[Vision2020] Vision2020 Freedom Of Speech: Managing List Serve

[Tbertruss at aol.com]

All:

I understand the possible annoyance of
posting of a discussion that appears to only involve two people who
use the list for a "private" debate or dialog on a subject many would
argue is not related to local issues.

But I think it is hard to know what the whole list really thinks about these 
cases, and that perhaps there are some who gain something from such 
discussions. And based on a principle of allowing freedom of speech, and 
avoiding the chilling effect of complaining about post content (the list 
serve
police!), I think it best to not complain about discussions, unless they 
become
"egregious." If the induction discussion, a discussion that recently received
complaints, involved 10 posts a day between only two people, this would be 
egregious, I think. 

But an occasional back and forth on this
issue I find of no harm. Someone might actually be prompted to think
about the issues presented and enjoy the dialog. 

Of course, Vision2020 cannot reasonably become an
educational list serve on any and all subjects. If ten discussions on 
abstract or difficult subjects that can be argued are unrelated to the local 
community were all going at once, this would be perhaps 
unmanageable.  But ten detailed discussions going all at once on various 
aspects 
of local zoning code, property tax law, animal control, funding of 
local law enforcement or jails, and so forth, many might also find 
unmanageable.  

The list finds its own balance in these matters, eventually, it seems to me, 
though this 
process can appear rather imbalanced!

No one is "forced" to read a conversation, at least when the subject headings
are kept matching the post content. Many conversations involve posts I
never open to read, when I find the subject heading of no interest. I
do not think it an accurate use of language to call post deletion
"forcing" a conversation on someone.  Deleting posts that someone finds of no
interest is just a normal part of being a list serve member.

I do not think it wise to establish a "policy" that
just because a few people complain about a list topic, and no one else
defends the topic on-list, then the discussion on-list should end. 
I have received complaints, posted on Vision2020, about some 
of my posts subjects, then received private
responses from list serve members indicating they approved of my post
that received the complaints, though the list serve members in this case
did not post their approval to the list, for whatever reason.

Keeping content of posts matching post subject heading is a list
etiquette voluntary rule that I think should be emphasized more. The
most annoying list conduct I have experienced by far is opening a post
thinking it is on a certain topic based on the subject heading, only
to find content of an entirely different nature. This wastes my time, given 
it requires opening the post and starting to read,
and frankly I feel deceived by this conduct, though sometimes no doubt 
it is an unintentional deception.

Again I repeat, deleting the conversations I find of no interest, when the 
subject heading matches the post content, is just a normal part of managing
a list serve, something unavoidable no matter what rules regulate the
list. Some of the most popular list serve conversations that no one
complains about seem to me unsuitable for the list, but I do not complain:  
live and let live, I guess, is my feeling on this.

Part of the problem with the disagreement on the appropriateness of list 
topics
involves the lack of clear agreement as to what Vision2020 is for.  If we 
adopt a 
strict interpretation of the Vision2020 mission statement, many post topics 
that 
are common and do not generate complaints would need to stop!  This seems 
quite impossible given the unmoderated nature of the list, and the fact the 
disagreement on what Vision2020 is for is so widespread.

But consider the option of managing the Vision2020 list serve via a
dedicated e-mail account that removes the need to delete. I have been
doing this for about a year or so, using my AOL account only for
Vision2020. I do not delete posts. AOL will do that for me eventually.
I read what posts I find of interest, respond and/or debate as I wish, and 
don't
worry about the rest. 

With an open unmoderated list serve, no matter what attempts are made
to achieve consensus on list rules that everyone will follow, there
are going to be discussions that many do not want to waste time with,
so using this strategy of a dedicated e-mail account that does not
require deletion, seems to me like a good solution.

As this Vision2020 post I forward below indicates, at least one
list serve member agreed with the idea I presented above. Surprisingly,
I have not received one request to open a free 2.5 gig storage G-mail
account (an account that would not require deletion of posts because
of the huge free storage), based on my offer on Vision2020:

> Subj: Re: [Vision2020] Let Induction Discussion Continue Onlist--or
> not  Date: 11/21/2005 7:14:19 PM Pacific Standard Time From:
> deco at moscow.com To: vision2020 at moscow.com Sent from the Internet
> (Details) 
> 
> This is a unmoderated forum.  If some are not interested in a 
> thread/subject they need not pursue it.  
>  
> Some threads are more complex than others.  Therefore, the posts
> discussing them will be longer and more complex.   Ted Moffett
> suggested a nice way for a V 2020er to avoid downloading long posts
> (and other emails):  Get a free 2+ gigabyte email account at Google
> Mail (Gmail) and only download to your browser those posts/emails that
> interest you.  The storage of these emails remains at Google and not
> on your machine.   If any one needs special instructions on how to get
> a Gmail account, please send me your email address and I will see that
> Gmail sends you an enrollment invitation.
> 
> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
> deco at moscow.com
> -------------------------------

Again, anyone wishing to receive an invitation to G-mail, send a request to 
the return e-mail address from which this e-mail originates, with only "G-mail" 
in the subject heading.  I can send an invitation, though I may cancel my AOL 
account soon (too expensive!).

Ted Moffett 
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