[WSBAPT] COVID-19 - Witnessing by Webcam?

[Kira Rubel]

Hello, team.

I'm so interested in this thread as I have numerous clients that would
rather not meet to sign.   Here's my analysis on this, and I am hopeful
this will trigger someone to remember a case or other law to support this.

On the DPOA, why can't a webcam notary service be used? I'm basing this
analysis on RCW 11.125.060 which states that a DPOA executed other than in
this state is valid in WA if it complies with the laws of that other
jurisdiction. Arguably, a notary whose state law allows virtual notary
complies with his/her own state in performing the act and that should make
the DPOA valid.   Likewise, RCW 11.12.20 states that wills are valid in WA
so long as they comply with state's law where executed. The language is as
follows:

"PROVIDED, That a last will and testament, executed in the mode prescribed
by the law of the place where executed or of the testator's domicile,
either at the time of the will's execution or at the time of the testator's
death, shall be deemed to be legally executed, and shall be of the same
force and effect as if executed in the mode prescribed by the laws of this
state."

At the very least, it may be a temporary bandaid and then you could have
the clients re-sign documents after all this is over.  Or maybe I'm nuts.
Admittedly it is a bit of a stretch. However, I do know other practitioners
(in CA for example, which has similar language to WA) who are implementing
this strategy. In any case, I'd love to hear feedback from our more
experienced practitioners on this topic!

Thank you in advance for weighing in.

*Kira M. Rubel*

**Licensed in CA and WA*

*The Harbor Law Group (**formerly, Law Office of Kira M. Rubel**)*

*3615 Harborview Drive NW, Suite C (on the dock)*

*Gig Harbor, WA 98332-2129*

Tel.  (253) 251-2955 | (800) 836-6531

Fax. (206) 238-1694

Zoom ID. (253) 251-2977

www.theharborlawgroup.com

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On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 11:25 AM David Faber <david at faberfeinson.com> wrote:

> Hi Roger,
>
> You are correct that notarization is not possible by webcam at this point
> in time. My question was about witnessing and whether a webcam would
> sufficiently constitute being "in the presence of the principal" for a POA
> under RCW. 11.125.050 as the *alternative* to notarization authorized
> therein.
>
> Best,
> David J. Faber
> Faber Feinson PLLC
> 210 Polk Street, Suite 1
> Port Townsend, WA 98368
> (360) 379-4110
>
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> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 11:14 AM Roger Hawkes <Roger at law-hawks.com> wrote:
>
>> I believe that notarization has to be in the physical presence of the
>> signer; I think that should also be changed by legislation to allow
>> electronic viewing of the signing.
>>
>>
>>
>> Roger Hawkes, WSBA # 5173
>>
>> Hawkes Law Firm, P.S. and Sky Valley Lawyers, PLLC
>>
>> Office: 19944 Ballinger Way NE
>>
>>               Shoreline, WA 98155
>>
>>                          And
>>
>>                423 Main, Sultan, WA 98294
>>
>>
>>
>>                Voice: 206 367 5000
>>
>>                 Fax:    206 367 4005
>>
>>                 www.hawkeslawfirm.com
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com <
>> wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com> *On Behalf Of *David Faber
>> *Sent:* Monday, March 16, 2020 10:58 AM
>> *To:* WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
>> *Subject:* [WSBAPT] COVID-19 - Witnessing by Webcam?
>>
>>
>>
>> As we face lockdown due to COVID-19 (and doubly so because our client
>> base is more likely to be in a vulnerable population), I'm exploring how
>> much can be done using technological solutions. Specifically:
>>
>>
>>
>> (1) Pursuant to RCW 11.125.050(1), would witnessing a POA signing by
>> webcam sufficiently constitute being "in the presence of the principal"?
>>
>>
>>
>> (2) Similarly, would witnessing a signature on a Will be sufficient for
>> signing a self-proving affidavit?
>>
>>
>>
>> Seems to me the answer to (2) is slightly closer to an easy "yes" than
>> (1) given all the leniency to the witnessing requirements that exist, but
>> I'm in the dark here and wondering if anyone has any specific knowledge or
>> experience that could prove helpful and instructive at this point in time.
>> I would surmise this entire list would greatly appreciate this knowledge
>> and practice advice while we try to navigate this unprecedented health
>> crisis.
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> David J. Faber
>>
>> Faber Feinson PLLC
>>
>> 210 Polk Street, Suite 1
>>
>> Port Townsend, WA 98368
>> (360) 379-4110
>>
>>
>>
>> *** NOTICE: ATTORNEY CLIENT COMMUNICATION - PRIVILEGED & CONFIDENTIAL.
>> This communication may contain privileged or other confidential
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