[Vision2020] discrimination and zoning (was say what?)

g. crabtree jampot at roadrunner.com
Sat Sep 22 07:08:30 PDT 2007


"Collage kids drinking beer" have a proven track record of getting into cars 
or hopping onto motorcycles and killing themselves and others. I don't think 
that you need a particularly keen memory to be able to dredge up several 
instances of this recently being the case. When Captain Weaver assigns a 
higher priority to preventing deaths then handing out tickets I really don't 
think that he's being particularly capricious or arbitrary. I think he's 
displaying good judgment.

g
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 3:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] discrimination and zoning (was say what?)


>I don't know Tom, there always seem to be plenty of officers at the
> beginning of fall semester to investigate college kids drinking beer.
>
> Sunil
>
>
>>From: Tom Ivie <the_ivies3 at yahoo.com>
>>To: Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] discrimination and zoning (was say what?)
>>Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:02:03 -0700 (PDT)
>>
>>Another argument for adding to our police force.
>>
>>bill bonte <bbonte at moscow.com> wrote: Evidently it's much easier to pass
>>laws, ordinances and zoning codes than it is to enforce them.  We need
>>strict enforcement of existing laws, ordinances and codes.  How about
>>enforcing speed limits.  The chief of
>>police has informed me that officers have more important things to do than
>>enforce traffic laws.  Maybe this
>>is true of noise and parking ordinances also.
>>
>>
>>Newer developments have CC&Rs, another unenforceable set of codes written
>>to assure prospective buyers their property values are safe, but in 
>>reality
>>useless.
>>
>>
>>If Moscow had strict enforcement of zoning codes, the Verizon building
>>would never have been sold to NSA
>>in the first place.
>>
>>
>>Bill Bont
>>
>>
>>On Sep 20, 2007, at 2:46 PM, keely emerinemix wrote:
>>
>>  Noise IS covered under an ordinance; other forms of illegal behavior
>>under others.  And the number of people, whether contemplative monks or
>>hard-partying college boys, also is covered under ordinance.  Has been for
>>at least 15 years.  That's because -- and it really IS this simple -- 
>>renting to non-family members constitutes running a business, one that the
>>City has long decided is unlawful in areas zoned not for business, but for
>>single-family homes.
>>
>>Period.
>>
>>Rocket science need not be employed here, but I would invite doubters to
>>remember the preschool lessons of "obey rules" and "break rules" if 
>>they're
>>further confused.
>>
>>keely
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:38:43 -0700
>> > From: lfalen at turbonet.com
>> > To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com; the_ivies3 at yahoo.com;
>>vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What? Discrimination
>> >
>> > It seems to me that controlling the number people that live in a house
>>is a round about way of getting at the "stated problem"
>> > If noise is the problem regulate that. If parking is a problem regulate
>>that. The only problem I see with the number of people living in one house
>>would be a potential safety problem.
>> > Roger
>> > -----Original message-----
>> > From: Donovan Arnold donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
>> > Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2007 19:57:07 -0700
>> > To: Tom Ivie the_ivies3 at yahoo.com, Moscow Vision 2020
>>vision2020 at moscow.com
>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What? Discrimination
>> >
>> > > Tom Ivie,
>> > >
>> > >   Lowering the number of occupants per housing unit by law increases
>>demand for more apartments and housing units, driving the cost up. With
>>rents up even more, renters are further soaked again by limiting the 
>>number
>>of people they can split rent with.
>> > >
>> > >   Moscow is a college town. Students cannot afford much more that 
>> > > $300
>>piece for rent. IF Moscow raises its rents, the number of students
>>returning to UI will reduce because they cannot afford to live in the city
>>with no jobs and unaffordable housing. Many of them will elect elsewhere 
>>to
>>attend like BSU, Albertson, NNU, ISU, LCSC or the new junior college in
>>Nampa. But this is a good move for the socialists agenda of destroying the
>>Moscow economy through relentless unneeded government regulation.
>> > >
>> > >   Best,
>> > >
>> > >   Donovan
>> > >
>> > > Tom Ivie <the_ivies3 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > >   Doesn't it include a CUP process?  As I understand it, and I could
>>be wrong, lowering the number brings Moscow more in-line with the codified
>>number that the majority of cities our size use.
>> > >
>> > > Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:     "These three
>>people [(Pall, Ament and Lamar)] feel that counting unrelated people in a
>> > > dwelling will solve noise and parking problems in residential
>> > > neighborhoods."
>> > >
>> > >   Mr. Busch is correct on this point. I think counting the number of
>>unrelated people is discriminatory. When I worked at Inclusion North there
>>were often several people with disabilities living in one home because 
>>they
>>cannot afford their own place on a $660 a month SSI check, especially in a
>>city like Moscow. There are many poor, disabled, and elderly people that
>>MUST live together in one dwelling for economic survival. This code is a
>>raw deal for those that are in need of affordable housing. Another example
>>of elitist socialists trying to make everyone live like them regardless of
>>their financial situations. The City Council members are saying, "Let them
>>eat cake", or in this case, let them live in an apartment with only two
>>people if they can only afford to live in an apartment with four others.
>> > >
>> > >   And on the other side of the coin, a family of two adults with two
>>teenagers can be very noisy and make life for their neighbors intolerable.
>>Why not limit how many teenagers can live in one household, or how many
>>babies a single mom can have? It would be just as unfair.
>> > >
>> > >   An unjust law, clearly invented by people living in nice homes with
>>secure incomes. I hope the newly elected city council will reverse this
>>piece of discrimination.
>> > >
>> > >   If Moscow would allow for the building of affordable housing for
>>what people actually earn in Moscow we would not have 5 students or 5
>>people on SSI living in one housing unit. And BTW, Moscow has more people
>>per housing unit then any other city in the state according the BLS.
>> > >
>> > >   Best,
>> > >
>> > >   Donovan
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>> > >   In a letter to the editor of the Lewiston Tribune, published today
>> > > (September 16, 2007), Steve Busch suggests that "enforcing existing
>>law
>> > > [Moscow Zoning Code] is all that is necessary."
>> > >
>> > > -----------------------------------------------------------
>> > >
>> > > Comments made in a letter to the editor authored by local attorney
>>Jack
>> > > Porter and published in the Sept. 12 Lewiston Tribune cannot be
>>ignored. On
>> > > Sept. 4, the current city council voted 3-2 to change Moscow's city
>>code in
>> > > an attempt to deal with a real problem.
>> > >
>> > > Unfortunately, the majority (Pall, Ament and Lamar) threw the baby 
>> > > out
>>with
>> > > the bath water. These three people feel that counting unrelated 
>> > > people
>>in a
>> > > dwelling will solve noise and parking problems in residential
>>neighborhoods.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > The Greater Moscow Alliance feel enforcing existing law is all that 
>> > > is
>> > > necessary. We said so in a letter presented to the council on Sept. 
>> > > 10
>>(to
>> > > see a copy visit www.greatermoscow.org). Mr. Porter thinks this is
>>evidence
>> > > the GMA is insensitive to Moscow citizens' cherished life style.
>>Nothing
>> > > could be further from the truth. GMA is working hard to educate the
>>public
>> > > about issues and candidates.
>> > >
>> > > I urge all Moscow voters to ask candidates for city council tough
>>questions.
>> > > Listen carefully to the answers and vote your conscience.
>> > >
>> > > Steve Busch
>> > > President
>> > > Greater Moscow Alliance
>> > > Moscow
>> > >
>> > > -----------------------------------------------------------
>> > >
>> > > Questions, Mr. Busch: How often, and how selective, should 
>> > > enforcement
>>of
>> > > zoning codes be enforced? Instead of amending the current code ad
>>nauseam
>> > > and allowing for conditional use permits every time somebody violates
>> > > "existing law", should we draw the proverbial line in the sand, much
>>like
>> > > the Raven, strongly proclaim "Ne'er more", and further demand that
>>those
>> > > entities that are currently in violation of the zoning code move
>>elsewhere?
>> > >
>> > > Reminder, folks!
>> > > http://tinyurl.com/36ghxk
>> > >
>> > > Seeya round town, Moscow.
>> > >
>> > > Tom Hansen
>> > > Moscow, Idaho
>> > >
>> > > "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students. The
>>college
>> > > students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."
>> > >
>> > > - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > =======================================================
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>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Tom & Liz Ivie
>> > > ---------------------------------
>> > >   Don't let your dream ride pass you by. Make it a reality with 
>> > > Yahoo!
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>> > >
>> > > ---------------------------------
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>>
>>---------------------------------
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>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>
>>
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>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>                http://www.fsr.net
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>>
>>
>>Tom & Liz Ivie
>>
>>---------------------------------
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>
>
>>=======================================================
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>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>=======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>               http://www.fsr.net
>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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