[WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

Wed Jul 19 09:56:47 PDT 2023

Last time I did that we had a hard time opening an estate account because the bank decided that the EIN didn't match the Letters.

Since then I have generally done separate probates, used a LOPA for first spouse to die or did an Adjudication of in/testacy and Heirship.

I take it you haven't had this issue.

Heather

Heather S. de Vrieze
Attorney-at-Law
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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> On Behalf Of Dalynne Singleton
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2023 9:33 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

I get the EIN with the second spouse to die information.  Never failed me.

Dalynne Singleton
Gourley Law Group
Snohomish Escrow
The Exchange Connection
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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of Heather de Vrieze
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2023 9:27 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

Mark,

I have done joint probates before as well, but wonder - How do you handle the EIN for a joint probate?

Heather

Heather S. de Vrieze
Attorney-at-Law
[cid:image002.jpg at 01D9BA27.523D24D0]
3909 California Avenue SW
Seattle, WA 98116-3705
(206)938-5500
heatherd at westseattlelaw.com<mailto:heatherd at westseattlelaw.com>
www.westseattlelaw.com<http://www.westseattlelaw.com/>
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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of Mark Anderson
Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2023 4:49 PM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

A joint probate is the way I would handle it.  I just did one and it was pretty straightforward.  This way, the PR can deed the property to anyone knowing that both spouses are off title.

Mark B. Anderson
ANDERSON LAW FIRM PLLC
821 Dock St  Ste 209  PMB 4-12
Tacoma, Washington 98402
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From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of Eric Nelsen
Sent: 07/18/2023 11:28 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: Re: [WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

If they're selling the property and more than 2 years have passed since the first spouse's death, then a title company will most likely be willing to insure title based on opening probate on the second spouse, and doing an Affidavit of Lack of Probate on the first spouse.

If the family is keeping the property long-term, it might be worthwhile to open a joint probate to get title completely cleared up. Or if the client is willing to take the risk of a title hiccup later, could still open probate just on the second spouse and do a PR deed to the heirs. Later on a title company might note the discrepancy in title and require an Affidavit of Lack of Probate on the first spouse, but if a lot of years have passed, it's likely they will be willing to insure around it.

Keep in mind these are practical considerations, and not legal determinations. To get a legal determination without a whole probate process, you could do an Adjudication of Testacy or Intestacy on the first spouse. See RCW 11.20.020(1) (testacy), RCW 11.28.110 (intestacy and heirship), RCW 11.28.330, RCW 11.28.340.

Sincerely,

Eric

Eric C. Nelsen
Sayre Law Offices, PLLC
1417 31st Ave South
Seattle WA 98144-3909
206-625-0092
eric at sayrelawoffices.com<mailto:eric at sayrelawoffices.com>

From: wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>> On Behalf Of David Greenberg
Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2023 11:05 AM
To: WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com<mailto:wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>>
Subject: [WSBAPT] Probate Question - Deceased Spouse Still on Title

I have been getting more and more files where a deceased spouse is still on title to the primary residence. Assume no community property agreement, transfer on death deed, or other automatic right of survivorship. I tend to get called when the second spouse passes away or when the survivor is updating their estate plan.

Does anyone have a work-around to avoid opening a probate solely for the sake of removing the deceased spouse's name or opening a combined probate for both spouses after the second spouse passes away? I am expecting the answer is no, but it can't hurt to ask.

Thanks,
Dave

[cid:image007.png at 01D9BA27.523D24D0]<https://greenbergplanning.com/>
Dave R. Greenberg,
Attorney

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Greenberg Estate Planning, PLLC
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Bellevue, WA 98005

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