[Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
Bill London
london at moscow.com
Wed May 11 15:19:48 PDT 2011
Wagner's "Ride of the Valkyries"
BL
-----Original Message-----
From: Kenneth Marcy
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 12:33 PM
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
Perhaps a little music will help set, or reinforce, the mood for the
meeting.
The first piece that comes to mind is John Williams' The Imperial March from
the second Star Wars movie, The Empire Strikes Back.
Others?
Ken
On Wednesday 11 May 2011 10:43:59 Andy Boyd wrote:
> Ultimately I don't think it matters what the city wants and the govt. and
> Exxon don't care if we say bring em through or not... Exxon seems to be
> telling Boise how it's going to go and they roll over like puppies to show
> subservience... Andy Boyd
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Betsy Dickow
> To: 'Andy Boyd'
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 10:35 AM
> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>
>
> And the city will roll over and say please, oh please, send them
> through!
>
>
>
> Betsy
>
>
>
> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com
> [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Andy Boyd Sent:
> Wednesday, May 11, 2011 10:27 AM
> To: Vision 2020
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>
>
>
> The meeting is a farce because Exxon lies. Ie. can't make megaloads
> smaller.
>
> The meeting is a farce because the Govenor and ITD rubbber stamps
> anything Exxon wants.
>
> The meeting is a farce because Exxon's technical expertise was shown to
> be suspect when they sent the load on hwy 12 and had the power line issues
> (great job rubber stamping ITD).
>
> Don't like to be pesimistic but exxon gets what exxon wants and the rest
> is lip service.
>
> Cheers
>
> Andy Boyd
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Donovan Arnold
>
> To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020 ; Craine Kit ; Sue Hovey ; Tom Hansen
>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 9:59 AM
>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>
>
>
> Tom Hansen,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the history lesson. But that doesn't change any of
> the
> facts on the ground. The meeting is still a farce because it won't be to
> discuss the concerns of the Idaho and Moscow residents unless they are
> technical questions about how the transportation will proceed.
>
>
>
> In all fairness, Council President Krauss was correct that the
> mega-loads were not Moscow's specific concern because at the time he said
> it the loads were not scheduled to come through Moscow.
>
> The only thing people of Moscow are being offered is lip service
> and information on how the mega-loads are going to come roaring through
> downtown in the dead of night. Where is the meeting on how and what is
> being done to prevent this from happening? Until that happens, people are
> just being played with by the politicians, lawyers, and the big oil
> companies that fund them.
>
>
>
> Remember Governor Cecil D. Andrus and how he blocked the Feds
> from entering the state with nuclear waste?
>
>
>
> "I've got a state policeman and 15 of his friends, and all of
> them are prepared to do what is necessary if that truck makes it inside
> the borders of this state."
>
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/1991/02/08/us/idaho-governor-blocks-shipments-of-at
> om-waste-to-us-dump-site.html
>
>
>
> Too bad we don't have politicians with courage and a working
> moral compass today that really look out for the people they represent!
> The rights of local citizens and property owners, and our pristine
> irreplaceable environment should not be ignored or put at risk of
> destruction in favor of the most privileged billionaires that offer
> nothing in return for their trespasses against us.
>
>
>
> Donovan Arnold
>
>
>
>
> --- On Wed, 5/11/11, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
> Moscow To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Art Deco"
> <deco at moscow.com>, "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Craine Kit"
> <kcraine at frontier.com>, "Sue Hovey" <suehovey at moscow.com> Date: Wednesday,
> May 11, 2011, 8:27 AM
>
> A little history lesson here, Mr. Arnold . . .
>
> On June 28, 2010 the Idaho Transportation Department began
> what
> was expected to be a series of community discussions in Moscow, Lewiston,
> and Kamiah. ITD, Conoco, and ExxonMobil were under the impression that
> these forums were to be conducted similar to a "high school career day"
> where representatives from Conoco and ExxonMobil would present a short
> speech from their respective displays. Shortly after Rep. Tom Trail
> arrived at the meeting, was informed of the meeting's format, and had a
> "discussion" with the ITD rep, the forum was re-formatted to include a Q&A
> portion.
>
> http://www.moscowcares.com/highway12/ITDmtg_062810.htm
>
> ----------------------
>
> On August 16, 2010, during the public commentary portion of
> the
> Moscow City Council session, it was suggested that Moscow adopt a
> resolution against the transporting of oversized loads on Highway 12.
>
> To which Moscow City Council President Wayne Krauss responded,
> on September 6th, that the megaloads were none of Moscow's concern.
>
>
> http://www.moscowcares.com/highway12/MoscowCC_PubCom_Hwy12Res.htm
>
> ----------------------
>
> On April 4, 2011 the Idaho Transportation Department presented
> a report to the Moscow City Council outlining US95 and I90 as alternate
> routes for a portion of the Highway 12 megaloads. In strong suggestive
> language (using terms like "right" and "ethics") Mayor Chaney asked that a
> public forum be conducted in Moscow so that Moscow's citizens may be heard
> on this issue.
>
> http://www.moscowcares.com/040411_05_MegaloadsITD.htm
>
> ----------------------
>
> On April 18, 2011, during the Moscow City Council session,
> Mayor Chaney presented an update concerning the potential for megaloads
> being transported through Moscow on US95.
>
> http://www.moscowcares.com/041811_05_Megaloads.htm
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> So . . . you see, Mr. Arnold. In my opinion, where the people
> of Moscow are concerned, Mayor Chaney has their back.
>
> Perhaps your anguish would be better aimed at Moscow City
> Council President Wayne Krauss who publicly expressed that these megaloads
> are not of Moscow's concern.
>
> Footnote, V-peeps: Although Rep. Tom Trail and Moscow City
> Council President Wayne Krauss are both members of the Republican Party,
> there are three words that clearly define the difference between them . .
> .
>
> CONCERN FOR CONSTITUENTS
>
> You decide who's got your back next time you step into the
> voting booth.
>
> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> On Wed, May 11, 2011 6:40 am, Donovan Arnold wrote:
> > Sue,
> > Â
> > I don't think that Mayor Cheney believes that the other
> > issues are not of concern. I just don't think the Mayor can
> > restrict what people can ask, only what she and her invited
> > speakers are willing to address. I think having a public
> > forum simply to take only technical questions is rather
> > pointless unless you are an engineering student. Most people
> > won't have technical questions about the transport ifÂ
> > explained the process in a well written article posted on
> > the internet and published in the paper. I think the meeting
> > is a farce if the real questions and concerns people have
> > are not even allowed to be asked.
> > Â
> > How about this question? What can the people do to stop
> these
> > mega-transports?
> > Â
> > Donovan Arnold
> >
> > --- On Tue, 5/10/11, Sue Hovey <suehovey at moscow.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Sue Hovey <suehovey at moscow.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
> > Moscow To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>, "Vision 2020"
> > <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Donovan Arnold"
> > <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Tom Hansen"
> > <thansen at moscow.com>, "Craine Kit" <kcraine at frontier.com>
> > Date: Tuesday, May 10, 2011, 11:45 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom, Donovan & All,
> > Â
> > I don’t see that framing the discussion around local
> issues
> > is a signal that the Mayor has declared the rest to be ok.Â
> > It seems to me the meeting was set to discuss impacts on our
> > city. Those are the concerns which will determine whether
> > they get a permit to transport the rigs. Obviously the
> > other risks are not important to the Governor, ITD, and
> > other folks or this wouldn’t have already happened in
> > Idaho.   As a group of citizens concerned with this
> > whole mess--how Exxon Mobile and other oil extractors are
> > willing to do any damage to any environment, and any people
> > simply to turn a profit—you point out a legitimate
> > discussion topic for Moscow citizens, and I bet the mayor is
> > willing to have that meeting, too. Why not ask her.Â
> > Â
> > Sue H.
> >
> >
> > Â
> >
> > From: Art Deco
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 12:39 PM
> > To: Vision 2020
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
> > Moscow Â
> >
> > These megaloads are an extremely great deal for us!
> > Â
> > We can help kill lots of First Nations Canadians and others,
> > cause the greatest environmental disaster in the history of
> > North America, and help our sneakiest global competitors,
> > the Chinese, who own the majority interests in the tar sands
> > projects, to prosper even more at our expense. Â
> > Paraphrasing Langston Hughes:Â Everyone benefits from these
> > megaloads. Big oil gets to ride, we gets to watch them ride.
> > Â
> > w.
> > Â
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Donovan Arnold
> > To: Tom Hansen ; Craine Kit
> > Cc: Moscow Vision 2020
> > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:40 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
> > Moscow Â
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > My Questions;
> > Â
> > How did the Mayor acquire the ability to dictate what
> > questions can an cannot be asked? I understand informing
> > people they will only answer questions they feel are related
> > to the transport of the megaloads, but to tell people what
> > they can and cannot ask seems more like a scripted event
> > than an actual Q&A session.
> > Â
> > Why should any people be required to allow these megaloads
> to
> > be run through their towns when they are not designed to
> > handle this kind transport? I don't think it would hurt
> > Exxon Mobile financially to find another means of
> > transporting their product without disrupting the quality of
> > life, safety, and well being of others with lesser means
> > than them. Â
> > Donovan Arnold
> > Â
> > Â
> > --- On Tue, 5/10/11, Craine Kit <kcraine at frontier.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Craine Kit <kcraine at frontier.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
> > Moscow To: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
> > Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> > Date: Tuesday, May 10, 2011, 9:47 AM
> >
> >
> > Of course, one must ask about the impact of the convoy of 30
> > or so vehicles--which is said to take an hour to pass any
> > particular point.
> >
> > Kit Craine
> >
> > On May 10, 2011, at 5:43 AM, Tom Hansen wrote:
> >> Courtesy of today's (May 10, 2011) Moscow-Pullman Daily
> >> News.
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> --------------
> >>
> >> OUR VIEW: Questions about semimegaloads in Moscow
> >> Lee Rozen, for the editorial board
> >> Posted on: Tuesday, May 10, 2011
> >>
> >>
> >> In the middle of about 60 nights this year, Imperial
> >> Oil/ExxonMobil wants
> >> to send oil equipment convoys that are a block or so long,
> >> two lanes wide
> >> and 16 feet tall rumbling and blinking north through
> >> downtown Moscow.
> >>
> >> The Korean-built equipment would head from Lewiston via
> U.S.
> >> Highway 95,
> >> Interstate 90 and Montana to the Kearl Oil Sands in
> Alberta.
> >> To get each
> >> load from Lewiston to the Benewah County line should take
> >> one night between 10 p.m. and 5:30 a.m. Officials promise
> >> traffic delays of no more
> >> than 15 minutes.
> >>
> >> But the travel plan is under review, and neither Idaho nor
> >> Montana has issued the necessary permits, or said when they
> >> will. The Moscow semi-megaload route has been chosen
> >> because of the delays in getting megaloads up the scenic
> >> U.S. Highway 12 corridor.
> >>
> >> ExxonMobil and Idaho Transportation Department officials
> >> have deigned to
> >> listen to Moscow's concerns about that at 7 p.m. Wednesday
> >> at the Hamilton
> >> Indoor Recreation Center, 1724 E. F St.
> >>
> >> At that meeting. ITD and oil company officials will talk
> >> first, and then
> >> take questions and comments from those who have signed in.
> >> Also, you can
> >> email your thoughts to the ITD at comments at itd.idaho.gov,
> >> and the City Council at skalasz at ci.moscow.id.us.
> >>
> >> Mayor Nancy Chaney apparently has declared the morality of
> >> ExxonMobil profits, the Kearl Oil Sands project and fossil
> >> fuel consumption off-limits for discussion Wednesday night.
> >>
> >> ExxonMobil made profits of $10.7 billion in first quarter
> >> 2011. Some say
> >> the Kearl Oil Sands project is destroying the Canadian
> >> environment and killing residents of the area.
> >>
> >> Still, that leaves plenty of questions that need answers:
> >>
> >> Who makes sure delays are only 15 minutes? What happens if
> >> they aren't?
> >>
> >> Will all cross-streets in Moscow be closed?
> >>
> >> Is it a delay if traffic keeps moving at 15 miles an hour
> >> behind the convoy? (The ITD says it isn't a delay; federal
> >> rules say it is.)
> >>
> >> Who pays for moving power lines and stoplights out of the
> >> way?
> >>
> >> Will this semi-megaload convoy be likely to wake me up when
> >> it goes by my
> >> house or apartment?
> >>
> >> Will you notify shippers - and the media so they can alert
> >> the public - in
> >> advance of a convoy?
> >>
> >> Once permits are issued, can their terms be changed without
> >> notice?
> >>
> >> What if state police escorts get called to an emergency?
> >> Will that stall
> >> the convoy?
> >>
> >> What if Montana won't let the semi-megaloads in?
> >>
> >> Let's hope we hear some good answers.
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> --------------
> >>
> >> Seeya there, Moscow.
> >>
> >> Tom Hansen
> >> Moscow, Idaho
> >>
> >> "This is the 'Mouse that Roared,' 'David and Goliath' and
> >> 'Avatar' all rolled into one. We must remember that the
> >> thousands of citizens involved
> >> in this effort to protect their personal and family safety,
> >> their businesses and their lifestyles are confronting some
> >> of the largest international corporations in the world."
> >>
> >> - Linwood Laughy
> >>
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