[Vision2020] Re: Children's Birth Loan?

Thu Jun 2 16:43:27 PDT 2005

Pell Grants and Student Loans (state or federal) are NOT private - they are 
tax payer's monies (monies that the WORKING class have contributed to a 
STRANGER's education) that students receive through APPLYING for them...and 
if the Idaho legislature listens to what has been happening in other states, 
those "professional students" we have among us will not only begin to re-pay 
those loans sooner, they will also have to start paying taxes on those 
monies.

Loans that cost you nothing?  Are you for real!!?  The interest alone kills 
many a people who make home loans, business loans, EDUCATIONAL loans, credit 
card payments (a broad type of loan) etc.  It does not matter what kind of 
loan you have, "private" or public, you still have to pay it back and with 
interest.  Hence the meaning of LOAN...."1 a : money lent at interest b : 
something lent usually for the borrower's temporary use; 2 a : the grant of 
temporary use."

Loans to have children?  What kind of nuttyness is that!?  And who is being 
paid to "pop out babies" and whose children are YOU personally paying for?  
Tax payers pay from WAGES EARNED, taxed income comes from people who WORK.  
Returning some of that earned tax monies to the parents who take on the 
responsibility of continuing mankind's existance is not asking a whole 
lot...especially considering the tax-exempt status that the privilaged few 
feel they have a right to, no matter how they obtain that classification and 
yet they continue to sponge off of the rest of in regards to the resources 
they use/misuse.  The majority of families in Moscow are NOT 5 or greater in 
children anyway.

Seems to me, also, that you are disparinging against a sector of the society 
that you have in the past so strongly supported and defended - that being 
the poor.  On top of everything else, you want to saddle them with a 
"children's birth loan"?

Get real.

>Joan Opyr writes,
>
>"It's in reference to Mr. Arnold's objections to
>"raising" other peoples' kids, an argument I doubt
>he'd extend to my tax-payer support of his student
>loans.)"
>
>Putting aside Joan's childish name callings and the
>fact that my loans are from the private sector, she
>apparently does not understand the difference between
>loans, which have to be paid back with interest for
>education, and giving away YOUR money that does not
>have to be repaid for having babies.
>
>I am all for free public education and community
>support programs, roads, police, etc. But that is
>entirely a different matter from continually having to
>pay people to pop out babies they cannot afford and
>pawn the costs off on to responsible taxpayers.
>
>So yes, not only do I support loans, I think we should
>extend them to parents that produce 5 children when
>they can ill afford one or two in the first place.
>Then, when their children are gone, start collecting
>back on the loans so we can give the money to the next
>set of irresponsible couples that decide to have a
>pack of children.
>
>If society does not hold the PARENTS responsible for
>bringing children into this world they cannot afford
>society will continue having more impoverished
>children.
>
>So loans yes, which cost you nothing, I favor those.
>But giving away your money so irresponsible couples
>can have children they cannot afford, no, that is
>wrong, and the political system should not perpetuate
>it.
>
>Donovan J Arnold
>
>
>
>--- "joanopyr at earthlink.net" <joanopyr at earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>
> > Roger writes:
> >
> > > Joan
> > >
> > > What I find the most objectionable to Ayn Rand is
> > that she seems totally
> > lacking in compassion.
> >
> > Agreed.  That's one of the many serious problems
> > with her work.  Have you
> > read Atlas Shrugged?  Ugh.  It takes the Donovian
> > position that the cream,
> > as it were, should rise to the top and bugger the
> > rest of our
> > less-impressive humanity.  (I just invented the word
> > Donovian.  Do you like
> > it?  It's in reference to Mr. Arnold's objections to
> > "raising" other
> > peoples' kids, an argument I doubt he'd extend to my
> > tax-payer support of
> > his student loans.)
> >
> > Joan Opyr/Auntie Establishment
> > www.auntie-establishment.com
> >
> > PS: As a teacher, Julie Crumley plays a vital role
> > in raising other
> > peoples' kids, and for that, I heartily salute her!
> > While I'm at it, I
> > want to thank Kristine Fitze, Pam Middlemas, Martha
> > Zirker, Sue Bowe, Dr.
> > Laurie Austin, and everyone with whom my child has
> > thus far come in contact
> > in the Moscow Public Schools.  They are consummate
> > professionals and kind,
> > caring, and knowledgable people.  Thank heaven for
> > all of them.  They have
> > my gratitude and my respect.  Not a Randian (or
> > Donovian) among them!
> >
> >
> >
>_____________________________________________________
> >  List services made available by First Step
> > Internet,
> >  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >
> >                http://www.fsr.net
> >
> >           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> >
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> >
>
>
>
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>_____________________________________________________
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>                http://www.fsr.net
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