[Vision2020] Happy gun violence day!

Gary Crabtree jampot at roadrunner.com
Mon Jan 21 16:53:47 PST 2013


http://video.today.msnbc.msn.com/today/50208495#50208495

"...certifiably crazy conspiracy anti-government birther bloggers?"

g

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Saundra Lund" <v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm>
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2013 2:53 PM
To: "Gary Crabtree" <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com>
Cc: "vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Happy gun violence day!

> Gary, if you personally want to believe certifiably crazy conspiracy
> anti-government birther bloggers instead of those like law enforcement
> and other first responders who were actually there, and the MEs who
> examined the victims, knock yourself out.
>
> But to try to present the baseless unhinged rantings of the lunatic
> fringe as factual rightly completely destroys any credibility you ever
> hoped to have amongst rational and sane people.
>
> Next, you'll be posting that the Sandy Hook Elementary School tragedy
> didn't really happen & was nothing more than a hoax perpetuated by the
> illegitimate president & his anti-gun minions. Those families who lost
> their beloved children are just actors.
>
> Here's a hint.  When the men in the white coats come to your door, do
> perhaps the first sane thing you've done in years:  LET THEM IN!
> Planet Earth invites your long overdue return to sanity.
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 21, 2013, at 01:35 PM, Gary Crabtree wrote:
>> What puts the icing on the the let's ban assault weapons cake is the fact
>> that The AR was not used at Newtown. The rifle was left in the the little
>> psychopath's carand was not used at the school. The push to ban a
>> particularly disliked type of firearm is pure opportunism.
>>
>> g
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 21, 2013 at 12:06 PM, Sunil Ramalingam <
>> sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >  Paul,
>> >
>> > You say, 'The sad fact is that if the assault weapons ban had been in
>> > place, Newtown would have happened anyway.'
>> >
>> > How is this a fact? Do you have evidence that this young man would have
>> > had the same access to the weapon if it were not in his home?
>> >
>> > How is this not just your opinion?
>> >
>> > Sunil
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> > Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 11:39:56 -0800
>> > From: godshatter at yahoo.com
>> > To: philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>> > CC: vision2020 at moscow.com; rhayes at frontier.com
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Happy gun violence day!
>> >
>> >
>> > It's infringing upon a right that the Constitution itself says cannot 
>> > be
>> > infringed upon.  So, in order to do so anyway, it had damn well better 
>> > be a
>> > very needed law.  The sad fact is that if the assault weapons ban had 
>> > been
>> > in place, Newtown would have happened anyway.  The guy who did that did 
>> > it
>> > for a reason that was more complicated than "Hey look!  Here's an 
>> > AR-15!
>> > There's nothing on Netflix, the gym's closed, I'm climbing the walls 
>> > here,
>> > maybe I should go shoot some kids!"
>> >
>> > I have no doubt that you can buy a gun that works just as well as an 
>> > AR-15
>> > but that doesn't have a pistol grip or a flash suppressor now.  Shortly
>> > after this ban, the just-barely non-assault version of the rifle will 
>> > come
>> > out.  The statistics will show that there was a drop in "assault 
>> > weapon"
>> > shootings, because the AR-15 mark II won't be counted in them, and the
>> > politicians will try to con the people into thinking they actually 
>> > helped
>> > anything.  This ban is stupid.  It's all political, and it's pointless 
>> > in a
>> > practical sense.
>> >
>> > Paul
>> >
>> > On 01/19/2013 08:29 PM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>> >
>> > This is long but let me make clear that there is a considerable 
>> > difference
>> > between the view that we shouldn't impinge on rights on a whim and the 
>> > view
>> > I was criticizing. I think we're all in agreement that whims won't do 
>> > it.
>> >
>> > On Jan 19, 2013, at 7:21 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> 
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > Let's see.
>> >
>> > 1.  When the Constitution was written, we'd just finished a war in 
>> > which
>> > we rebelled against those in authority and claimed our independence as 
>> > a
>> > nation for ourselves.
>> >
>> > 2.  Shortly after that, we wrote our own Constitution, which describes 
>> > the
>> > ways in which government is limited.  No more royal decrees for us.
>> >
>> > 3.  When adding the Bill of Rights, the restriction against infringing 
>> > on
>> > our right to bear arms was added as the second such amendment, right 
>> > after
>> > freedom of speech.
>> >
>> > 4.  One assumes from this that the right to bear arms was indeed 
>> > important
>> > to our forefathers.  And not because they wanted us to hunt.
>> >
>> > Given all that, I think it's reasonable to assume that the right in
>> > question shouldn't be infringed upon on a whim.  Events like Newtown 
>> > are
>> > rare, and each one gets splashed across the news for a month or more
>> > because it's very dramatic.  I don't like seeing children die either, 
>> > but
>> > reducing magazine sizes to 10 rounds and removing scary-looking rifles
>> > while leaving just-as-functional rifles alone isn't going to stop the 
>> > next
>> > spree shooting, even if it actually makes it's way into law.  Klebold 
>> > was
>> > on this tenth 10-round magazine when he killed himself.  This guy that 
>> > did
>> > Newtown would have had just as easy access to his mothers AR-15, since
>> > there is no way in hell they will pass something that will make people 
>> > have
>> > to turn them in.  An ineffective law passed only because people are 
>> > riled
>> > up about kids getting shot isn't worth weakening the 2nd amendment, in 
>> > my
>> > opinion.
>> >
>> > I can get behind better background checks, well thought-out 
>> > restrictions
>> > on people suspected of being mentally ill (that's a whole other can of
>> > worms when we are talking about people's rights, but we should start 
>> > the
>> > conversation), better data collection, and incentives to keep weapons
>> > secured and safe.  Banning assault weapons, though, is a farce.  It's a
>> > political ploy that's using people's fear and anger to pass something 
>> > that
>> > makes it look like they are doing something that will help.
>> >
>> > I'm not a member of the NRA, and I think they go way overboard 
>> > sometimes.
>> > Still, I haven't seen them or anyone else trying to claim that gun
>> > ownership should be unrestricted.  We already have gun registration,
>> > background checks, cooling off periods, and restrictions against actual
>> > assault weapons (i.e. fully automatic weapons).
>> >
>> > Paul
>> >
>> > On 01/19/2013 02:01 PM, Joe Campbell wrote:
>> >
>> > How is the second amendment under threat?
>> >
>> > The NRA interpretation of the 2nd amendment is absurd. It is in fact so
>> > absurd that neither you nor anyone else would try to defend it in a 
>> > public
>> > setting. Which is why this post will be followed by silence from you 
>> > and
>> > others.
>> >
>> > The idea that the right to own guns is UNRESTRICTED is absurd. NO 
>> > rights
>> > are unrestricted. If speech can be restricted, then so can the sale and
>> > purchase of guns. And speech is and can be restricted.
>> >
>> > If the NRA position has something to do with RIGHTS, then you should be
>> > able to name another right that is similarly unrestricted. But you 
>> > can't.
>> > The NRA position has nothing to do with rights. It has to do with gun 
>> > sales.
>> >
>> > On Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Paul Rumelhart 
>> > <godshatter at yahoo.com>wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > The nerve of those people!  Having a rally in support of one of the
>> > amendments to the Constitution!  How despicable!  How un-American!
>> >
>> > Paul
>> >
>> > On 01/19/2013 09:32 AM, rhayes at frontier.com wrote:
>> >
>> >  Happy Gun Violence day today everyone! Hope you have a bang!
>> >
>> >    *From:* "vision2020-request at moscow.com" 
>> > <vision2020-request at moscow.com>
>> > <vision2020-request at moscow.com> <vision2020-request at moscow.com>
>> > *To:* vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > *Sent:* Saturday, January 19, 2013 6:06 AM
>> > *Subject:* Vision2020 Digest, Vol 79, Issue 205
>> >
>> > Send Vision2020 mailing list submissions to
>> >     vision2020 at moscow.com
>> >
>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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>> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> >     vision2020-request at moscow.com
>> >
>> > You can reach the person managing the list at
>> >     vision2020-owner at moscow.com
>> >
>> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> > than "Re: Contents of Vision2020 digest..."
>> >
>> >
>> > Today's Topics:
>> >
>> >   1. Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day" (Ron Force)
>> >   2. Re: Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day" (Tom Hansen)
>> >   3. Caturday (January 19, 2013) (Tom Hansen)
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 1
>> > Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 20:40:44 -0800 (PST)
>> > From: Ron Force <rforce2003 at yahoo.com>
>> > To: Moscow Vision2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> > Subject: [Vision2020] Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day"
>> > Message-ID:
>> >     <1358570444.77938.YahooMailNeo at web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk
>> >
>> > ?
>> > Ron Force
>> > Moscow Idaho USA
>> > -------------- next part --------------
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>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 2
>> > Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 20:59:17 -0800
>> > From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
>> > To: Ron Force <rforce2003 at yahoo.com>
>> > Cc: Moscow Vision2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Saturday is "National Gun Appreciation Day"
>> > Message-ID: <CD416371-3602-4B0A-8D55-2B2508E88FB8 at moscow.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Gun Rally Planned This Weekend in Coeur d'Alene
>> > http://tinyurl.com/agnm5kj
>> >
>> > COEUR D'ALENE, Idaho (AP) - Gun advocates in northern Idaho are 
>> > planning a
>> > rally and encouraging participants to openly carry weapons as allowed 
>> > by
>> > Idaho law.
>> >
>> > The Coeur d'Alene Press reports (http://bit.ly/WdqSJr) that the Second
>> > Amendment rally and gun appreciation event is planned for 1 p.m. 
>> > Saturday
>> > at Black Sheep Sporting Goods in Coeur d'Alene.
>> >
>> > Organizers say guest speakers include state lawmakers.
>> >
>> > --------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>> >
>> > "Moscow Cares"
>> > http://www.MoscowCares.com
>> >
>> > Tom Hansen
>> > Moscow, Idaho
>> >
>> > "There's room at the top they are telling you still
>> > But first you must learn how to smile as you kill
>> > If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>> >
>> > - John Lennon
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jan 18, 2013, at 8:40 PM, Ron Force <rforce2003 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fWHFMQ8Wlk
>> > >
>> > > Ron Force
>> > > Moscow Idaho USA
>> > > =======================================================
>> > > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> > >              http://www.fsr.net
>> > >          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > > =======================================================
>> > -------------- next part --------------
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>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 3
>> > Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 06:06:20 -0800
>> > From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
>> > To: Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> > Subject: [Vision2020] Caturday (January 19, 2013)
>> > Message-ID: <
>> >
>> >
>> >
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>
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