[Vision2020] stop the false accusations against Sunil
Paul Rumelhart
godshatter at yahoo.com
Tue Aug 22 19:06:36 PDT 2006
Donovan,
You say we have terrorists incarcerated at Gitmo, but how do you really
know that? I'd say we have, at best, suspected terrorists there. Some
of them may simply be suspected terrorist sympathizers, and others may
even be "just in the wrong place at the wrong time with the wrong people
with the wrong racial features wearing the wrong type of clothing".
To turn a "suspected terrorist" into a "convicted terrorist" requires a
court of law. To call them terrorists and treating them as sub-humans
with no evidence presented to a court is throwing some of our ideals out
the window. Personally, I'm tiring of throwing our ideals out the window.
Paul
Donovan Arnold wrote:
> Sunil has stated repeatedly, that he believes that if we cannot find
> each and every terrorist guilty of a crime by a trial, we should let
> them go. Since it is not possible to try every terrorist and get a
> conviction, and he knows this, and we cannot detain them otherwise,
> Sunil is suggesting we let many of them go. I think that is supporting
> the terrorists. Creating a situation where the US military cannot
> defend us by placing the new and unprecedented restriction of a trial
> and conviction for every foreign enemy combatant shooting at us before
> we can lock them up until the conflict is over, cannot be anything but
> favoring the enemy.
>
> I think that Sunil is dead right in his disagreement with Bush on
> foreign policy for opposing torture.. But deadly wrong in making sure
> every enemy of the United States gets a full paid trial on us before
> we can defend the country.
>
> Best,
>
> _DJA
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> */Sunil Ramalingam <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>/* wrote:
>
> I've tried not to post responses to Donovan after Roger's comments
> a couple
> of weeks ago, but I'm sick of his crap. First he and now Tony have
> made the
> irresponsible and incorrect statements that I support terrorists or
> terrorism; certainly Donovan has made the claim that I only defend
> terrorists and sworn enemies of the U.S.
>
> I have tried to explain to Donovan offline with no success that I
> oppose the
> prison in Guantanimo; I oppose the war in Iraq; I oppose the
> torture of
> prisoners and the abandonment of the Geneva Convention; I oppose this
> administration's foreign policy. As far as I know, we're still
> allowed to
> object to our govenrnment's actions. If he wants to say that means
> I defend
> terrorists, then he's going to do that, but he's not going to be
> able to
> defend his lies with anything I've said.
>
> I do object to Donovan's lies about me. I think he's making
> dangerous and
> irresponsible statements about me, and I don't think I should have
> to sit
> here and put up with them. Sure, I could say no one takes anything
> he says
> seriously, but I have no idea who might come across his swill and
> believe
> it.
>
> I never mentioned Tony's wife in my post. If Donovan read that in
> my post I
> have to question his literacy.
>
> Tony told me I was not allowed to change the subject, and I made the
> apparently incomprehensible joke that he mistook himself for my wife.
> Donovan, get your big reading book and look up 'pronouns.' I did
> not and
> would not make fun of Tony's wife. I don't know if he's married
> and don't
> care.
>
> Tony, I have never said I think I'm intellectually superior to
> you. Quit
> being so sensitive. I won't be comparing myself to Lincoln, and
> I'm no
> fancy pants lawyer. I don't think of myself as one, and I don't
> think I'm
> better than anyone else because I'm a lawyer. But if you make
> incorrect
> statements about a legal issue, after a while I'm going to point
> that out to
> you, as I did with your First Amendment statements some time ago,
> and as
> with your recent statements about freedom of expression.
>
> Sunil
>
>
> >From: Donovan Arnold
> >To: Joe Campbell , Tony Simpson
> >
> >CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] stop the false accusations against Sunil
> >Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 11:56:09 -0700 (PDT)
> >
> >Sunil attacked Tony and made a reference to his wife. Why aren't you
> >condemning that Joe? Is making references to people's relatives
> that you
> >don't like now acceptable if the person is not a liberal, Joe.
> Appears to
> >be the case.
> >
> > I hope others join me in condemning attacks on people's
> relatives and
> >spouses, and not defend people that do so.
> >
> > I never said Sunil supported Terrorism, Joe. I said he defends
> >terrorists. Which he has done repeatedly. One can defend the person
> >without condoning the actions of that person.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > _DJA
> >
> >Joe Campbell wrote: Tony,
> >
> >It is one thing to call Sunil offensive names and accuse him of
> being an
> >elitist. The first is just childish and the second merely
> indicates that
> >you just don't know Sunil. Both of these sorts of things only
> make me
> >laugh.
> >
> >But in our contemporary context it is just plain irresponsible
> and wrong
> >to suggest in anyway that Sunil is a supporter of terrorism. Both
> you and
> >Donovan have made this absurd accusation -- neither one of you even
> >attempting to support the claim in any way. You need to get a grip.
> >
> >I hope that others will join me in condemning these kinds of
> accusations.
> >
> >--
> >Joe Campbell
> >
> >---- Tony Simpson wrote:
> >
> >=============
> >Suenil: Yep pal, I need to go and "oppress someone."
> >
> >Anyone who supports terrorists instead of his own country I will
> oppress.
> >Anyone who revels in rubbing everyone else's nose in his supposed
> >intellectual superiority I will oppress. Anyone who sees no
> injustice in
> >the premeditated murder of the innocent, I will oppress. Anyone
> who tries
> >to deny freedom of expression to those with whom they disagree, I
> will
> >oppress. Anyone who wishes to weaken or destroy the institutions
> that have
> >held civilization together, I will oppress.
> >
> >So get used to it Lawyer Man, I'm not going anywhere.
> >
> >Despising arrogant and smug elitists, --TONY
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Sunil Ramalingam"
> >Cc:
> >Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 7:24 AM
> >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom
> >
> >
> > > Tony,
> > >
> > > You're the one who brings up my law degree, not me. Since you
> inquired
> > > about how I passed the bar, I thought I'd answer you.
> > >
> > > If you're well-informed, Tony, you're hiding your light under
> a bushel.
> > > Now
> > > I'll get out of your hair; you probably need to go oppress
> someone.
> > >
> > > Sunil
> > >
> > >
> > >>From: "Tony Simpson"
> > >>To: "Sunil Ramalingam"
> > >>CC:
> > >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom
> > >>Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 23:02:33 -0700
> > >>
> > >>Sunil,
> > >>
> > >>Me mistaking myself for your wife? I'm afraid I have
> absolutely no idea
> > >>what you are talking about. But pal, that equation would NEVER
> work out
> > >>THAT way. The reason for the "hon" comment is old news,
> weren't you
> > >>paying
> > >>attention councilor?
> > >>
> > >>Ya' know, Your fancy pants law degree really doesn't mean SHIT
> to me,
> > >>Sunil. Abraham Lincoln had no formal schooling yet he was as
> brilliant
> >and
> > >>persuasive as any "credentialed" man of his time. As it is
> with you and
> > >>I.
> > >>We are both very well informed, just not necessarily in the
> same exact
> > >>areas. You could really do with a dose of humility, Mr.
> Constitutional
> > >>law
> > >>hotshot.
> > >>
> > >>Now go sue somebody or something..... -Tony
> > >>----- Original Message ----- From: "Sunil Ramalingam"
> > >>
> > >>Cc:
> > >>Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 8:36 PM
> > >>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>For someone who comes across as a homophobe, Tony, it's odd
> to find you
> > >>>mistaking yourself for my wife. However, it prepared me for
> finding
> >your
> > >>>response to Andreas and your use of the endearment, 'Hon,'
> for him.
> >Hey,
> > >>>not that there's anything wrong with it, but does his wife
> know about
> > >>>this?
> > >>>
> > >>>But since you're neither she nor the boss of me, I guess I'm
> allowed to
> > >>>change the subject.
> > >>>
> > >>>I will give you one clue about how I passed the bar exam,
> since you
> > >>>brought
> > >>>it up: On the Constitutional law section, I discussed the
> established
> > >>>law
> > >>>of the United States, not the imagined law and jurisprudence
> of Tony
> > >>>Simpson. Until you're the Fuhrer, I will recommend this
> approach to
> > >>>those
> > >>>preparing for that exam.
> > >>>
> > >>>I understand that you oppose flag burning. That puts you with
> almost
> >the
> > >>>entire population of the United States, since this hardly
> ever happens.
> > >>>I've never seen it in person; have you? But saying it's not
> speech
> >does
> > >>>not
> > >>>make you right, even if you say it in multiple posts. It's
> also pretty
> > >>>ineffective speech, but speech it still is.
> > >>>
> > >>>Sunil
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>>From: "Tony Simpson"
> > >>>>To: "Sunil Ramalingam"
> > >>>>CC:
> > >>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom
> > >>>>Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2006 10:29:17 -0700
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Sunil,
> > >>>>
> > >>>>No, you are not going to be allowed to change the subject.
> Address my
> > >>>>point about the difference between license and freedom.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Standing in opposition to double talking lawyers, --Tony
> > >>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Sunil Ramalingam"
> > >>>>
> > >>>>Cc:
> > >>>>Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 9:44 AM
> > >>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Celebrate freedom
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>=======================================================
> > >>>List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > >>>serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > >>> http://www.fsr.net
> > >>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> > >>>=======================================================
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > > =======================================================
> > > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > > http://www.fsr.net
> > > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> > > =======================================================
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >=======================================================
> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > http://www.fsr.net
> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >=======================================================
> >
> >=======================================================
> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > http://www.fsr.net
> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >=======================================================
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------
> >Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.
>
>
> >=======================================================
> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > http://www.fsr.net
> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >=======================================================
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> All-new Yahoo! Mail
> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=43257/*http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta>-
> Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>=======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>=======================================================
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/attachments/20060822/79b86d25/attachment-0001.htm
More information about the Vision2020
mailing list