[Vision2020] Rose's Cleaning House & Comments (was RE: It's not "cyberstalking" unless you harass someone, )

Sat May 5 15:40:35 PDT 2007

"I have never given a fig if others agree with me or not, and I don’t need external affirmation to validate my beliefs, or prop up my sense of self-esteem."

  Why would someone who truly believes what they wrote above create a website? If they don't care what others have to say or to hear them, why go through the trouble of creating a website? There is a big gap in logic here unless the author might believe only they have something intelligent and useful to offer. 

  One thing that is nice about V2020 is that everyone is equal in the format. 

  Best,

  Donovan 

Saundra Lund <sslund at roadrunner.com> wrote:
  Mr. Crabtree,

Here is an explanation that perhaps you *can* understand since you don't
seem to get it from what Rose apparently wrote to you "directly and
personally":

"I welcome your comments, but this is a monitored website and I will not
publish racist, sexist, homophobic, or anonymous remarks. If you won’t claim
it, you don’t get to say it on my blog. Well, actually, I might publish some
samples of dim-witted emails in order to expose the intellectual and moral
defectives that, sadly, are not all together uncommon in this neck of the
woods. I have never given a fig if others agree with me or not, and I don’t
need external affirmation to validate my beliefs, or prop up my sense of
self-esteem. However, I do expect responders to demonstrate civility,
intelligence, integrity, and, it is to be hoped, an abundance of good humor.
Please note: the comments section is not quite ready. I will alert readers
as soon as it is. Thanks for your patience."

Is that any clearer for you??? I hope so!

Kudos to Rose for not intending to allow the kind of hate-mongering Dale
Courtney welcomes!

Saundra Lund
Moscow, ID

The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do
nothing.
- Edmund Burke

***** Original material contained herein is Copyright 2006 through life plus
70 years, Saundra Lund.  Do not copy, forward, excerpt, or reproduce outside
the Vision 2020 forum without the express written permission of the
author.*****

-----Original Message-----
From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com]
On Behalf Of g. crabtree
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 2:39 PM
To: Art Deco; Vision 2020
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking" unless you harass
someone,

I stand (and without a walker no less!) by previously made remarks. Rose's
site does not currently allow comments and she told me directly and
personally that when they were allowed they would be allowed only "within
appropriate parameters" (note the quotation marks, her words not mine)
Dale's site allows commentary and he does not censor the remarks that
appear. When you or Keely make an unsupported assertion it does not
automatically become exposure of lies, but you already knew that didn't you?
I suspect you've been using these sorts of disingenuous tactics since the
Smoot/Hawley debates when you were a somewhat younger crank.

g

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Art Deco 
To: Vision 2020 
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking" unless you harass
someone,

Gary,

Keely has already exposed your lies about Courtney's the nature
web-blots. I only view them when receiving a link from a local person or
from the crackpot tracking service to which I subscribe. You'd be surprised
at how often your hero Cultmaster Wilson and his various toadies show up.

However, I take great, great offense at your statement:

"At your advanced age you shouldn't get so agitated."

I am only 350 or so in locksmith years.

W.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: keely emerinemix 
To: g. crabtree ; Art Deco
; Vision 2020 
Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 12:39 PM
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking" unless you harass
someone,

Ummm, hey? Gary? Rose's blog says she allows comments. Just not
bigoted ones. She gets to decide.

Also, while we're on topic here, I can assure you, as someone
slandered and mocked by Dale Courtney quite regularly over the last four
years, his is not about news with a modicum of commentary. It's just nasty
and snide, with a modicum of respect for actual facts.

keely

________________________________

From: jampot at adelphia.net
To: deco at moscow.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
Date: Sat, 5 May 2007 10:29:30 -0700
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking" unless
you harass someone,

My goodness, Wayne all those years of bottled up spleen are
certainly making themselves apparent in today's posting aren't they? (what
is it now, 101? You don't look a day over 98 but you are a testament to the
notion that old and grumpy do go hand in hand) Lets address your little
hissy fit in the order that you excreted it.

You take me to task for the sentence:

"Apparently it's more fun to simply broadcast your
irrefutable wisdom to the world and not have to deal with the unpleasantness
of actual debate."

Mr. Courtney's blog is a news/items of interest site with a
modicum of commentary tossed in on the side. Not screeds and lengthy
personnel political rants. A greatly appreciated aspect to his using this
format is that items of interest to him are not directed to and clogging up
the greater groups inbox unlike certain others who shall remain nameless.

In my memory of Dale's posts to the V he did a fine job of
expressing and defending his view points, as did Rose. The difference was
that Dale was the lone mongoose in the viper pit and Rose sang with the
choir. I perfectly understand how being the minority voice can become
tiresome and, eventually, not worth the effort. In conversations I have had
with Dale I have done my best, sorry as it is, to convince and encourage him
to rejoin the fray. Lord knows I would enjoy an additional conservative
voice here to help sing the counterpoint to the rest of ya'lls dreary dirge.
Do I have "distain and censure" for Rose and her new endeavor? Not hardly,
I'm not wild about the fact that it doesn't allow for comments (as Dale's
does) but I have been assured that this is but a temporary thing and will
change "soon." I have been informed that comments must fall within
"appropriate parameters" and this IS a type of censorship I'm not
particularly fond of. I truly fail to see how anything I have posted might
be construed as being in favor of limiting anyone's free expression. You
seem to be laboring under the erroneous and fatuous assumption that Rose and
I are enemies of some sort. Nothing could be further from the truth. We get
on rather well, all things considered and I wish her nothing but the best in
her latest whimsy and I hope that it doesn't suffer the same ignoble fate
that lil' Joannie's did.

Whether I have "exhibited yourself for all to see as a
phony" is for others to decide. What I have been trying to express is my
contention that more light (and heat) is shed in an unmediated, unrestrained
setting and that it's the venue that I, personally prefer (even if it means
having to endure silly fonts & unrestrained use of color) for hashing out
the topics de jour as opposed to having to listen (read) someone hold forth
ad nauseum.

Now hows about you have yourself a nice little nap and try
and get a little more fiber in your diet and see if your cranky and
constipated outlook don't take a remarkable turn for the better. At your
advanced age you shouldn't get so agitated.

g

From: Art Deco 
To: Vision 2020 
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 10:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking"
unless you harass someone,

Well, Gary,

I am surprised that you have the stupidity to
mention and to champion Dale Courtney's web-blots so soon after you wrote
the following about Rose Huskey and others:

"Apparently it's more fun to simply broadcast your
irrefutable wisdom to the world and not have to deal with the unpleasantness
of actual debate."

Are you too busy playing with your keys to see that
Courtney runs his own web-blots in part because he was not able to
effectively defend his positions on V 2020, and so that he may remove
comments that he doesn't like, or remove comments that point out where he
either misquotes, quotes out of context, or quotes incompletely to give the
wrong impression. It's all right for Dale Courtney, but not for Rose
Huskey?

Further, you pretended a few days ago to be
staunchly anti-censorship and a true defender of freedom of speech
"Censorship sucks" were your words. Now you express disdain and censure for
those who dare, like your hero Courtney, to express themselves in a blog - a
decidedly anti-free-expression position on your part.

You sir, have just exhibited yourself for all to see
as a phony, whose writings express a desire to control what others say and
do almost as much as do the cultmaster's!

Wayne A. Fox
1009 Karen Lane
PO Box 9421
Moscow, ID 83843

(208) 882-7975
waf at moscow.com

----- Original Message ----- 
From: g. crabtree 
To: Tom Hansen ;
heirdoug at netscape.net ; vision2020 at moscow.com 
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 7:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not "cyberstalking"
unless you harass someone,

I know I'm probably going to regret this but my
curiosity is hopelessly piqued. Just exactly what action did you take that
would serve as a shining example for others to emulate? Is it the thinly
veiled vulgarities in your post? Is it maintaining a hate web site against a
small local protestant congregation? Is it endlessly posting of news tidbits
that you think should be of interest to others? Is it your tireless and
constant monitoring of Dale Courtney's web site? I'd really like to know
what it is so I could thank you properly for your ongoing good works. (once
their identified)

g

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Tom Hansen 

To: heirdoug at netscape.net ;
vision2020 at moscow.com 
Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 5:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] It's not
"cyberstalking" unless you harass someone,

No-Clue –

You keep submitting gutless threats. Is
that all there is to you? My guess is “Yes”.

I am going to repeat a comment I made to you
a long time ago:

“SH*T OR GET THE HELL OFF THE POT!”

Loosely translated that means: Be a
FRIGGIN’ man for once in your spineless, ignorantly childish life! Crawl
out from under that rock of yours and DO SOMETHING. Either take action or
SHUT the EFF UP!

I have set an example for you to follow when
I took action in the past (and will continue to do so in the future).

Jeesh!

Tom Hansen

Moscow, Idaho

“Uh, how about a 1-strike law. Death doesn't
seem too extreme for a Level-3 sex offender.”

- Dale “Comb-Over” Courtney (August 3, 2005)

________________________________

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com
[mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of heirdoug at netscape.net
Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2007 9:17 PM
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: [Vision2020] It's not
"cyberstalking" unless you harass someone,

And I quote, ".... course of conduct
constitute an implied threat."

Wow J.,

That would have to be the best example of
point proving since Joan's "jack-boot-vasectomy-procedure" from many months
past.

There is nothing like being the poster girl
for the Intoleristas! Is there.

D.

I'd tell you go do yourself, but you'd have
to grow some first. Which isn't 
about to happen this late in the game, now
is it?

The end.

J :]

________________________________

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