a good solid, 20-30 year Comprehensive Plan.
Barbara Crouch
-----Original Message-----
From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com]On Behalf Of Art Deco
Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 9:48 AM
To: Vision 2020
Cc: Nancy Chaney; John Dickinson; Peg Hamlett; JoAnn Mack; Linda Pall
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] RE:The Key to Helping Downtown Moscow Thrive
Debbie, et al,
I think the Moscow City Council is off track in dealing with current downtown zoning and allied issues. Changing or not changing the zoning ordinance at this time without a discussion of larger issues will only make a bigger, more divisive mess.
First, through a series of methods soliciting public and business input, a vision for what the downtown area should be like in the future and how it relates to the city as a whole needs to be discussed and decided upon.
That vision and various ways of achieving it then needs to become part of the Moscow Comprehensive Plan.
The part of plan that can be implemented through changes in the zoning ordinance should then codified in the ordinance. Other Comp Plan elements not specific to the zoning ordinance, e.g. promoting downtown development and use, creating interest and encouraging capital investment, should be rigorously micro-planned and executed.
It does not take much Googling for the non-professional to learn how hard it is. for example, to maintain and enhance the downtown core as a viable business district for cities the size of Moscow. There are a few success stories and many, many failures. The success stories result from careful, public involved planning and a "let's do what's best for the community" attitude on behalf of the majority of citizens.
Whither Moscow? Its time for a vision, not just an accommodating handjob on the current zoning ordinance.
Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
deco at moscow.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Debbie Gray" <dgray at uidaho.edu>
To: <thansen at moscow.com>; "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 11:16 PM
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] RE:The Key to Helping Downtown Moscow Thrive
>I think a thorough economic impact analysis might be quite enlightening.
> It is NOT impossible to prove whether or not NSA has had an economic
> effect on the downtown. Your in-depth case study of you preferring to
> drive 8 miles to pullman instead of walking an extra block to downtown is
> quite interesting but proves nothing. And I am truly curous how you know
> that all the cars hogging the downtown parking are NSA students? Do these
> cars also wear uniforms?
>
> And how can you demand evidence from Donovan("Arnold, what evidence have
> you got that you can share to substantiate this claim? What quantifiable
> measure can you show us to reflect increased revenue in the central
> business district as a direct result of NSA's presence?) and then state
> that "I could easily substantiate that revenue has been lost as a result
> simply by the lack of available parking during the week" and then give
> your only substantiating evidence as 'I, tom hansen, have, in the past,
> driven to pullman to purchase something instead of purchasing something
> downtown since parking spots were occupied by NSA students' (to summarize)
>
> I am curious (and have no idea) how long the buildings that NSA occupy
> stood vacant? Where are the businesses lining up to get into downtown
> spaces? Aren't there at least 2 vacant building there now? (where the
> bridal shop was and that funky semi-antique store next to wild women
> traders) What about all the other vacant buildings around town?
>
>
> Debbie
>
> On Thu, 7 Jul 2005 thansen at moscow.com wrote:
>
>> It is nearly impossible to prove a negative, Ms. Gray.
>>
>> However, I have found myself driving the extra few miles (to Pullman) on
>> occasion due to a general lack of parking in the downtown Moscow area,
>> parking taken up by NSA students.
>>
>> The question then becomes:
>>
>> How many others have made the same decision (resulting in lost revenue)?
>>
>> Tom
>>
>>
>> > OK I'll bite. Let's see quanitifiable evidence that revenue has
>> > been lost. And who has lost the revenue? Or has revenue
>> > increased? And who has benefited from an increase? And how is
>> > that being measured specifically?
>> >
>> > On 7 Jul 2005 at 12:18, Tom Hansen wrote:
>> > > I could easily substantiate that revenue has been lost as a
>> > > result simply by the lack of available parking during the
>> > week.
>> >
>> >
>> > _____________________________________________________
>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> > http://www.fsr.net
>> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------
>> This message was sent by First Step Internet.
>> http://www.fsr.com/
>>
>>
>>
>
> Debbie
>
> %^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%
> Debbie Gray dgray at uidaho.edu
> We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned,
> so as to have the life that is waiting for us." --Joseph Campbell
> %^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%^%
>
> _____________________________________________________
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> ¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
>
>
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