[Vision2020] traffic woes endurable

Ted Moffett ted_moffett@hotmail.com
Wed, 10 Sep 2003 21:00:41 +0000


Luke et. al.

Actually, 20,000 bikes would take up less space than 5000 cars.

Bikes can ride on the roads, so the sidewalks do not have to absorb the bike 
traffic.

My suggestion was to monitor vehicle mileage, which could be done simply by 
checking the odometer. No surveillance or checkpoints needed.  Of course 
people could tamper with their odometers, which is done now to sell used 
cars.

We are now under surveillance in our cities every day of the week!  I do not 
approve of this, but I don't think the city, county or state government 
checking car odometers to monitor use is any more of an intrusion than the 
electric company or the water department checking meters at someone's home, 
which is done often now!

Of course there are problems with my idea.  What about those who must 
commute to work or those who take long trips out of town?  What about a 
family of 6 who all drive only one car compared to a person living alone who 
also has one car?  And so forth.  Not to mention the outrage that would 
result from any suggestion that a limit be placed on how much, when and if a 
person can drive their car!

My idea to regulate vehicle use via checking mileage was just a suggestion.

I don't see any easy solution to our addiction to and dependence on the 
internal combustion engine car, SUV or truck.  Eventually technology, such 
as fuel cell cars, may solve some of the problems.  But that could be a long 
time coming.  And fuel cell vehicles on a massive scale might require a 
restructuring of our economy that may prove difficult.

Ted


>From: "Luke" <lukenieuwsma@softhome.net>
>To: "Ted Moffett" <ted_moffett@hotmail.com>, good5707@uidaho.edu
>CC: vision2020@moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] traffic woes endurable
>Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2003 21:44:56 -0700
>
>Mr. Moffett:
>     There definitely is an awful lot of steady traffic in Moscow, but
>bicycles are not quite the answer.  Let's think about the numbers for a
>moment.
>     The average car can fit at least 4 people comfortably, SUV's can hold
>more like 7. Now there are approximately 20,000 people in Moscow. If
>everyone decides to go downtown, four people minimum can fit into their
>friends' vehicles, making for 5,000+ vehicles. If everyone must get their
>own bike, then that means that for everyone in Moscow to go downtown on a
>short errand together, there would be 20,000 bikes!
>     Things wouldn't be a whole lot better, and the sidewalks would be
>hazardous to every life form, human or not. Besides, with your idea of
>minimalizing vehicle trips, how on earth could the government regulate who
>is going where and why without checkpoints and surveillance on a massive
>scale? All it would do is congest an already constipated system even more,
>not to mention removing our freedom of privacy.
>
>     All the best,
>Luke Nieuwsma
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ted Moffett" <ted_moffett@hotmail.com>
>To: <good5707@uidaho.edu>
>Cc: <vision2020@moscow.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 2003 3:05 PM
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] traffic woes
>
>
> >
> > Jacob et. al.
> >
> > I did offer a suggestion for a solution that gave an incentive:
>regulating
> > the use of vehicles for non-essential purposes, with fines imposed for
> > violations.  Monthly mileage could be tracked, and those exceeding their
> > allotment would pay.  We regulate when people can water their lawns, and
> > what's more critical for life, water or use of a motorized vehicle to 
>pick
> > up some chips and a six pack at the store?  A bicycle would do well in
>that
> > case.
> >
> > Such an idea no doubt seems implausible, maybe impossible, but cars 
>impact
> > the public welfare in dramatic ways, and the idea that a person can do
>what
> > they want with their car without regard to that impact seems a rather
> > extreme view of individual freedom.  However, our economic system and 
>way
>of
> > life is so centered around the wanton use of the internal combustion
>engine
> > at every whim that regulating this use is fighting a hard battle.
> >
> > And considering that US cars, trucks and SUVs are the greatest source of
>CO2
> > emissions that are influencing global warming, and the potential
>devastating
> > impact of this climate change, you are wrong
> > to minimize the importance of this issue.
> >
> > Ted
> >
> >
> > >From: Jacob Goodwin <good5707@uidaho.edu>
> > >To: vision2020@moscow.com
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] traffic woes
> > >Date: Mon, 06 Sep 2004 20:07:41 -0700
> > >
> > >Roger and Ted,
> > >
> > >Your agenda seems reasonable, however you just seem to be complaining
> > >without coming to any feasable solution for the stated probelms.
> > >
> > >People are not going to drive less with out any incentive.  I sure 
>won't.
> > >Maybe the government could require more fuel efficent cars to be sold.
> > >However in the long run from an economic perspective, people would 
>drive
> > >more for the same cost and consumption would remain the same.
> > >
> > >Now if the cost of fuel were to be dramatically increased, it would 
>force
> > >consumers to drive less or drive more efficent vehicles.
> > >
> > >Locally traffic isn't a huge issue anyway, the worst traffic jams occor
> > >after a football game at the dome.  There are other issues that deserve
> > >greater attention than this one.
> > >
> > >
> > >Sincerely,
> > >Jacob Goodwin
> > >
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Ted Moffett" <ted_moffett@hotmail.com>
> > >To: <rhayes@turbonet.com>
> > >Cc: <vision2020@moscow.com>
> > >Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 4:31 PM
> > >Subject: Re: [Vision2020] traffic woes
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Roger et. al.
> > > >
> > > > Has anyone noticed the increase in traffic?  Surely you jest!
> > > >
> > > > I was driving east a few days ago on Third St. where the curve by 
>the
>U
> > >of
> > >I
> > > > Graduate Student Housing turns four lanes into two, and the traffic
>was
> > > > bumper to bumper backed up from Main St!  I gave up and turned off
>Third
> > > > Street.
> > > >
> > > > Solutions?  Yes, of course, able bodied people could bike or walk.
>Even
> > >use
> > > > of small electric vehicles for simple trips for groceries or to 
>catch
>a
> > > > movie, etc., would be helpful.
> > > >
> > > > But who will really change their life to avoid adding to traffic?
> > >Obviously
> > > > those who rely on their car or SUV or truck to get everywhere will
>just
> > > > thumb their noses, or worse, at those who complain.
> > > >
> > > > I mentioned this issue a few days ago to a local Moscow resident
>active
> > >in
> > > > promoting biking:  my solution was to suggest passing a city 
>ordinance
> > >to
> > > > fine able bodied Moscow city residents who drive their cars when not
> > > > critical.  If the sight of a topless female requires regulation why
>not
> > > > regulate the abuse of polluting vehicles who create hazardous 
>traffic
> > >jams?
> > > > Yes, I know, this idea has about as much chance of passing into law 
>as
>a
> > >law
> > > > against ice cream because it creates a health hazard.
> > > >
> > > > Americans are in love with their cars and attempts at getting them 
>to
> > >bike
> > > > or walk or use alternative transportation are flat out socialist
>liberal
> > >big
> > > > government un-American ideas!  Ha!
> > > >
> > > > May I suggest a respirator and full body armor for your next foray 
>on
> > >the
> > > > highways of the Palouse?
> > > >
> > > > Ted
> > > >
> > > > >From: roger hayes <rhayes@turbonet.com>
> > > > >To: vision2020@moscow.com
> > > > >Subject: [Vision2020] traffic woes
> > > > >Date: Sun, 7 Sep 2003 14:22:31 -0700
> > > > >
> > > > >Dear visionaries:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Like so many Palouse residents, I live in Moscow but work in 
>Pullman.
> > >For
> > > > >the past couple of years I have been riding my bike to work every
>day,
> > >and
> > > > >so haven't taken much note of traffic conditions.  Last week, due 
>to
>a
> > > > >(non-bicycle related) back injury, I found myself driving.  I
>couldn't
> > > > >believe the traffic. By bike, in the mornings, I can usually make 
>it
>to
> > >the
> > > > >west side of Pullman from the east side of Moscow in just about 30
> > >minutes,
> > > > >and the 5 o'clock return trip in about 35 minutes. Last week it 
>took
>me
> > >30
> > > > >minutes to drive it in the morning, and 45 minutes to get home.  
>It's
> > > > >strange to think that a bicycle is the faster way to commute over 
>11
> > >miles.
> > > > >
> > > > >In addition, on two separate days, I witnessed acts of road rage. 
>One
> > >in
> > > > >Pullman and one in Moscow.  These happened right here in our 
>peaceful
> > > > >communities!
> > > > >
> > > > >Has anyone else noticed that there is an increase in traffic? Are
>more
> > > > >people driving?  Are vehicles so big they take up more space on the
> > >roads?
> > > > >Or are we just driving more than we used to? Does anyone think that
> > >traffic
> > > > >and noise presents a problem?
> > > > >
> > > > >Yes, I do have an agenda here. Drive less, drive smaller vehicles,
>take
> > > > >alternative transportation when available. Walk, ride the bus,
> > >consolidate
> > > > >trips to the store, ride a bike (it's fun and generally safe).
> > > > >
> > > > >I challenge readers to contemplate their driving habits. Why would
>this
> > >be
> > > > >important?  The answers are many:  Pollution. Conservation of
> > >resources.
> > > > >Quality of life. Conservation of city/county resources. Personal 
>and
> > >public
> > > > >health. Political issues, both international and national.
> > > > >
> > > > >Wouldn't it be nice to live in a town that didn't constantly hum 
>and
> > >roar
> > > > >with traffic? It is something only personal initiative will change.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Roger Hayes
> > > > >Moscow
> > > > >
> > > > >_____________________________________________________
> > > > >List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the
> > > > >communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > >http://www.fsr.net
> > > > >                              mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
> > > > >ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
> > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > Compare Cable, DSL or Satellite plans: As low as $29.95.
> > > > https://broadband.msn.com
> > > >
> > > > _____________________________________________________
> > > >  List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > > >  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > > >                http://www.fsr.net
> > > >           mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
> > > > ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
> > >
> > >_____________________________________________________
> > >  List services made available by First Step Internet,
> > >  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> > >                http://www.fsr.net
> > >           mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
> > >ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Need more e-mail storage? Get 10MB with Hotmail Extra Storage.
> > http://join.msn.com/?PAGE=features/es
> >
> > _____________________________________________________
> >  List services made available by First Step Internet,
> >  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> >                http://www.fsr.net
> >           mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com
> > ŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻŻ
> >
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Get 10MB of e-mail storage! Sign up for Hotmail Extra Storage.  
http://join.msn.com/?PAGE=features/es