[Vision2020] webcam questions -- please help
Joe Campbell
joekc at adelphia.net
Fri Jun 15 10:47:47 PDT 2007
Bill,
When I was on sabbatical in Jersey, Delphine and I communicated on Skype with an iSight camera. Worked pretty well. If you'd like, I could lend you mine and you could give it a try.
Best, Joe
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Don't change the subject DOUG (Glenn Schwaller)
2. Re: Killing grass (Bill London)
3. Re: construction maze in Moscow every June (Paul Rumelhart)
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Message: 1
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2007 08:10:48 -0700
From: "Glenn Schwaller" <vpschwaller at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Don't change the subject DOUG
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Message-ID:
<323338460706150810td030c7ekad427a87c333b121 at mail.gmail.com>
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Dr. What You Wish,
Ok, cheap shot, but it was one that had to be taken, seeing how you
constantly accuse me of not listening to you or answering your questions.
If it were true that "the writer of those posts is a pastor at a local
church who is pretending to be someone he is not. . . what would you think
of that pastor?"
I don't think I would ally myself with him in matters of a personal,
religious, political, or social nature.
"Would you think he was crazy?"
Crazy? No.
"Would you think that he was a danger to the town that you lived in?"
Unless he is harboring terrorists, criminals (aye there's the rub), or
threatening to physically harm me or others, I wouldn't think he was a
danger. I might questions his motives, but I wouldn't necessarily assume
they were nefarious.
"Would you worry?"
Well, I wouldn't let it keep me up at night. I come across all sorts of
pretenders in the course of my day - I don't worry about them either.
"I don't think that you are a pastor of a local church,"
Well, THAT'S encouraging. I'm not a pastor of ANY church for that matter.
". . . although you sound like one."
Which in itself sounds a lot like statements tossed out by Bob "our hero"
Herodotus. That could lead one to consider the fact Dr. Joe is posting
under a pseudonym as well. I don't think you are, but you sound like him.
. . . what would you think of such a man (who) might not actually write the
posts but that he encourages others to do so?"
I'd wonder why he was too lazy / afraid / unable to write his own stuff.
But I'd probably be a little more concerned about the individual who follows
such encouragement.
As far as arguments are useless when it comes to changing one's beliefs,
that was probably a bit stronger of a statement then I wanted. I wasn't
intending to say "stop arguing about stuff, it's useless" but that in many
instances, presenting two or more sides of a topic doesn't change an
individuals viewpoint. Sometimes it does, sometime it causes them to dig in
even harder. Too often, people are in the "don't confuse me with facts"
mode, and are not willing to consider other perspectives. That to me is
when arguments seems useless. So I'll retract my previous statement, if I
may. See? You made a valid arguments and it changed my beliefs! I'm not
as hopeless as you want me to be.
As far as "Mr Campbell" is concerned, I don't recall, or didn't read (until
now) you stating you didn't want to be called Mr Campbell.
Glenn
On 6/15/07, Joe Campbell <joekc at adelphia.net> wrote:
>
> Good question, Schwaller!
>
> Rational discourse is difficult, so I don't think that faulty reasoning is
> necessarily an indication of some kind of character flaw -- unless the
> faulty reasoning is intentional. Deliberately using fallacies, deception, or
> lies in an effort to get someone to believe something is an indication of a
> character flaw but that is more than bad reasoning. Thus, if "one arrives at
> an incorrect assumption or conclusion based on logic and reasoning" it
> doesn't necessarily "say anything about the individual." Though it would if
> the person were a liar.
>
> Which brings me to a hypothetical question. First suppose that you are not
> Glenn Schwaller but that you're someone else like me, reading the posts of a
> man who calls himself 'Glenn Schwaller.' Suppose also that the writer of
> these posts is not named 'Glenn Schwaller' and that no one with that name
> exists locally. Furthermore, suppose that the writer of those posts is a
> pastor at a local church who is pretending to be someone he is not. If this
> were true, what would you think of that pastor? Would you think he was
> crazy? Would you think that he was a danger to the town that you lived in?
> Would you worry?
>
> Remember this is a hypothetical question -- I confessed last time that I
> don't think that you are a pastor of a local church, although you sound like
> one. Keep in mind EVERYTHING that you've said so far. If you were someone
> else reading the posts of 'Glenn Schwaller' and it turned out that the
> writer of those posts was actually a pastor of a local church, what would
> you think of that man? I guess we should suppose, also, that the pastor
> might not actually write the posts but that he encourages others to do so.
> Still, what would you think of such a man?
>
> Since I have your attention and you're finally answering my questions, I
> have another question. I might have asked this before but not directly.
>
> Given that it "seems to you" that "arguments are useless when it comes to
> changing one's beliefs," why do you raise topics like polygamy? It can't
> really be, as you say, an attempt "to generate some discussion on the issue;
> an 'attempt to dialogue' if you will." What is the point of dialogue given
> that you are of the "opinion" that "arguments are useless when it comes to
> changing one's beliefs"? This, by the way, is one reason why I think you're
> merely throwing poop bombs and not actually attempting to engage in
> dialogue. What, according to your own opinions and seemings, is the point of
> dialogue?
>
> There is another question that I asked you previously [Sun Jun 3 18:00:52
> PDT 2007] but I'll save that for another time. Thanks!
>
> And please call me 'Joe,' which I prefer. My gripe was not with folks
> calling me 'Mr. Campbell' as opposed to 'Dr. Campbell.' It was folks calling
> me 'Mr. Campbell' after I happened to mention that I didn't like it. It is
> the stick in the eye that bugs me, not the name. Call me what you wish.
>
> --
> Joe Campbell
>
> ----------------
>
> Thu Jun 14 17:55:49 PDT 2007
>
> Since I have not read a re-write of the history of American slavery, I am
> in
> no position to compare that with the Holocaoust, denial or otherwise. And
> I
> have no idea what I have done that would suggest I use my religion as a
> "shield for my actions."
>
> If one arrives at an incorrect assumption or conclusion based on logic and
> reasoning, does this say anything about the individual, or their reasoning
> processes, or both? Is their logic invalid, or is their interpretation of
> the data faulty?
>
> Glenn
>
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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2007 09:46:36 -0700
From: "Bill London" <london at moscow.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Killing grass
To: "TIM RIGSBY" <tim.rigsby at hotmail.com>, <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Message-ID: <00eb01c7af6c$bd4234f0$0200a8c0 at techlab>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
T-
yes, the Co-op news did print an article about using vinegar to kill weeds. And we can certify that it works. Use vinegar in spray bottle mid-day on hot sunny day. Spray on weeds.
We actually got rid of Canadian thistle that way (took several applications per plant over a season).
However, it does not seem to kill grass.
BL
----- Original Message -----
From: TIM RIGSBY
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2007 8:45 PM
Subject: [Vision2020] Killing grass
Visionaries:
I recently purchased a house in Boise and am very ambitious about yard work and such. Anyway my yard consists of mostly weeds with very little grass. Also the grade is horrible especially when I flood irrigate, it flows towards my house (not good). Anyway, I want to kill everything, rototill, set grade, fine grade, install sprinklers, and drill seed. However, I don't want to use harsh chemicals to kill and I am not patient enough to let it die on its own. Memory serves me that the Co-Op wrote an article about using vinegar to kill weeds. Any ideas on whether on not vinegar would kill my yard. Or are there other things that I can use to kill it. Tarps are not a great solution either.
Tim
" 'Politics is the art of controlling your environment.' That is one of the key things I learned in these years, and I learned it the hard way. Anybody who thinks that 'it doesn't matter who's President' has never been Drafted and sent off to fight and die in a vicious, stupid War on the other side of the World -- or been beaten and gassed by Police for trespassing on public property -- or been hounded by the IRS for purely political reasons -- or locked up in the Cook County Jail with a broken nose and no phone access and twelve perverts wanting to stomp your ass in the shower. That is when it matters who is President or Governor or Police Chief. That is when you will wish you had voted." - Hunter S. Thompson
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Message: 3
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 18:31:53 -0700
From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] construction maze in Moscow every June
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Message-ID: <4671EC09.20808 at yahoo.com>
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Philip,
My bad. Thanks for the info. I appreciate it.
Paul
Philip Cook wrote:
> Paul,
>
> Your premise is false. The reasons more road construction begins in
> June is that the weather is more likely to be warm and dry, and
> traffic levels are lower because students are gone. (Usually the City
> and ITD get criticized for starting projects too late in the
> year---August---just as the students are returning.)
>
> Most streets in town are owned by the City. The City's fiscal year
> runs October-October so any connection between fiscal years and
> City-funded street reconstruction is coincidental. The University's
> and state (e.g., ITD) fiscal years do run July to July, but
> construction projects are usually planned and bid several months in
> advance.
>
> I'm not sure what all projects are on the plate for this summer, but
> I'll ask for a rundown this afternoon at Transportation Commission and
> report back
>
> Philip
>
>
>
>> Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2007 18:09:50 -0700
>> From: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
>> Subject: [Vision2020] construction maze in Moscow every June
>>
>
>
>> Is it true that more construction happens in June here in town because
>> the money has to be spent before fiscal year or it won't be reallocated
>> again? Presumably the fiscal year that is being talked about is July 1st.
>>
>> If this is true, is there some reason why the whole fiscal year can't be
>> budgeted better so that more of what is needed to be done is handled at
>> the start of the fiscal year instead of at the end?
>>
>> I'm just asking because I'm tired of finding alternate routes not
>> blocked by construction again and again so that you have to get creative
>> to get anywhere. It's not as bad this year as in previous years, but
>> the construction on 6th, 3rd, Jackson and other places is starting to
>> make it interesting when you have to go anywhere near there. I'm just
>> wondering if it's destined to get worse in the next couple of weeks
>> before the 1st.
>>
>> Also, I don't mean to sound ungrateful that our streets are being
>> fixed. I'd just like the construction to be stretched out a bit more
>> both in time and space.
>>
>> Anybody know what's on the list to be fixed in the near future?
>>
>> Paul
>>
>
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