[WSBARP] TIC or JTWROS?

Thu Sep 12 11:49:44 PDT 2019

Isn't a *presumption *appropriate to refer to if and only if there's not
evidence to the contrary? I would think that's why a title company would
ask if there's a will before transferring the property automatically. The
presumption would be appropriate in the absence of contradictory
information. Those are my lame thoughts.

Kaitlyn

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 11:44 AM Mark Vohr <mcv at ohanafc.com> wrote:

> Thanks John – always nice to have an opinion from title.  I agree with the
> analysis that a conveyance to H&W creates a presumption that the property
> is community property, but I also believe that community property can be
> held as TIC or JTWROS depending on what the vesting document says (or
> doesn’t say).  In other words, the character of the property, community or
> separate, and the ownership of the property, TIC or JTWROS are two separate
> and distinct things each requiring a separate inquiry and each separately
> impact the ownership rights that can be conveyed by a decedent.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> Mark C. Vohr
>
> Ohana Fiduciary Corp.
>
> Ohana Financial Services
>
> A Washington Trust Company
>
> Mark C. Vohr, J.D., CPG, Principal
>
> PO Box 33710  Seattle, WA  98133
>
> T:  (206) 782-1189 F:  (206) 782-1434
>
> mcv at ohanafc.com      www.ohanafc.com
>
>
>
> *From:* wsbarp-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <
> wsbarp-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> *On Behalf Of *John McCrady
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 12, 2019 9:40 AM
> *To:* WSBA Real Property Listserv <wsbarp at lists.wsbarppt.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [WSBARP] TIC or JTWROS?
>
>
>
> I think every title company would require what we call a “Lack of Probate
> Affidavit” before vesting title in the surviving spouse.  On the lack of
> probate affidavit the surviving spouse is required to disclose whether the
> deceased had a will, and if so, we require a copy of the will for our
> review.  If the will leaves the property to someone other than the
> surviving spouse we require a disposition of that party’s interest.
>
>
>
> But, somewhat contrary to your statement, the interest acquired by “A and
> B, husband and wife” is presumed by law to be community property, not TIC. RCW
> 26.16.030
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__app.leg.wa.gov_RCW_default.aspx-3FCite-3D26.16.030&d=DwMFAg&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=-G0Mj1xers1ckmqAuRD8bXMfed_Ni-L0FsgOuw_1PHA&s=rldTMfrI-ggO5BruUDxpJA_QLPpZzzvSZqgvg2du0Fc&e=>
>
>
>
> John McCrady
>
> Counsel
>
> Puget Sound Title Company
>
> 5350 Orchard Street West
>
> University Place WA 98467
>
> 253-476-5721
>
> j.mccrady at pstitle.com
>
>
>
> *From:* wsbarp-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com [
> mailto:wsbarp-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com
> <wsbarp-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>] *On Behalf Of *Mark Vohr
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 11, 2019 5:33 PM
> *To:* wsbarp at lists.wsbarppt.com
> *Subject:* [WSBARP] TIC or JTWROS?
>
>
>
> I have a title person in Jefferson county telling me it’s common practice
> in title companies when property is acquired as “husband and wife” (the
> type of ownership – TIC or JTWROS is not indicated in the deed)  to pass
> the ownership to the surviving spouse without any kind of conveyance since
> Washington is a community property state, all they require is proof of
> death of the spouse.  Title has always done this, we’ve used death
> certificates, lack of probate affidavit’s or actual probates as proof of
> death of the spouse and then just vest the ownership in the surviving
> spouse.
>
>
>
> My understanding is that a transfer to H&W (or any conveyance to more than
> one person) without indicating the type of ownership creates a tenancy in
> common, RCW 64.28.020.   In our case the decedent left his entire estate in
> trust for his surviving spouse, which I would conclude would include his
> TIC share in real property.  Title transferred it all to the surviving
> spouse.  It would seem we have to claw it back.
>
>
>
> Thoughts?  Thanks in advance.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> Ohana Fiduciary Corp.
>
> A Washington Trust Company
>
> Mark C. Vohr, J.D., CPG, Principal
>
> PO Box 33710  Seattle, WA  98133
>
> T:  (206) 782-1189 F:  (206) 782-1434
>
> mcv at ohanafc.com      www.ohanafc.com
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__r.xdref.com_-3Fid-3Dx8C0jvIP028054-26from-3Dwsbarp-2Dbounces-40lists.wsbarppt.com-26to-3Dj.mccrady-40pstitle.com-26url-3Dhttp-3A__www.ohanafc.com_&d=DwMFAg&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=K1mLMC1eFjwfeeMM-AC6zQ&m=-G0Mj1xers1ckmqAuRD8bXMfed_Ni-L0FsgOuw_1PHA&s=jAkIe8_CigLrdu5Zifuql2c7c9TnTt0kVLdzkbPfq-o&e=>
>
>
>
> Click here
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-- 
Thank you,

Kaitlyn R. Jackson | Attorney| DIMENSION LAW GROUP PLLC
130 Andover Park East, Suite 300 | Tukwila, WA 98188
t: *206.973.3500 *| f: *206.577.5090*| e: *kaitlyn at dimensionlaw.com*|
www.dimensionlaw.com

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