[Vision2020] Fw: Iraq
Tom Hansen
thansen@moscow.com
Mon, 5 Apr 2004 20:39:23 -0700
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Greetings Visionaires -
Although Mr. Finkbiner's suggestions are well intended, they are likely to
occur immediately following a same-sex marriage conducted by Douglas Wilson.
Let's evaluate each of his three requirements in achieving a viable
solution.
"1) Allows the Iraqi people to develop a government that provides stability
and the rule of law."
And how is this to be achieved? A government consisting of a coalition
representative of local religions? Not likely since the Kurds, Shiites, and
Suunis having been warring with each other for over a thousand years.
"2) Does not further inflame the region."
Nope. No warm fuzzy here, either. See 1) above. And
"3) Demonstrates the US can carry out a reasonable plan, rather than
flounder from mistake to mistake."
This has not been achieved since the Great Hate of the early 1940s. I
certainly do not see any FDRs or Harry Trumans on the horizon. As long as
the deck consists of Bushes, Cheneys, Quayles, Clintons, and Gores, we will
just have to play the cards we are dealt.
It was a mistake getting into Iraq. It is becoming a bigger mistake the
longer we remain there. I can see us staying until June 30th (when the new
government is scheduled to take control), since we promised the people of
Iraq (more specificaly the Kurds) that timeline.
Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho
-----Original Message-----
From: vision2020-admin@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]On
Behalf Of Joan Opyr
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 7:34 PM
To: Vision2020 Moscow
Subject: [Vision2020] Fw: Iraq
Hi all,
Mike Finkbiner is no longer active on 2020, but he reads the Digest and
asked me to forward this.
Joan
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Finkbiner
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 2:48 PM
To: auntiestablishment@hotmail.com
Subject: Iraq
One of the saddest things I see about the Iraq situation is that people
are arguing about why we got into this mess instead of working on finding a
solution.
Setting the administration's failures aside for a moment, I think we
need to work towards building a solution in Iraq that:
1) Allows the Iraqi people to develop a government that provides
stability and the rule of law.
2) Does not further inflame the region.
3) Demonstrates the US can carry out a reasonable plan, rather than
flounder from mistake to mistake.
I don't know if the current administration is capable of making that
happen. I'm afraid there might not be <anyone> who could make it happen,
but if we spend most of our energy arguing over the cause rather than
working towards the solution, we are just going to end up in a worse mess.
The Bush administration has demonstrated an ugly level of dishonesty
over this whole affair, but what's worse, I'm afraid, is that they have
demonstrated a high level of ignorance and incompetance.
Stupid and lazy people don't cause many problems, intelligent and active
people tend to solve problems, stupid and active people are capable of
making a real mess.
But it's a mess we can't honorably walk away from so I hope we can
concentrate finding a solution that works.
Bush deserves to get tossed out on his ear. I hope Kerry can do that
without promising to abandon the Iraqi people.
Mike
Mike Finkbiner
mike_l_f@hotmail.com
Civilization is not something inborn or imperishable; it must be
acquired anew by every generation.
- Will Durant
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<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>Greetings =
Visionaires=20
-</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>Although Mr. =
Finkbiner's=20
suggestions are well intended, they are likely to occur immediately =
following a=20
same-sex marriage conducted by Douglas Wilson.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>Let's =
evaluate each of=20
his three requirements in achieving a viable =
solution.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>"1) Allows =
the Iraqi=20
people to develop a government that provides stability and the rule of=20
law."</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>And how is =
this to be=20
achieved? A government consisting of a coalition representative of =
local=20
religions? Not likely since the Kurds, Shiites, and Suunis having =
been=20
warring with each other for over a thousand years.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>"2) Does not =
further=20
inflame the region."</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>Nope. =
No warm fuzzy=20
here, either. See 1) above. And</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT=20
face=3Dverdana></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>"3) =
Demonstrates=20
the US can carry out a reasonable plan, rather than flounder from =
mistake=20
to mistake."</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT=20
face=3Dverdana></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana><FONT =
face=3Dverdana>This=20
has not been achieved since the Great Hate of the early 1940s. I =
certainly=20
do not see any FDRs or Harry Trumans on the horizon. As long as =
the deck=20
consists of Bushes, Cheneys, Quayles, Clintons, and Gores, we will just =
have to=20
play the cards we are dealt.</FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT=20
face=3Dverdana></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana><FONT =
face=3Dverdana>It was=20
a mistake getting into Iraq. It is becoming a bigger mistake the =
longer we=20
remain there. I can see us staying until June 30th (when the new=20
government is scheduled to take control), since we promised the people =
of Iraq=20
(more specificaly the Kurds) that timeline.</FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT=20
face=3Dverdana></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana><FONT =
face=3Dverdana>Tom=20
Hansen</FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D449562103-06042004><FONT face=3Dverdana>Moscow, =
Idaho</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV></FONT></SPAN>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT=20
face=3DTahoma>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
vision2020-admin@moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-admin@moscow.com]<B>On =
Behalf=20
Of </B>Joan Opyr<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, April 05, 2004 7:34 =
PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
Vision2020 Moscow<BR><B>Subject:</B> [Vision2020] Fw:=20
Iraq<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>Hi all,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Mike Finkbiner is no longer active on 2020, but he reads the =
Digest and=20
asked me to forward this.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Joan</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt Arial; COLOR: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
Mike Finkbiner</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, April 05, 2004 =
2:48=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>To:</B>=20
auntiestablishment@hotmail.com</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Subject:</B> Iraq</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>One of the saddest things I see about the Iraq =
situation is=20
that people are arguing about why we got into this mess instead of =
working=20
on finding a solution.<BR><BR>Setting the administration's failures =
aside=20
for a moment, I think we need to work towards building a solution in =
Iraq=20
that:<BR><BR>1) Allows the Iraqi people to develop a government that =
provides stability and the rule of law.<BR><BR>2) Does not further =
inflame=20
the region.<BR><BR>3) Demonstrates the US can carry out a =
reasonable=20
plan, rather than flounder from mistake to mistake.<BR><BR>I don't =
know if=20
the current administration is capable of making that happen. =
I'm=20
afraid there might not be <anyone> who could make it happen, =
but if we=20
spend most of our energy arguing over the cause rather than working =
towards=20
the solution, we are just going to end up in a worse =
mess.<BR><BR>The Bush=20
administration has demonstrated an ugly level of dishonesty over =
this whole=20
affair, but what's worse, I'm afraid, is that they have demonstrated =
a high=20
level of ignorance and incompetance.<BR><BR>Stupid and lazy people =
don't=20
cause many problems, intelligent and active people tend to solve =
problems,=20
stupid and active people are capable of making a real =
mess.<BR><BR>But it's=20
a mess we can't honorably walk away from so I hope we can =
concentrate=20
finding a solution that works.<BR><BR>Bush deserves to get tossed =
out on his=20
ear. I hope Kerry can do that without promising to abandon the =
Iraqi=20
people.<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR>Mike=20
Finkbiner<BR>mike_l_f@hotmail.com<BR><BR>Civilization is not =
something=20
inborn or imperishable; it must be acquired anew by every =
generation.<BR>-=20
Will Durant<BR><BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR clear=3Dall>
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