[Vision2020] answer to Melynda, neglected paragraph.
Ron Force
rforce@moscow.com
Thu, 27 May 2004 14:49:24 -0700
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The Oxford English dictionary has the following definitions for religion
(obsolete meanings omitted):
Action or conduct indicating a belief in, reverence for, and desire to
please, a divine ruling power; the exercise or practice of rites or
observances implying this.
A particular system of faith and worship.
religion of nature: the worship of Nature in place of a more formal system
of religious belief.
Recognition on the part of man of some higher unseen power as having
control of his destiny, and as being entitled to obedience, reverence, and
worship; the general mental and moral attitude resulting from this belief,
with reference to its effect upon the individual or the community; personal
or general acceptance of this feeling as a standard of spiritual and
practical life.
Eric seems to want to label any belief system a religion. However, these
definitions would all imply the necessity of belief in a supernatural or
higher power.
**********************************************
Ron Force Moscow ID USA
rforce@moscow.com
**********************************************
-----Original Message-----
From: vision2020-admin@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]On
Behalf Of Eric Engerbretson
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2004 1:51 PM
To: vision2020@moscow.com
Subject: [Vision2020] answer to Melynda, neglected paragraph.
And so, according to these folks, if DW tries to tell people what he
thinks is right and wrong, he is a religious freak supposedly trying to take
over the Palouse. But if Nick or Joan tries to tell people what is right and
wrong they are simply normal, non-biased people trying to create a more
tolerant and benevolent society for us all. Nick & Joan, et al, need to
realize that they are religious, and that they, too, are trying to make the
world see things the way they do.
I think we've got some semantic confusion here (deja vu!). Everyone
has a worldview. Me, Eric, Joan, Ted, Nick, Debbie, Tami--you name her,
she's got a world view. But not every world view is a religion. So I can
share a religion (Christianity) with Doug and Eric, although not a world
view. Likewise Ted can reject religion, while holding passionately a
non-religious value system which privileges care for one another.
One more time... a "non-religious value system" is a myth. It's an
oxymoron. Ted likes to think he's non-religious, but he worships
"passionately" at the altar of his value system. Anyone that has a value
system has a religion. Anybody who thinks they don't have a value system--
that's another religion. If it makes you feel better about yourself, call
yourself non-religious-- but the only people you're fooling are the other
non-religious people repeating their mantras, and following their priests.
It is possible to construct a civil society in which many religions
and non-religious world views are valued and their expression protected.
Absolutely. It's called America. I like it. I value the people with other
religions, because God does, and I would fight and die to protect their
right to express their religions. But I would never be so silly as to then
assume that their directly conflicting dogmas are somehow all correct.
Best regards,
Eric E.
The Nuart Theatre
208-882-0459 (lobby, no message)
208-883-0997 (CCM, leave message)
516 S Main, Moscow ID 83843
eric@eric-e.com
http://www.ccmbooks.org
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D125314221-27052004>The=20
Oxford English dictionary has the following definitions for religion =
(obsolete=20
meanings omitted):</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D125314221-27052004>Action=20
or conduct indicating a belief in, reverence for, and desire to please, =
a divine=20
ruling power; the exercise or practice of rites or observances implying=20
this.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D125314221-27052004>A=20
particular system of faith and worship.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004>religion of nature: the worship of Nature in =
place of a=20
more formal system of religious belief. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004> Recognition on the part of man of some =
higher=20
unseen power as having control of his destiny, and as being entitled to=20
obedience, reverence, and worship; the general mental and moral attitude =
resulting from this belief, with reference to its effect upon the =
individual or=20
the community; personal or general acceptance of this feeling as a =
standard of=20
spiritual and practical life. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D125314221-27052004><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Eric=20
seems to want to label any belief system a religion. However, these =
definitions=20
would all imply the necessity of belief in a supernatural or higher =
power.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>**********************************************<BR>Ron=20
Force Moscow =
ID <SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004>USA</SPAN></FONT></P>
<P><FONT size=3D2> <A =
href=3D"mailto:rforce@moscow.com">rforce@<SPAN=20
class=3D125314221-27052004>moscow.com</A></SPAN><BR>*********************=
*************************</FONT>=20
</P>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> =
vision2020-admin@moscow.com=20
[mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Eric=20
Engerbretson<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, May 27, 2004 1:51 =
PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
vision2020@moscow.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> [Vision2020] answer to =
Melynda,=20
neglected paragraph.<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>And so, according to these folks, if DW tries to tell =
people=20
what he thinks is right and wrong, he is a religious freak =
supposedly=20
trying to take over the Palouse. But if Nick or Joan tries to =
tell=20
people what is right and wrong they are simply normal, =
non-biased people=20
trying to create a more tolerant and benevolent society for us =
all. Nick=20
& Joan, et al, need to realize that they are religious, and =
that=20
they, too, are trying to make the world see things the way they=20
do.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>I think we've got some semantic confusion =
here=20
(deja vu!). Everyone has a worldview. Me, Eric, Joan, Ted, Nick, =
Debbie,=20
Tami--you name her, she's got a world view. But not every world =
view is a=20
religion. So I can share a religion (Christianity) with Doug and =
Eric,=20
although not a world view. Likewise Ted can reject religion, while =
holding=20
passionately a non-religious value system which privileges care =
for one=20
another. <BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>One more time... a =
"non-religious=20
value system" is a myth. It's an oxymoron. Ted likes to <I>think</I> =
he's=20
non-religious, but he worships "passionately" at the altar of his =
value=20
system. Anyone that has a value system has a religion. Anybody who =
thinks they=20
don't have a value system-- that's another religion. If it makes you =
feel=20
better about yourself, call yourself non-religious-- but the only =
people=20
you're fooling are the other non-religious people repeating their =
mantras, and=20
following their priests.<BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>It is possible to construct a civil society in which =
many=20
religions and non-religious world views are valued and their =
expression=20
protected.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>Absolutely. It's =
called America. I=20
like it. I value the people with other religions, because God does, =
and I=20
would fight and die to protect their right to express their religions. =
But I=20
would never be so silly as to then assume that their directly =
conflicting=20
dogmas are somehow all correct.<BR><BR>Best regards,<BR><BR>Eric=20
E.<BR><BR><BR><B><I><?fontfamily><?param Arial><?color><?param =
8080,0000,0000><?bigger><?x-tad-bigger><BR><BR>The=20
Nuart =
Theatre<?/x-tad-bigger><?/bigger><?/color><?/fontfamily></I></B><B><I><?f=
ontfamily><?param Arial><?color><?param =
9999,9999,9999><BR><?smaller><?smaller><?x-tad-smaller>208-882-0459=20
(lobby, no message)<BR>208-883-0997 (CCM, leave message)<BR>516 S =
Main, Moscow=20
ID =
83843<BR>eric@eric-e.com<BR>http://www.ccmbooks.org<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><=
?/x-tad-smaller><?/smaller><?/smaller><?/color><?/fontfamily></I></B></BO=
DY></HTML>
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