[Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top Aviator
Sunil Ramalingam
sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
Thu May 21 17:28:46 PDT 2009
Gary,
Do you think gays should not be allowed to serve in the military?
Sunil
From: jampot at roadrunner.com
To: philosopher.joe at gmail.com; bear at moscow.com
Date: Thu, 21 May 2009 17:13:51 -0700
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top Aviator
Funny. Your ursine pal quotes from the same study I
cited (The Social Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices in the United
States - Laumann, Gagnon, Michael, Michaels) as well as the hugely
discredited Kinsey report in a failed attempt to bear up his spurious
assertion of 10% of America's population being gay and yet you find my
numbers...curious. Could it be that Yogi's numbers "look better" because
they more closely match up with your preconceived notions?
g
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Campbell" <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
To: <bear at moscow.com>
Cc: "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>;
<bear at moscow.com>; "Tom Hansen"
<thansen at moscow.com>; "Moscow Vision
2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 8:02 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top
Aviator
> This looks better.
>
> The Crabtree information,
including the citation, is in quotes,
> indicating it was lifted
from a website or whatever. I wonder where it
> came from.
>
> You're right, though, Bear the percentage is irrelevant.
>
Discrimination is wrong regardless of the percentage. But the Crabtree
> numbers are ... curious.
>
>
>
> Joe
Campbell
>
> On May 21, 2009, at 7:33 AM, bear at moscow.com wrote:
>
>>
>> I think we are trying to count how many angels can
dance on the head
>> of a
>> pin, and depending on what
study you use, the numbers vary.
>>
>> The bottom line is,
they have a right to serve, let them!
>>
>> The average ratio
from several studies are that 9.37% of men are
>> homosexual and 4.87%
of women are homosexual in the US. The Central
>> Intelligence Agency
estimates that there are 149,346,264 men and
>> 154,478,382 women in
the US which would statistically equate to
>>
13,993,745
>> gay men & 7,523,097 lesbians in the US for a total of
just over 21.5
>> Million.
>>
>> In 1995, a survey
(The prevalence of homosexual behavior and
>> attraction
in
>> the United States, the United Kingdom and France: Results of
national
>> population-based samples - Sell, Wells, and Wypij) reported
6.2% of
>> males
>> and 3.6% of females in the United
States report having had sexual
>> contact
>> with
someone of the same sex in the previous 5 years.
>>
>> A 1994
study (The Social Organization of Sexuality: Sexual Practices
>>
in
>> the United States - Laumann, Gagnon, Michael, Michaels)
reported
>> that the
>> incidence rate of homosexual
desire for men is 7.7% and 7.5% for
>>
women.
>>
>> A 1993 study (The Janus Report on Sexual Behavior
- Janus and Janus)
>> found
>> 9% of men and 5% of
women were involved in frequent or ongoing
>>
homosexual
>> experiences.
>>
>> A 1990 study
(Homosexuality/Heterosexuality by McWhirter, Sanders, and
>> Reinisch)
stated 13.95% of males and 4.25% of females had
>> "extensive"
or
>> "more than incidental" homosexual
experience.
>>
>> The Indiana University Kinsey Reports
(Sexual Behavior in the Human
>> Male -
>> Kinsey,
Pomeroy, and Martin/Sexual Behavior in the Human Female -
>>
Kinsey,
>> Pomeroy, Martin, and Gerhard) reported 10% of males being
more or less
>> exclusively homosexual and 2% to 6% of females being
more or less
>> exclusively homosexual.
>>
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>>
---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>> ---
>>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>>
Where is this from?
>>>
>>> Joe
Campbell
>>>
>>> On May 21, 2009, at 6:14 AM, "g.
crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "1.51% of
the total U.S. population identifies themselves as gay,
>>>>
lesbian or bisexual, or 4.3 total million Americans. These
numbers
>>>> are based on figures provided by a broad-based
coalition of gay
>>>> rights organizations and homosexual
advocacy groups. The primary
>>>> source cited was the The
National Health and Social Life Survey
>>>> (NHSLS), published in
the book The Social Organization of Sex:
>>>> Sexual Practices in
the United States (1994), by Laumann, Gagnon,
>>>> Michael and
Michaels. "
>>>>
>>>>
And,
>>>>
>>>> "Referring to the Laumann study,
the gay rights coalition stated
>>>> that in the United States
2.8% of males age 18 or older, and 1.4% of
>>>> females age 18 or
older are homosexual, gay, lesbian or bisexual. We
>>>> have
applied their figures to the 2003 U.S. population
(284,800,000
>>>> total population, according to the U.S. Census
Bureau). 0.9% of
>>>> women identify themselves as lesbians
(excluding bisexuals), which
>>>> equates to 0.32% of total U.S.
population being lesbians. 2 percent
>>>> of men identify
themselves as gay (excluding bisexuals), which
>>>> equates to
0.7% of total U.S. population being gay men. Source:
>>>>
National study published in Laumann, et al., The Social
Organization
>>>> of Sex: Sexual Practices in the United States
(1994)"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
g
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From:
<bear at moscow.com>
>>>> To: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
>>>> Cc: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 7:21
PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Air Force Boots Top
Aviator
>>>>
>>>>>
Tom,
>>>>>
>>>>> Honestly the only way that
we can put a number on it is based on
>>>> the
fact
>>>>> that a nations military forces reflects the
statistics of that
>>>> nation. It
>>>>> is
estimated that about 10% of the US population is gay,
>>>>
therefore, it
>>>>> safe to make the assumption that
some where around 6,000 of those
>>>> on
the
>>>>> Wall were gay (5, 819.5 for those of you out there
doing the math).
>>>>>
>>>>> Even more
interesting when you look at those numbers based on WW2
>>>>
troop
>>>>> numbers, and really more revealing when you
consider that there
>>>> have been
>>>>> 3,465
Medal of Honor winners, resulting in 346 gay Medal of Honor
>>>>
winners.
>>>>>
>>>>> I had an old First
Sergeant that used to tell our troops, that one
>>>>
in
>>>>> three people in America has some sort of
psychological problem. So
>>>> in this
>>>>>
formation, look to your left, and look to your right, and if
those
>>>> two
>>>>> guys look OK, it's
YOU!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>
I have asked this question before, and it bears repeating
again
>>>> coupled
>>>>>> with serious
concern.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are
58,195 names on the Vietnam Memorial
Wall.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How many, would
you estimate, belong to gay soldiers, sailors,
>>>> airmen,
and
>>>>>>
marines?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pro
patria,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tom
Hansen
>>>>>> Moscow,
Idaho
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Patriotism is not
a short and frenzied outburst of emotion but
>>>>>>
the
>>>>>> tranquil and steady dedication of a
lifetime."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- Adlai E.
Stevenson,
Jr.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>
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>>>> List
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>>>> serving the
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>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>
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