[WSBAPT] lack of probate affidavit question

Fri Oct 13 18:16:23 PDT 2017

Paul:

This is the same analysis that I have come to.  The feedback on this issue
for the past several exchanges has resulted in exactly what you are saying
here.  I come from the old school where you get a title transferred
legitimately and through the right process.  Shortcuts are dangerous.
Chain of title is what probate is all about, that and the creditors.  And
it is good work for us lawyers so why short-cut it at all.

The Title Tsunami.....  I like it.  We'll have even more work straightening
up the mess.

Jim Doran

James R. Doran
Attorney at Law
100 E. Pine Street -  Suite 205
Bellingham, WA 98225
(360)393-9506
jim at doranlegal.com
www.doranlegal.com

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 8:45 AM, Paul Neumiller <pneumiller at hotmail.com>
wrote:

> This really goes against my understanding.  Those WACs only address
> exemption from the Excise Tax, not the transfer of title.  In the absence
> of a recorded Community Property Agreement or a recorded Transfer On Death
> Deed or a probated estate, a Lack of Probate Affidavit is only effective if
> a title company is willing to accept it in terms of insuring a sale of the
> property.  I sure hope Dwight Bickel or some other title person chimes in
> here.  While the widow can record the deed (or the Affidavit), the real
> test will come at a later time when a title company is asked to insure a
> sale of the property.  Now, if that sale is ten years down the road, an
> insurance company *may* feel it’s a safe enough transaction to insure
> because of the passage of time but I doubt an insurance company will accept
> the Affidavit if the sale is within two years.
>
>
>
> I have advised my clients that it is safest to probate the estate to
> ensure later title insurance on a sale of the property.  It has been my
> analysis that the title companies are currently willing to insure the
> transfer of title using a an Affidavit of Lack of Probate until they, as an
> industry, get burned by a lawsuit involving an Affidavit, the case will hit
> the conservative title insurance industry like a tsunami, and then their
> “acceptance” of an Affidavit will dissolve.  That may force the widow to go
> back and probate the estate.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com [mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.
> wsbarppt.com] *On Behalf Of *Mike Winslow
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 12, 2017 5:34 PM
> *To:* 'WSBA Probate & Trust Listserv' <wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [WSBAPT] lack of probate affidavit question
>
>
>
> I have heard that the clerks in the tax assessor’s offices tell people
> they need a deed. This happens is Skagit. Not necessary and not effective
> to transfer title. Redundant, waste of money, etc.
>
> The Lack of Probate affidavit is sufficient. Record it per the WAC, then,
> wife just deeds to Trust. Use a warranty deed, not a quit claim deed, to
> maintain title insurance coverage from original acquisition.
> See  WAC 458-61A-202. Look at 6(i) for the process applicable to your
> matter.
>
>
>
>
>
> Michael A. Winslow
>
> 1204 Cleveland Ave.
>
> Mount Vernon, WA 98273
>
> Ph. 360-336-3321 <(360)%20336-3321>
>
> Em. Mike at winslegal.com
>
>
>
> This message is from an attorney, so it’s confidential. If you are not the
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> not use it for any improper purpose. Huge Disclaimer available upon request.
>
>
>
> *From:* wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com [mailto:wsbapt-bounces at lists.
> wsbarppt.com <wsbapt-bounces at lists.wsbarppt.com>] *On Behalf Of *Sharon
> Rutberg
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 12, 2017 3:31 PM
> *To:* wsbapt at lists.wsbarppt.com
> *Subject:* [WSBAPT] lack of probate affidavit question
>
>
>
> Hi, listmates --
>
>
>
> Client's husband died without a will. The couple owned their home as
> community property and neither spouse has any children. We do not want to
> open estate administration for the husband (due to lack of need and privacy
> concerns). But we do want to transfer the wife's interest into her
> revocable living trust (created also for privacy concerns).
>
>
>
> Do we need to record a document reflecting the transfer by intestate
> succession of the house to the wife as sole owner before she can quit claim
> the property into her RLT? If so, how so we do that? We have created a *lack
> of probate affidavit* attesting that surviving spouse is the
> rightful heir to the property. Can we record that (along with a death
> certificate and a REET affidavit)  to document the transfer? Do we need a
> deed instrument in addition?
>
>
> I've heard varying things from different sources. Any clarification would
> be appreciated!
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Sharon
>
>
>
> Sharon C. Rutberg, Attorney at Law
>
> Salmon Bay Law Group, PLLC
>
> 1734 NW Market St.
>
> Seattle, WA 98107
>
> 206-735-3177, ext. 2 <(206)%20735-3177>
>
> sharon at salmonbaylaw.com
>
> Website: www.salmonbaylaw.com
>
> Washington State Bar #47055
>
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