[Vision2020] Eavesdropping

Sunil Ramalingam sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
Fri Mar 3 07:31:11 PST 2006 

Pat,

First, where did I use the words 'storm troopers' in my post?

Second, under FISA the government can get warrants AFTER listening in.  The 
Bush Administration is refusing to use FISA's provisions at all, instead 
claiming unlimited power.

Third, they are not being honest about what they are doing.  Bush has NOT 
qualified his listening, and has lied about using warrants since this 
program started.

Sunil


>From: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>
>To: "vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Eavesdropping
>Date: Thu, 2 Mar 2006 23:18:57 -0800
>
>How in the world do you get from cell phones making foreign calls and
>talking about bombs to storm troopers entering houses?? The issues are
>totally different and new technology in communications require new ways of
>working for the courts and cops. I love warrants...I just do not want to 
>tie
>the hands of the cops so tightly that we are not safe. There has to be a 
>way
>for us to work this out so that responsible people can check out bad people
>before someone or a lot of someones die...not after. I understand the
>problem Phil but at least Bush has qualified his listening...we just have 
>to
>pray for who ever is next that they have some integrity. (Oh Joy, here 
>comes
>all the attacks on Bush.....)
>
>
>Sunil
>
>What about the case of wireless transmission?  My understanding was that in
>the case of portable phones and radio phones the rules with regards to
>warrants were not the same as with land lines.  Would the same rule be true
>if satellite or cell phones were involved?
>
>Then the other question would be if a call originates from out side of
>CONUS, do those rules apply?
>
>Phil
>
>PS, To Pat, its a pretty rare case that would justify warrantless search.
>Its a way slippery slope to domestic spying once it becomes standard
>procedures and if it gets allowed under one party, what happens when the
>other gets into power?
>
>
> >From: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
> >To: pkraut at moscow.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Eavesdropping
> >Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2006 23:18:23 -0800
> >
> >Pat,
> >
> >Do you welcome the police to come and search through your home without a
> >warrant?  If they don't find anything, no harm, right?
> >
> >I know they won't find anything illegal in my house, but for my part, if
> >they want to search it, they need a warrant.  That's what required by
> >what's left of the Fourth Amendment, and I will hold them to it.
> >
> >You've written in the past that you have taught the Constitution.  What
> >does the Bill of Rights mean to you?  Surely it wasn't written with the
> >'What are you trying to hide?' attitude of your post below.
> >
> >Sunil
> >
> >
> >>From: "Pat Kraut" <pkraut at moscow.com>
> >>To: "vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Eavesdropping
> >>Date: Wed, 1 Mar 2006 22:19:17 -0800
> >>
> >>If you were talking about planting bombs and visiting in the middle east
> >>then yes your calls could be should be heard. If you called your parents
> >>in
> >>Florida and didn't talk about bombs then they would find that your not 
>who
> >>they are looking for...it isn't that hard.
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "Tom Hansen" <idahotom at hotmail.com>
> >>To: <pkraut at moscow.com>; <vision2020 at moscow.com>
> >>Cc: <idahotom at hotmail.com>
> >>Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 11:51 AM
> >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Eavesdropping
> >>
> >>
> >>Ms. Kraut -
> >>
> >>I believe that Mr. Reynolds is suggesting that Mr. Nisbet relay his 
>claim
> >>of
> >>beinig a "victim" of warrantless wiretaps to the media.  A claim, such 
>as
> >>Mr. Nisbet's (that he was unlawfully wiretapped by the Department of
> >>Justice
> >>during the Clinton administration), would certainly draw some well
> >>deserved
> >>attention.
> >>
> >>If my residence were unlawfully wiretapped by the Department of Justice 
>I
> >>most certainly would not wait a considerable length of time only to
> >>discuss
> >>it on V2020.
> >>
> >>Ms. Kraut goes on to ask:
> >>
> >>"If a person can buy a throw away cell phone in a store (maybe a[t] 
>Wally
> >>World!) use if for the two hours there is time for talk about bombs and
> >>then
> >>the number is no longer good how do you think they should get a 
>warrant?"
> >>
> >>You know something, Ms. Kraut:  Over the past couple years when I flew
> >>down
> >>to visit my parents in Los Angeles, and before I purchased a cell phone, 
>I
> >>made use of those throw-away cell phones.  They are inexpense and handy.
> >>
> >>Is it your belief that "they" should have detained me simply because I 
>had
> >>a
> >>throw-away cell phone?  Should "they" detain everybody that uses those
> >>throw-away cell phones?
> >>
> >>You see, Ms. Kraut, there is a reason why our founding fathers were kind
> >>enough to bless our private lives with the US Constitution's fourth
> >>amendment.
> >>
> >>But then, George Bush is not only above the law, HE IS THE LAW and, as
> >>everybody knows, . . .
> >>
> >>"The law is for protection of the people."
> >>http://www.tomandrodna.com/Sounds/Protection.mp3
> >>
> >>"Ah, so thank your lucky stars you got protection
> >>Walk the line and never mind the cost.
> >>Don't wonder who them lawmen was protectin',
> >>When they nailed the saviour to the cross."
> >>
> >>Seeya round town, Moscow.
> >>
> >>Tom Hansen
> >>Moscow, Idaho
> >>
> >>
> >>_____________________________________________________
> >>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >>                http://www.fsr.net
> >>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >>¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
> >
> >
> >_____________________________________________________
> >List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the
> >communities of the Palouse since 1994.                 http://www.fsr.net
> >                              mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
>http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
>_____________________________________________________
>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>                http://www.fsr.net
>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

More information about the Vision2020 mailing list