[Vision2020] Pat Kraut, area churches, and teachingsabouthomosexuality

[g. crabtree]

Mr. or Ms. Ford, The point I was trying to make was that Mr. Wilson did not 
single handedly change the cities dress code. He and others petitioned the 
city council for a change in exactly the same manor as the anti wal-mart 
folks are asking for changes right now. I was pointing out a glaring double 
standard by which its OK for one group to ask for their concerns to be heard 
and "evil" for the other group to do the same. Where the Sam Hill do I 
"demand" anyone stop saying anything? Where do I give you the slightest idea 
I don't like what I'm reading? What I have to wonder is what it is that you 
and Mr. Campbell are reading because it sure isn't my post.

G. Crabtree
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
To: <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 10:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Pat Kraut, area churches,and 
teachingsabouthomosexuality


> Mr. Crabtree (whom I do not know from anyone) is apparently pulling a 
> "wilsonism" - you don't like what is being said, you demand the person 
> stop saying it.
>
> On poohsthink.com, that very issue is being experienced:
>
> "I look forward to the above promised post in which you justify the 
> existence of this blog" (Ed Lang)
>
> Since when does anyone have to "justify" a blog, an e-mail, or anything to 
> these people?  As has been repeatedly pointed out, this is a democracy we 
> live in and we all have the right (and duty) to speak out against what we 
> may feel is a wrong being done, be it to a town, a group of people, a 
> person.
>
> I make this suggestion:  You don't like what you read - don't read anymore 
> V2020 entries.  Simple, quick and may even lower the blood pressure.
>
> BTW, Joe - good post.
>
> J  :]
>
>
>
>
>>From: joekc at adelphia.net
>>To: "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net>
>>CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Pat Kraut, area churches, and 
>>teachingsabouthomosexuality
>>Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 12:18:07 -0500
>>
>>Mr. Crabtree,
>>
>>Perhaps I could have been clearer but I never claimed that Wilson was evil 
>>because he attempted to change Moscowâ?Ts laws about proper dress. I said 
>>that this action was a public one and gave me a right to comment and 
>>critique his views. Just as my attempts to keep Wal-Mart out of Moscow are 
>>public actions and give you the right to critique my views. The evil, I 
>>claimed, came in the form of Wilsonâ?Ts deliberately offensive comments 
>>toward gays and lesbians. No one has the right to be deliberately 
>>offensive. (Which is why I appologized to you about my own deliberately 
>>offensive, public comments directed toward you.)
>>
>>Also, I wish you would show some consistency. If Wilsonâ?Ts comments are 
>>protected under the freedoms of speech and religion, then my criticisms of 
>>him are similarly covered. My comments and position are based on my own 
>>religious and moral viewpoints. It amazes me that you would let a man 
>>whitewash the history of American slavery under the name of â?~freedomâ?T 
>>yet call folks who criticize him â?~intolerant.â?T What an incredible 
>>double standard that is.
>>
>>Furthermore, if Wilsonâ?Ts lobbying efforts have no affect on my freedoms 
>>(a point I have never denied), then my lobbying efforts have no affect on 
>>your freedoms. So stop making comments to the effect that the 
>>anti-Wal-Mart crowd is trying to restrict freedom. By your own words we 
>>cannot do so, it is the elected officials â?" and ultimately the voters 
>>â?" who will keep Super Wal-Mart out of Moscow, if in fact that happens. 
>>No one is restricting anyone's freedoms here. This is how our democratic 
>>process works. Again, just try to follow your own general principles and 
>>show a little consistency.
>>
>>--
>>Joe Campbell
>>
>>---- "g. crabtree" <jampot at adelphia.net> wrote:
>>
>>=============
>>Mr. Campbell seems to forget that while Mr. Wilson was fore square in 
>>favor
>>of changes to the ordinances pertaining to proper dress, he did not change
>>them. For that we had seven elected officials. Mr. Wilson and his
>>congregation very actively lobbied for a change in much the same way that
>>others are trying to make sure our fair flower of a town won't be sullied 
>>by
>>a Wal-Mart superstore. Somehow this makes him "evil" and the no to WM 
>>crowd
>>the chosen ones?
>>
>>gc
>>
>>
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>>
>
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