[Vision2020] Joan Opyr on 4/22/2006

Art Deco deco at moscow.com
Wed Apr 26 18:15:31 PDT 2006

Doesn't Sherwin have something to do with paint?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tom Hansen" <idahotom at hotmail.com>
To: <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>; <vision2020 at moscow.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 5:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Joan Opyr on 4/22/2006

> In addition to the message originating from Moscow, it originates from a 
> computer terminal ID of SHERWINHOME.
> Does the name "Sherwin" mean anything?
> Tom Hansen
>>From: "J Ford" <privatejf32 at hotmail.com>
>>To: idahotom at hotmail.com
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Joan Opyr on 4/22/2006
>>Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2006 17:45:06 -0700
>>Hey, if this guy is from Lewiston, why is his ISP from Moscow?  I smell 
>>and Ed/rv/Dick in the mix here...what'da think?
>>J  :]
>>>From: "rvrcowboy" <rvrcowboy at clearwire.net>
>>>To: "Vision2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Joan Opyr on 4/22/2006
>>>Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2006 17:13:55 -0700
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>>>X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Apr 2006 00:20:51.0124 (UTC) 
>>>What difference does it make if I know you or not?  And, I looked through 
>>>several translations of the Bible before answering you.  That's why I did 
>>>not answer until now, even though you wrote this rubbish on the 22nd.  I 
>>>also used several different reference materials to research this and 
>>>spoke with the pastor of my church about it.  I believe I understand this 
>>>passage fairly well.
>>>Your need to justify your sexual preference is obviously overriding your 
>>>good sense.  I don't read Greek, or Coptic, or Aramic.  Do you?  Your 
>>>liberal ranting and rattling on with supposed academic prowess is 
>>>irrelevent anyway.  This passage is clear in its meaning if taken in the 
>>>context in which it is contained.
>>>Do you actually believe that, despite all the cites in the Bible 
>>>condeming homosexuality, this one slightly suggestive (at least to you) 
>>>cite justifies your sin?  You need to get a life if you do.  I personally 
>>>do not care what you believe, I only wish to set the record straight to 
>>>others that you are dead wrong in you perverted translation.
>>>Play all the word games you wish, it will not change the fact that you 
>>>only wish there was a passage, any passage, anywhere in the Bible to 
>>>justify your lifestyle.  Your desperate need is reaveled in your own 
>>>words:       Sorry...........   "Now, tell me exactly how it is that you 
>>>know what David and Jonathan got up to when the lights were out? Were you 
>>>a fly on the wall?"
>>>I have no idea what you are talking about as for messing around with you 
>>>name.  Is that another problem you have?
>>>I don't care about your ethnic background, that does not make you an 
>>>expert on anything as far as I am concerned.  Of what relevance is it in 
>>>this discussion anyway?  And you can group me with whomever you please as 
>>>an excuse to diminish me in your own mind but I don't know these people 
>>>you refer too.
>>>Get off the intellectual supueriority band wagon.  You are not impressing 
>>>anyone with it anyway.
>>>   ----- Original Message -----
>>>   From: Joan Opyr
>>>   To: rvrcowboy
>>>   Cc: Vision2020
>>>   Sent: Wednesday, April 26, 2006 3:47 PM
>>>   Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Joan Opyr on 4/22/2006
>>>   On Apr 26, 2006, at 1:17 PM, rvrcowboy wrote:
>>>     Ed is forgetting, of course, that "the soul of Jonathan was bound to 
>>> the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul. Then Jonathan 
>>> made a covenant with David, because he loved him as his own soul." 1 
>>> Samuel 18. So much for Bathsheba. Uriah the Hittite bit the dust for 
>>> nothing.
>>>     Joan Opyr  4/22/2006
>>>     What is Joan trying to make us believe here?  That David and 
>>> Jonathan engaged in homosexual activities with each other?  That is 
>>> crazy, but then again, who should be surprised at that from Joan?
>>>   Do I know you Dick? Have we ever met? I don't think so. Unless, of 
>>> course, we've sat down next to one another at Effie's and dined side by 
>>> side on giant burgers without knowing it. Could be . . .
>>>   Now, tell me what you know about Biblical translation, or translation 
>>> period? Do you read Coptic? Or Greek? How's your Aramaic? Which 
>>> translation of the Bible do you use? Do you have a concordance? Do you 
>>> use it? (Please bear in mind that a translation is not the same thing as 
>>> a version.) Now, tell me exactly how it is that you know what David and 
>>> Jonathan got up to when the lights were out? Were you a fly on the wall? 
>>> That was what, 3,500 years ago? No wonder you're retired.
>>>   What we do know about Jonathan's relationship with David is that, 
>>> according to the "crazy" verse I cited, Jonathan loved David with a love 
>>> surpassing, so much so that he bound his soul to David's. What do you 
>>> call that kind of relationship? Just good friends?
>>>     This chapter and verse is taken completely out of context and has 
>>> nothing to do with homosexual activity what-so-ever but with the bond 
>>> between David and Jonathan (Saul's son) as friends.  Joan has obviously 
>>> never had a friend she trusted or loved with her soul.  Or, perhaps, not 
>>> one that she has not had sex with anyway.
>>>     To offer up this text as evidence that homosexuality is accepted in 
>>> the Bible is ludicrous and bordering on blasphemy.  Talk about a stretch 
>>> of the imagination.... WOW!
>>>     Dick
>>>   I take nothing out of context, Dick -- not this Biblical verse and not 
>>> your crude assumptions about my friendships and my sex life. I am 
>>> blessed in my family and my friendships, and I can name at least a dozen 
>>> people in whom I trust completely. I've only "had sex" with one of them. 
>>> As for evidence that homosexuality was accepted in the Bible, who said 
>>> that's why I offered up this verse? I offered it to demonstrate that gay 
>>> and lesbian relationships are a fact of life as old as time; that men 
>>> have loved men and women have loved women for as long as there have been 
>>> men and women. There are, I believe, 17 references to same-sex relations 
>>> in the Bible. Most do condemn homosexuality. But the Bible also condemns 
>>> the eating of shellfish and the wearing of blended fabrics, and it 
>>> condones (among other things) murder, rape, and incest. Tell me what's 
>>> uplifting and moral about the slaughter of the Amakelites or the story 
>>> of Lot having sex with his daughters, and perhaps I'll listen to your 
>>> ranting against same-sex marriage.
>>>   You think way too much about gay sex, Dick -- and so do Doug Farris, 
>>> Dale Courtney, and our little swan, Ed "Cooper." I can assure you that 
>>> we gay folk think very little about your sex lives. We prefer to hold 
>>> onto our lunches.
>>>   Joan Opyr/Auntie Establishment
>>>   www.joanopyr.com
>>>   PS: Your ideas of blasphemy, Dick, do not correspond with Jewish 
>>> tradition. The devout Jew is encouraged to l'hakshot, meaning the asking 
>>> of probing, difficult questions. We are to take nothing at face value. 
>>> Our religion requires a dialog with God -- a dialog that you'll find in 
>>> the midrash, thousands of years of recorded commentary on the Hebrew 
>>> scriptures. We Jews are not only allowed but expected to ask questions 
>>> of God, and it is not blasphemy to question the scriptures. Far from it. 
>>> It's fine to be a sheep; it's not so hot to be a lemming.
>>>   PPS: I am of English, Welsh, Scottish and Ukrainian Jewish descent. My 
>>> name is pronounced with a hard "j." I'll thank you to stop playing 
>>> around with it. Honestly, if my name were Dick, I'd think twice before I 
>>> messed with anyone else's moniker -- even if it were I. P. Freely.
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>>Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! 
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