[Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
Donovan Arnold
donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
Wed Apr 15 08:50:17 PDT 2009
Joe,
I didn't say that. I don't know his positions on the Bible.
Best Regards,
Donovan
--- On Wed, 4/15/09, Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:
From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
Cc: "vision2020 at moscow.com" <vision2020 at moscow.com>, "Ralph Nielsen" <nielsen at uidaho.edu>
Date: Wednesday, April 15, 2009, 8:18 AM
Just to be clear: You think that Pastor Wilson's understanding of the Bible is wrong and that he is irrational. Right?
Joe Campbell
On Apr 15, 2009, at 8:08 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:
OK Bear,
You asked, I showed you where it was written. You believe whatever you want to believe. If I cannot convince you that Jesus said to love thy neighbor, not beat him, so be it. It makes no difference to me as slavery no longer exists and you are not being rational or able to look at the big picture. You just want to take little pieces of the Bible, take them out of context, distort their meaning in order to try and discredit the book and religion. You will not be successful, but you are welcome waste your time trying.
Best Regards,
Donovan
--- On Tue, 4/14/09, bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com> wrote:
From: bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Ralph Nielsen" <nielsen at uidaho.edu>, vision2020 at moscow.com, bear at moscow.com
Date: Tuesday, April 14, 2009, 6:32 AM
Donovan,
YOU are wrong! NONE of the TEN COMMANDMENTS say that.
The discussion was in regards to the TEN COMMANDMENTS. Matthew 22:34-40 does NOT list
the Ten Commandments as they are known to all of the world and those that read the bible,
except YOU of course.
First, Matthew 22:34-40 is not a listing of the Ten Commandments, the lists known as the
Ten
Commandments are given in passages in two books of the Bible: Exodus 20:2�17, Exodus
34:11�27 and Deuteronomy 5:6�21.
Second, depending on which religion/denomination (Jewish,
Anglican,Reformed,Orthodox,Catholic, Lutheran or other Christian, the Second Commandment
regards the following: You shall have no other gods before me; or, You shall not make for
yourself an idol; or, You shall not make wrongful use of the name of your God. No where in
any
list of the TEN COMMANDMENTS is there a "cliff note version" that reduces the Ten
Commandments down to two!
Have a nice day
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Bear,
> 聽
> Yes you did ask that, precisely your words were,
> 聽
> "You state below that 'God says to love your neighbor, not sell and abuse
t> hem', where? In the Bible? You can't use the Bible where it supports your
p> osition and then say it's聽bunk when it doesn't!"
> 聽
> I told you where it says that, precisely;
> 聽
> Matthew 22:34-40
> 聽
> "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your
so> ul, and with all your mind. is the greatest and first commandment. And a
se> cond is like it: You shall love聽your neighbor as yourself. On these
tw> o commandments hang all the
> law and the prophets."
> 聽
> It is the second commandment, that is where it says slavery and abuse of
sl> aves is wrong.
> Because you are suppose to love thy neighbor as thy self.
> 聽
> Best Regards,
> 聽
> Donovan
>
> 聽
>
>
>
> --- On Mon, 4/13/09, bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com> wrote:
>
>
> From: bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
> To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Ralph Nielsen"
<niels> en at uidaho.edu>, vision2020 at moscow.com, bear at moscow.com
> Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 5:56 PM
>
>
> NO Donovan, I NEVER asked that. What I ask was WHICH one of the ten
command> ments YOU
> were quoting. YOU stated," First, the Ten Commandants say to "Love your
Nei> ghbor". Do you
> disagree?" It is your quote, not mine.
>
> I said that I disagree and am asking YOU which of the TEN COMMANDMENTS
says> that.
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------> --
-
>
>
> > Bear,
> > 脗聽
> > You asked where it said in the Bible not to sell your neighbor and abuse
> th> em.
> > 脗聽
> > It says in the Bible, directly from Jesus,
> > 脗聽
> > "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart,
> > and with all your soul, and with all your mind. is the greatest
> > and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love
> > your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the
> > law and the prophets.-Jesus---Matthew 22:34-40
> > 脗聽
> > Unless you want to absurdly assert that selling someone into slavery and
> ab> use is not contrary to脗聽loving them, your question has been
> satisfactor> ily answered as to where it says slavery and abuse of your
nei> ghbor is
> wron> g in the Bible.
> >
> > Best Regards,
> > 脗聽
> > Donovan
> > 脗聽
> >
> > --- On Mon, 4/13/09, bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
> > To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Ralph Nielsen"
> <niels> en at uidaho.edu>, vision2020 at moscow.com, bear at moscow.com
> > Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 5:04 PM
> >
> >
> > Donovan,
> >
> > I'm afraid I DO disagree, which commandment says that?
> >
> > The 10 Commandments are found in the Bible's Old Testament at Exodus,
> Chapt> er 20. They
> > were given directly by God to the people of Israel at Mount Sinai after
H> e
> > had delivered
> > them
> > from slavery in Egypt:
> > "And God spoke all these words, saying: 'I am the LORD your
God芒�> 偓娄
> >
> > ONE: 'You shall have no other gods before Me.'
> > TWO: 'You shall not make for yourself a carved image--any likeness of
> anyth> ing that is in
> > heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water
> unde> r the earth.'
> > THREE: 'You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.'
> > FOUR: 'Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.'
> > FIVE: 'Honor your father and your mother.'
> > SIX: 'You shall not murder.'
> > SEVEN: 'You shall not commit adultery.'
> > EIGHT: 'You shall not steal.'
> > NINE: 'You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.'
> > TEN: 'You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your
> n> eighbor's wife,
> > nor
> > his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor
> a> nything that is
> > your
> > neighbor's.'
> >
> >
> >
-------------------------------------------------------------------------> --> --
> ---
> > > Bear,
> > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > First, the Ten Commandants say to "Love your Neighbor". Do you
disagree> ?
> > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > >
> > >
脙垄芒鈥毬嬇撁兟⒚⑩�> 毬呪�淵ou shall love the Lord your
> Go> d with all your heart,
> > and>脗聽 with all your soul, and with all your
> mind.脙垄芒鈥毬�> 陆 This is the
grea> test
> > > and first commandment. And a second is like it:
脙垄芒�> �毬呪�淵ou
> > shall love
> > you> r neighbour as
yourself.脙垄芒鈥毬> 柯� On these two
> commandm> ents hang all the
> > la> w and the
> prophets.脙垄芒鈥毬⑩�灺�--Jesus�> 兟⒚⑩�毬⑩偓> 锟組atthew 22:34-40
> > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > Second, Are you arguing that selling someone into slavery and abusing
> the> m
> > > is not contrary to脙鈥毭偮爐his law?
> > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > Best Regards,
> > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > Donovan
> > >
> > > --- On Mon, 4/13/09, bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > From: bear at moscow.com <bear at moscow.com>
> > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
> > > To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>, "Ralph Nielsen"
> > <niels> en at uidaho.edu>, vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 4:16 PM
> > >
> > >
> > > Donovan,
> > >
> > > You state below that "God says to love your neighbor, not sell and
abus> e
> > th> em", where? In
> > > the
> > > Bible?
> > > You can't use the Bible where it supports your position and then say
it> 's
> > b> unk when it
> > > doesn't!
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------->
> --> --
> > -
> > > > Ralph, 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > The Bible is not the law of the land. And I don't know of any men,
> > > including Wilson, that want to adopt Leviticus or Exodus as
> such.脙鈥�> 脗聽
> > 脙鈥�> 脗聽
> > > > God says to love your neighbor, not sell and abuse them.
脙鈥> 毭偮�
> > > > Women were sold in ancient times, or given a
dowry,脙鈥毭> 偮爄n
> order>聽 to
> > repa> y
> > > the脙鈥毭偮� father for the cost of raising and
prote> cting her, which
> > was
> > expe> nsive to
> > > > do. You have to watch them 24 hours a day.
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > Your interpretation of God, and the Bible seems extremely corrupted.
> > > Perhaps it is your prejudice against people that know a loving God
> > exists.>脗聽
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > Best Regards,
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > Donovan
> > > >
> > > > --- On Mon, 4/13/09, Ralph Nielsen <nielsen at uidaho.edu> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > From: Ralph Nielsen <nielsen at uidaho.edu>
> > > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] 8 year old girl denied divorce
> > > > To: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>
> > > > Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > > Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 2:54 PM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I don't think anyone suggested that he was, Donovan. But there are
al> l
> > to> o
> > > > many like him who want to make it the law of the
land.脙鈥�> 脗聽
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > As I pointed out, the God of the Bible says it is OK for a father to
> se> ll
> > > h> is daughter into slavery. Doug seems to lack a sense of morality so
> he
> > > goes>脙鈥毭偮� by the rule that if it's biblical,
it'> s moral.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Ralph
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Apr 13, 2009, at 2:22 PM, Donovan Arnold wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Wilson is not the law of the land. He is not in a position to enforce
> h> is
> > > r> eligious symbolism literally on the country. Only people that wish
t> o
> > > follo> w his words do, not by force.
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > There seems to be a deep sense of confusion amongst some liberals
> betwe> en
> > > r> eligious symbolism and an actual judge and government forcing an 8
> yea> r
> > > old>脙鈥毭偮� girl to marry a 40-something year old
m> an.
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > As a Christian, I believe, and my religious leaders will tell me, to
> > hono> r
> > > > my Mother and Father, and I willfully try to do so. However, they are
> n> ot
> > > a> dvocating that it be law that I do whatever my parents tell me to do
> a> s
> > > an
> > > > adult.
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > I don't know Wilson theology, but I am sure he is against 8 year old
> > girl> s
> > > > being forced to marry and do whatever a 40 year old man tells her to
> do> ..
> > > I
> > > > am sure he is also against the buying and selling of people as
> property> ..
> > > Bu> t even if he wasn't, who cares, he isn't in a position, or seeking
> a
> > > positi> on, to enforce it. I am concerned with those that are being
> force> d
> > > right
> > > no> w, and an ancient system of governing that is operates serious
> > injustic> es
> > > a> gainst people, especially women and children.
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > Best Regards,
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > > Donovan
> > > > 脙鈥毭偮�
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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> 脙鈥毭偮犆冣��>
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> > > > 脙鈥毭偮� 脙鈥毭偮�
脙鈥> 毭偮� 脙鈥毭偮� 脙鈥毭偮�
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