[WSBAPT] oil & gas leases to be titled in living trust

[Joshua McKarcher]

I do everything I can to deed these into an RLT if they are recorded real property interests. If you ask the client to bring you the most recent paperwork, payment stub, letter, email, "whatever you have," then you will often get at least one piece of data you need to find a payor in the relevant state who can quickly answer the relevant questions.

The basic job is to determine if this is a recorded interest (next move: deed into RLT to avoid probate in that state, which will be FAR HARDER) or if this is not a recorded interest but simply a right to payment pursuant to the books and records of some company acting as agent or trustee for the person or entity that formally holds the recorded real property interest.

That latter phrase sounds more complicated than it is. In those cases, 90% of the time, a visit to a website or a call to the payor's office reveals that the client's fiduciary will one day be able to update the "payee" after the interest-holder's death, without a probate.

Often in those cases the third party requests a death certificate, a copy of a will (please nobody blast me for that; I'm merely reporting facts), copy of a trust, or other documents made relevant not by their state's probate/trust laws, but by their contract with the interest holder, or the terms of a trust that actually holds the real property interest for the benefit of thousands of fractional interest holders.

So, after many years of noodling with these things, I have found the path above to be fairly straightforward:

1. Contact the payor if possible to ask "what is this"? (Website, phone number, email.)
2. Is it recorded (and subject to probate)? If yes, deed to trust if at all possible, with local counsel. If no, proceed.
3. Is it subject to probate nonetheless? If yes, deed to trust if at all possible, with local counsel.
4. Is it simply a matter of some company's books and records being updated to their satisfaction pursuant to a contract or trust or other non-state-probate-law authority? If yes, then ask them what the process will be and act accordingly.

Hope that helps! Best, Josh

Joshua D. McKarcher
McKarcher Law PLLC
537 6th Street
Clarkston, WA 99403
(509) 758-3345
(509) 758-3314 (fax)
josh at mckarcherlaw.com<mailto:josh at mckarcherlaw.com>
www.mckarcherlaw.com<http://www.mckarcherlaw.com/>

From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Doehne, Jen
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2023 11:51 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] oil & gas leases to be titled in living trust

I agree with Heather and would add that I have many clients with a vague notion that they receive income from the oil/gas interests but have no idea any other details...so there is typically a great deal of research involved in these cases and sometimes communication with the correct contact at the oil/gas company is also difficult.

That being said, these clients are pretty much in agreement that they would rather deal with it now, rather than have their heirs deal with it later...



Jen Doehne, Attorney
Pronouns she/her/hers
[cid:image003.png at 01D98728.4FF5CA10]
909 A Street, Suite 600 | Tacoma, WA 98402
phone 253.572.4500 | fax 253.272.5732 | www.eisenhowerlaw.com<http://www.eisenhowerlaw.com/>
From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of Heather de Vrieze
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2023 11:30 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] oil & gas leases to be titled in living trust

Only cons are costs, as usually it requires hiring Texas counsel and preparing and recording deeds, then updating all of the companies paying the leases or royalties.

Heather

Heather S. de Vrieze
Attorney-at-Law
[cid:image004.jpg at 01D98728.4FF5CA10]
3909 California Avenue SW
Seattle, WA 98116-3705
(206)938-5500
heatherd at westseattlelaw.com<mailto:heatherd at westseattlelaw.com>
www.westseattlelaw.com<http://www.westseattlelaw.com/>
Click here to connect with de Vrieze | Carney on Facebook:   [FB Logo] <https://www.facebook.com/DeVriezeCarney>

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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of Jenna Brozik
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2023 11:05 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: [WSBAPT] oil & gas leases to be titled in living trust

My clients, who are married,  own a couple of Texas oil & gas leases in which they receive about $300-$400 in income each year.  They would like to title these in the name of their Living Trust.

Has anyone dealt with these before and titling them in a Living Trust?  Any cons to doing so?

Thanks,

Jenna Brozik
Managing Attorney
PRINZ & BROZIK PLLC
445 S. Grand Avenue
Pullman, WA 99163
509-338-0908 Telephone
509-338-3527 Facsimile


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