[Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
Tom Hansen
thansen at moscow.com
Wed May 11 15:30:57 PDT 2011
>From "Blazing Saddles" . . .
"Our Town"
http://www.TomandRodna.com/Songs/Our_Town.mp3
(Jus' jokin')
Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho
On Wed, May 11, 2011 3:19 pm, Bill London wrote:
> Wagner's "Ride of the Valkyries"
>
> BL
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kenneth Marcy
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 12:33 PM
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>
>
> Perhaps a little music will help set, or reinforce, the mood for the
> meeting.
>
> The first piece that comes to mind is John Williams' The Imperial March
> from
> the second Star Wars movie, The Empire Strikes Back.
>
> Others?
>
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> On Wednesday 11 May 2011 10:43:59 Andy Boyd wrote:
>> Ultimately I don't think it matters what the city wants and the govt.
>> and
>> Exxon don't care if we say bring em through or not... Exxon seems to be
>> telling Boise how it's going to go and they roll over like puppies to
>> show
>> subservience... Andy Boyd
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Betsy Dickow
>> To: 'Andy Boyd'
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 10:35 AM
>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>>
>>
>> And the city will roll over and say please, oh please, send them
>> through!
>>
>>
>>
>> Betsy
>>
>>
>>
>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com
>> [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Andy Boyd Sent:
>> Wednesday, May 11, 2011 10:27 AM
>> To: Vision 2020
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>>
>>
>>
>> The meeting is a farce because Exxon lies. Ie. can't make megaloads
>> smaller.
>>
>> The meeting is a farce because the Govenor and ITD rubbber stamps
>> anything Exxon wants.
>>
>> The meeting is a farce because Exxon's technical expertise was shown
>> to
>> be suspect when they sent the load on hwy 12 and had the power line
>> issues
>> (great job rubber stamping ITD).
>>
>> Don't like to be pesimistic but exxon gets what exxon wants and the
>> rest
>> is lip service.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Andy Boyd
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>
>> From: Donovan Arnold
>>
>> To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020 ; Craine Kit ; Sue Hovey ; Tom Hansen
>>
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 9:59 AM
>>
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in Moscow
>>
>>
>>
>> Tom Hansen,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks for the history lesson. But that doesn't change any of
>> the
>> facts on the ground. The meeting is still a farce because it won't be to
>> discuss the concerns of the Idaho and Moscow residents unless they are
>> technical questions about how the transportation will proceed.
>>
>>
>>
>> In all fairness, Council President Krauss was correct that the
>> mega-loads were not Moscow's specific concern because at the time he
>> said
>> it the loads were not scheduled to come through Moscow.
>>
>> The only thing people of Moscow are being offered is lip
>> service
>> and information on how the mega-loads are going to come roaring through
>> downtown in the dead of night. Where is the meeting on how and what is
>> being done to prevent this from happening? Until that happens, people
>> are
>> just being played with by the politicians, lawyers, and the big oil
>> companies that fund them.
>>
>>
>>
>> Remember Governor Cecil D. Andrus and how he blocked the Feds
>> from entering the state with nuclear waste?
>>
>>
>>
>> "I've got a state policeman and 15 of his friends, and all of
>> them are prepared to do what is necessary if that truck makes it inside
>> the borders of this state."
>>
>>
>> http://www.nytimes.com/1991/02/08/us/idaho-governor-blocks-shipments-of-at
>> om-waste-to-us-dump-site.html
>>
>>
>>
>> Too bad we don't have politicians with courage and a working
>> moral compass today that really look out for the people they represent!
>> The rights of local citizens and property owners, and our pristine
>> irreplaceable environment should not be ignored or put at risk of
>> destruction in favor of the most privileged billionaires that offer
>> nothing in return for their trespasses against us.
>>
>>
>>
>> Donovan Arnold
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On Wed, 5/11/11, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads in
>> Moscow To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Art Deco"
>> <deco at moscow.com>, "Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Craine Kit"
>> <kcraine at frontier.com>, "Sue Hovey" <suehovey at moscow.com> Date:
>> Wednesday,
>> May 11, 2011, 8:27 AM
>>
>> A little history lesson here, Mr. Arnold . . .
>>
>> On June 28, 2010 the Idaho Transportation Department began
>> what
>> was expected to be a series of community discussions in Moscow,
>> Lewiston,
>> and Kamiah. ITD, Conoco, and ExxonMobil were under the impression that
>> these forums were to be conducted similar to a "high school career day"
>> where representatives from Conoco and ExxonMobil would present a short
>> speech from their respective displays. Shortly after Rep. Tom Trail
>> arrived at the meeting, was informed of the meeting's format, and had a
>> "discussion" with the ITD rep, the forum was re-formatted to include a
>> Q&A
>> portion.
>>
>> http://www.moscowcares.com/highway12/ITDmtg_062810.htm
>>
>> ----------------------
>>
>> On August 16, 2010, during the public commentary portion of
>> the
>> Moscow City Council session, it was suggested that Moscow adopt a
>> resolution against the transporting of oversized loads on Highway 12.
>>
>> To which Moscow City Council President Wayne Krauss
>> responded,
>> on September 6th, that the megaloads were none of Moscow's concern.
>>
>>
>> http://www.moscowcares.com/highway12/MoscowCC_PubCom_Hwy12Res.htm
>>
>> ----------------------
>>
>> On April 4, 2011 the Idaho Transportation Department
>> presented
>> a report to the Moscow City Council outlining US95 and I90 as alternate
>> routes for a portion of the Highway 12 megaloads. In strong suggestive
>> language (using terms like "right" and "ethics") Mayor Chaney asked that
>> a
>> public forum be conducted in Moscow so that Moscow's citizens may be
>> heard
>> on this issue.
>>
>> http://www.moscowcares.com/040411_05_MegaloadsITD.htm
>>
>> ----------------------
>>
>> On April 18, 2011, during the Moscow City Council session,
>> Mayor Chaney presented an update concerning the potential for megaloads
>> being transported through Moscow on US95.
>>
>> http://www.moscowcares.com/041811_05_Megaloads.htm
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> So . . . you see, Mr. Arnold. In my opinion, where the
>> people
>> of Moscow are concerned, Mayor Chaney has their back.
>>
>> Perhaps your anguish would be better aimed at Moscow City
>> Council President Wayne Krauss who publicly expressed that these
>> megaloads
>> are not of Moscow's concern.
>>
>> Footnote, V-peeps: Although Rep. Tom Trail and Moscow City
>> Council President Wayne Krauss are both members of the Republican Party,
>> there are three words that clearly define the difference between them .
>> .
>> .
>>
>> CONCERN FOR CONSTITUENTS
>>
>> You decide who's got your back next time you step into the
>> voting booth.
>>
>> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>>
>> Tom Hansen
>> Moscow, Idaho
>>
>> On Wed, May 11, 2011 6:40 am, Donovan Arnold wrote:
>> > Sue,
>> > Â
>> > I don't think that Mayor Cheney believes that the other
>> > issues are not of concern. I just don't think the Mayor
>> can
>> > restrict what people can ask, only what she and her
>> invited
>> > speakers are willing to address. I think having a public
>> > forum simply to take only technical questions is rather
>> > pointless unless you are an engineering student. Most
>> people
>> > won't have technical questions about the transport ifÂ
>> > explained the process in a well written article posted on
>> > the internet and published in the paper. I think the
>> meeting
>> > is a farce if the real questions and concerns people
>> have
>> > are not even allowed to be asked.
>> > Â
>> > How about this question? What can the people do to stop
>> these
>> > mega-transports?
>> > Â
>> > Donovan Arnold
>> >
>> > --- On Tue, 5/10/11, Sue Hovey <suehovey at moscow.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > From: Sue Hovey <suehovey at moscow.com>
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads
>> in
>> > Moscow To: "Art Deco" <deco at moscow.com>, "Vision 2020"
>> > <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Donovan Arnold"
>> > <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Tom Hansen"
>> > <thansen at moscow.com>, "Craine Kit" <kcraine at frontier.com>
>> > Date: Tuesday, May 10, 2011, 11:45 PM
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Tom, Donovan & All,
>> > Â
>> > I don’t see that framing the discussion around
>> local
>> issues
>> > is a signal that the Mayor has declared the rest to be
>> ok.Â
>> > It seems to me the meeting was set to discuss impacts on
>> our
>> > city. Those are the concerns which will determine whether
>> > they get a permit to transport the rigs. Obviously the
>> > other risks are not important to the Governor, ITD, and
>> > other folks or this wouldn’t have already happened
>> in
>> > Idaho.   As a group of citizens concerned with this
>> > whole mess--how Exxon Mobile and other oil extractors are
>> > willing to do any damage to any environment, and any
>> people
>> > simply to turn a profitâ€â€you point out a legitimate
>> > discussion topic for Moscow citizens, and I bet the mayor
>> is
>> > willing to have that meeting, too. Why not ask her.Â
>> > Â
>> > Sue H.
>> >
>> >
>> > Â
>> >
>> > From: Art Deco
>> > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 12:39 PM
>> > To: Vision 2020
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads
>> in
>> > Moscow Â
>> >
>> > These megaloads are an extremely great deal for us!
>> > Â
>> > We can help kill lots of First Nations Canadians and
>> others,
>> > cause the greatest environmental disaster in the history
>> of
>> > North America, and help our sneakiest global competitors,
>> > the Chinese, who own the majority interests in the tar
>> sands
>> > projects, to prosper even more at our expense. Â
>> > Paraphrasing Langston Hughes:Â Everyone benefits from
>> these
>> > megaloads. Big oil gets to ride, we gets to watch them
>> ride.
>> > Â
>> > w.
>> > Â
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Donovan Arnold
>> > To: Tom Hansen ; Craine Kit
>> > Cc: Moscow Vision 2020
>> > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:40 AM
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads
>> in
>> > Moscow Â
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > My Questions;
>> > Â
>> > How did the Mayor acquire the ability to dictate what
>> > questions can an cannot be asked? I understand informing
>> > people they will only answer questions they feel are
>> related
>> > to the transport of the megaloads, but to tell people what
>> > they can and cannot ask seems more like a scripted event
>> > than an actual Q&A session.
>> > Â
>> > Why should any people be required to allow these megaloads
>> to
>> > be run through their towns when they are not designed to
>> > handle this kind transport? I don't think it would hurt
>> > Exxon Mobile financially to find another means of
>> > transporting their product without disrupting the quality
>> of
>> > life, safety, and well being of others with lesser means
>> > than them. Â
>> > Donovan Arnold
>> > Â
>> > Â
>> > --- On Tue, 5/10/11, Craine Kit <kcraine at frontier.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > From: Craine Kit <kcraine at frontier.com>
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Questions About Semi-Megaloads
>> in
>> > Moscow To: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
>> > Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> > Date: Tuesday, May 10, 2011, 9:47 AM
>> >
>> >
>> > Of course, one must ask about the impact of the convoy of
>> 30
>> > or so vehicles--which is said to take an hour to pass
>> any
>> > particular point.
>> >
>> > Kit Craine
>> >
>> > On May 10, 2011, at 5:43 AM, Tom Hansen wrote:
>> >> Courtesy of today's (May 10, 2011) Moscow-Pullman Daily
>> >> News.
>> >>
>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> --------------
>> >>
>> >> OUR VIEW: Questions about semimegaloads in Moscow
>> >> Lee Rozen, for the editorial board
>> >> Posted on: Tuesday, May 10, 2011
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> In the middle of about 60 nights this year, Imperial
>> >> Oil/ExxonMobil wants
>> >> to send oil equipment convoys that are a block or so
>> long,
>> >> two lanes wide
>> >> and 16 feet tall rumbling and blinking north through
>> >> downtown Moscow.
>> >>
>> >> The Korean-built equipment would head from Lewiston via
>> U.S.
>> >> Highway 95,
>> >> Interstate 90 and Montana to the Kearl Oil Sands in
>> Alberta.
>> >> To get each
>> >> load from Lewiston to the Benewah County line should take
>> >> one night between 10 p.m. and 5:30 a.m. Officials promise
>> >> traffic delays of no more
>> >> than 15 minutes.
>> >>
>> >> But the travel plan is under review, and neither Idaho
>> nor
>> >> Montana has issued the necessary permits, or said when
>> they
>> >> will. The Moscow semi-megaload route has been chosen
>> >> because of the delays in getting megaloads up the scenic
>> >> U.S. Highway 12 corridor.
>> >>
>> >> ExxonMobil and Idaho Transportation Department officials
>> >> have deigned to
>> >> listen to Moscow's concerns about that at 7 p.m.
>> Wednesday
>> >> at the Hamilton
>> >> Indoor Recreation Center, 1724 E. F St.
>> >>
>> >> At that meeting. ITD and oil company officials will talk
>> >> first, and then
>> >> take questions and comments from those who have signed
>> in.
>> >> Also, you can
>> >> email your thoughts to the ITD at comments at itd.idaho.gov,
>> >> and the City Council at skalasz at ci.moscow.id.us.
>> >>
>> >> Mayor Nancy Chaney apparently has declared the morality
>> of
>> >> ExxonMobil profits, the Kearl Oil Sands project and
>> fossil
>> >> fuel consumption off-limits for discussion Wednesday
>> night.
>> >>
>> >> ExxonMobil made profits of $10.7 billion in first quarter
>> >> 2011. Some say
>> >> the Kearl Oil Sands project is destroying the Canadian
>> >> environment and killing residents of the area.
>> >>
>> >> Still, that leaves plenty of questions that need answers:
>> >>
>> >> Who makes sure delays are only 15 minutes? What happens
>> if
>> >> they aren't?
>> >>
>> >> Will all cross-streets in Moscow be closed?
>> >>
>> >> Is it a delay if traffic keeps moving at 15 miles an hour
>> >> behind the convoy? (The ITD says it isn't a delay;
>> federal
>> >> rules say it is.)
>> >>
>> >> Who pays for moving power lines and stoplights out of the
>> >> way?
>> >>
>> >> Will this semi-megaload convoy be likely to wake me up
>> when
>> >> it goes by my
>> >> house or apartment?
>> >>
>> >> Will you notify shippers - and the media so they can
>> alert
>> >> the public - in
>> >> advance of a convoy?
>> >>
>> >> Once permits are issued, can their terms be changed
>> without
>> >> notice?
>> >>
>> >> What if state police escorts get called to an emergency?
>> >> Will that stall
>> >> the convoy?
>> >>
>> >> What if Montana won't let the semi-megaloads in?
>> >>
>> >> Let's hope we hear some good answers.
>> >>
>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> --------------
>> >>
>> >> Seeya there, Moscow.
>> >>
>> >> Tom Hansen
>> >> Moscow, Idaho
>> >>
>> >> "This is the 'Mouse that Roared,' 'David and Goliath' and
>> >> 'Avatar' all rolled into one. We must remember that
>> the
>> >> thousands of citizens involved
>> >> in this effort to protect their personal and family
>> safety,
>> >> their businesses and their lifestyles are confronting
>> some
>> >> of the largest international corporations in the world."
>> >>
>> >> - Linwood Laughy
>> >>
>
> =======================================================
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> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
"The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it to
changeand the Realist adjusts his sails."
- Unknown
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