[Vision2020] Yes, I'm proud to be a liberal

[Paul Rumelhart]

I take your point that Social Security is not welfare.  How many people, do
you suppose, would pay into Social Security if they weren't required
(forced) to?  How many companies would have the cash reserves to handle
such a program on their own?  Would it be profitable enough to justify the
expense?  I still think it takes a large government to administer such a
program for all citizens.  Not to mention that people in my generation
(possibly) and the generation behind me (quite probably) won't get their
money back once the whole thing goes tits up, as they seem to be projecting.

Paul


On Fri, Aug 1, 2014 at 4:51 PM, Ted Moffett <starbliss at gmail.com> wrote:

> More misleading statements on Vision2020...
>
> Social Security is not "welfare" in the sense of a government wholly
> taxpayer supported hand out, that does not require someone to pay into the
> program to receive the benefit, such as the SNAP so called "food stamps"
> program, which anyone of low enough income who qualifies can receive,
> regardless of their tax contributions during their life.
>
> To call Social Security "welfare" is common among libertarian
> anti-government propagandists who would love to see Social Security
> dismantled.
>
> Workers pay into the Social Security system during their working life, and
> the amount of the SS benefit they receive is contingent upon the amount of
> their contribution.  Some people pay into SS for decades, and die too young
> to ever see a benefit!  Others receive a benefit but still die too young to
> get back their contributions.  It is true that if someone has a very long
> lifespan, they may receive in SS benefits more than they contributed.
>
> ------------------------------------------
> Vision2020 Post: Ted Moffett
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 1, 2014 at 7:57 AM, Paul Rumelhart <paul.rumelhart at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I was thinking more generally of welfare (medicaid, medicare, social
>> security, unemployment, etc).  They are extremely useful programs when
>> needed, they are often abused, and they require a large federal government
>> to sustain.  I wouldn't be so down on the idea of a large state if it
>> didn't think that it had the right to spy on it's citizens and assassinate
>> people without due process and if it didn't think it had to police the
>> world.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 11:05 AM, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Paul Rumelhart argues:
>>>
>>> "Being a statist is what I have a problem with.  Basically making the
>>> state too powerful and people too dependent upon it."
>>>
>>> Do you mean state-expanded Medicaid?   Public schools?  Increased
>>> minimum wage?
>>>
>>> Details please.
>>>
>>> Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .
>>>
>>> "Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)
>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com <http://www.moscowcares.com/>
>>>
>>> Tom Hansen
>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>
>>> "There's room at the top they are telling you still.
>>> But first you must learn how to smile as you kill,
>>> If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>>>
>>> - John Lennon
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 31, 2014, at 10:58 AM, Paul Rumelhart <paul.rumelhart at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Being a statist is what I have a problem with.  Basically making the
>>> state too powerful and people too dependent upon it.
>>>
>>>
>>
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