[Vision2020] Why do we need immigration reform?

Mon Jul 29 13:53:17 PDT 2013

<You are for a working slave class.>
How so?  If I'm not mistaken, Washington Apple growers pay apple pickers by the barrel.  This isn't slavery, they're being cash compensated for their output.  FWIW, I'm not in favor for a working 'slave class'.

<I don't want that in the United States, it is unconstitutional and immoral.>
It's not unconstitutional or this could be easily proven in our court system.  Is it immoral?  I guess the argument could be made for or against.  These folks are coming across the border in search of better opportunities than are available in their homeland, aren't they?  If so, then you could make the case that building a fence to lock them within their current situation that lacks opportunity is more immoral, couldn't you?

<I don't believe in working classes of people based on race, or nation of origin.>
Nor do I so I don't think should be asked on application forms other than as 'optional' information to be used for statistical data.

<I think the US should come up with a clear, fair, and realistic path to citizenship.>
I believe we have this already.  For the most part it goes visa to green card to citizenship through the USCIS.  The system probably is not set up yet to handle those who enter the country illegally.  I supposed that's what all the bellyaching from both parties and maybe the UFW is all about.

<"But I also don't see those engaging in 'hard labor' as pushing for 'livible wages' or the right to vote." You must have your eyes closed then.>
This is why I wrote 'Why do we need immigration reform?' in the subject block.  I'm interested in 'opening my eyes' to what exactly the problems are from all sides of what is now not working for businesses, permanent residents, legal guests, illegal aliens, political parties, etc., and what the effects by any change that are being proposed.

If you have any links you could forward, these would be much appreciated.  However, based on what you've written so far, you don't seem to know much about the subject yourself.

-Scott

Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2013 10:12:23 -0700
From: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Why do we need immigration reform?
To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com; vision2020 at moscow.com

Scott, You are for a working slave class. I don't want that in the United States, it is unconstitutional and immoral. I do not believe in taxation without representation. I don't believe in working classes of people based on race, or nation of origin. I think the US should come up with a clear, fair, and realistic path to citizenship. "But I also don't see those engaging in 'hard labor' as pushing for 'livible wages' or the right to vote." You must have your eyes closed then.  Donovan J. Arnold
        From: Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
 To: Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>; viz <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
 Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 11:16 AM
 Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Why do we need immigration reform?

<So you want a return of slavery?>No.  I'm asking what are the problems presently with the status quo and asking for a justification of why any of it needs to be 'reformed'.<Hard labor without a liveable wage and no right to vote?>I don't want this.  But I also don't see those engaging in 'hard labor' as pushing for 'livible wages' or the right to vote.  If we're talking about migrant farm workers, they are represented in some fashion I think by the UFW.  Also, I believe they're getting more opportunity in the US even being 'undocumented' than would be getting in their native land.  Otherwise, they would just go back home.<Taxation without any representation?>How so?  Green Carders =
 United States Permanent Residents.  They are taxed at the same rates as full citizens.  Do you think they should be not taxed in any form since they don't have voting rights?  I don't think so.  They have the option to pursue full citizenship to get voting rights if they so choose.<Why don't we instead make it so millionaires cannot vote, run for office, or donate to any campaigns?>Because this would be unconstitutional.-ScottDate: Sun, 28 Jul 2013 11:03:21 -0700From: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.comSubject: Re: [Vision2020] Why do we need immigration reform?To: vision2020 at moscow.com; scooterd408 at hotmail.comSo you want a return of slavery? Hard labor without a liveable wage and no right to vote? Taxation without any representation? Why don't we instead make it so millionaires cannot vote, run for office, or donate to any campaigns? 
Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android

                                From:

                            Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>;                            

                                To:

                            viz <vision2020 at moscow.com>;                                                                                                     

                                Subject:

                            [Vision2020] Why do we need immigration reform?                            

                                Sent:

                            Sun, Jul 28, 2013 5:53:31 PM                            

                                        Hi all,I haven't followed the brouhaha regarding immigration reform.  What exactly are the problems that are at issue?  We already have a vast array of student and work visas that could be leveraged IMO.  Beyond that, it's obvious that the more immigrants that achieve full citizenship will be voting for the Democrats.  Thus, a good middle ground would be a path to Green Card which provides most rights except for voting rights.  Green Carders might like that even better since they'd not need to be burdened by the civic duty of sitting on a jury.-Scott 		 	   		  

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