[Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Tue Jul 1 11:05:37 PDT 2014

And, by what means can a court, or an employer  distinguish between really believing vs fakey believing?   For example, a closely held company invests in corporations that produce medication or devices that prevent conception.  Let’s identify that company as Hobby Lobby <http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/04/hobby-lobby-retirement-plan-invested-emergency-contraception-and-abortion-drug-makers> .  (Please read the link).  Do you suppose that their recent law suit was related to actual moral objections? Did they suddenly starting giving a hoot about the issue two years ago?  Or, do you think that their law suit might have political objectives?  If past actions are any indication they have (by their own recently adopted standards) loosey goosey ethics.  And, because the medical community (who actually know more about the medicine than the judges, the attorneys, and the Green Family) does not considered the medication or devices abortifacient <http://ncronline.org/blogs/grace-margins/what-abortifacient-and-what-it-isnt> , why were the opinion of experts ignored in favor of a conservative political agenda?  In the meantime, since we can only guess at the intensity of a religious commitment – I call out the Green family as hypocritical political opportunists and the five justices as patriarchal jackasses.  

 Rose Huskey

From: Paul Rumelhart [mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 10:14 AM
To: Rosemary Huskey; 'Gary Crabtree'
Cc: 'vision 2020'
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

By "legitimate" I mean they really believe it, as opposed to those that just say they do in order to get out of having to pay for something.  I'm not sure how you test for it, though.

I'm not a theologian, so I'll skip the second question. Is it pertinent?

Paul

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From: Rosemary Huskey <donaldrose at cpcinternet.com>
To: 'Paul Rumelhart' <godshatter at yahoo.com>; 'Gary Crabtree' <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com> 
Cc: 'vision 2020' <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Tuesday, July 1, 2014 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Hey Paul, 

Help me to understand what a “legitimate” religious belief means. Can one have an illegitimate religious belief?  And, further, explain why/how one religious belief trumps another.

Rose

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Paul Rumelhart
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 9:11 AM
To: Gary Crabtree
Cc: vision 2020
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Yep, that seems to be how it's looked at.  That's one of the reasons I'm such a pariah on this list, I think.  From my perspective, both major parties are far on the statist side of the statist / individualist axis.  I'm on the individualist side, which is why I'm wondering why someone can't just pay for their own contraceptives if their employer objects to having it on their company's health care plan for legitimate religious reasons.

Paul

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From: Gary Crabtree <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com>
To: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> 
Cc: Sunil <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>; vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Tuesday, July 1, 2014 8:55 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Mr. Rumelhart please, from the statist perspective it's only a right if it can in some way be inflicted on someone else. Either by making others pay for it or by forcing the participation of those who would otherwise demure.

g

On Tue, Jul 1, 2014 at 8:03 AM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:

Which right is being restricted, a woman's right to free contraceptives?

Paul

  _____  

From: Sunil <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
To: vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Tuesday, July 1, 2014 6:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

I couldn't disagree more. 

Roe recognized a woman's right to privacy. Hobby Lobby creates religious rights for legal fictions, and restricts the rights of flesh-and-blood people. HL is not about restricting the power of government and it's naive to think that's its objective. If the government were restricting birth control, as it once did, this majority would have no objection to that exercise of government power.

Sunil

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From: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
To: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm; donaldrose at cpcinternet.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 01:20:24 -0600
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Comparing Burwell v Hobby to Roe v Wade I don't see inconsistency in rulings.  In both cases the rulings restricted the power of the government.

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From: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm
To: donaldrose at cpcinternet.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
Date: Mon, 30 Jun 2014 17:14:44 -0700
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Great points, Rose, and I’m afraid I agree with your assessment.  Thank you for pointing out the obvious even if it’s uncomfortable some.

It’s long past time for SCOTUS to have to adhere to the same code of ethics federal judges must adhere to.

Saundra

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Rosemary Huskey
Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 2:49 PM
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: [Vision2020] A fine point, perhaps.

Bias, or perhaps I should say, a predisposition, to adopt a certain philosophical approach to legal issues may be shaped by private values that we trust and hold dear.  In light of the  Supreme Court decision supporting the Hobby Lobby owners refusal to provide forms of birth control they claim to be at odds with their religious beliefs,  I wondered if the court was persuaded not by legal arguments but by their own religious affiliations.  Were any of the five male justices associated with religious groups that  uphold the doctrine of patriarchy,  i.e., do they attend churches that deny women ministerial or priesthood roles. Guess what?  Justice Roberts, Justice Scalia, Justice Thomas, and Justice Alito are Roman Catholic. 

In contrast, when the decision concerning Roe v Wade was announced in 1973 eight of the nine male justices were members of main stream Protestant churches. There may or may not be a direct correlation between religion affiliation and legal opinions, but it is my firm belief that unearned gender privilege nurtured in the cradle, and deferred to in the church certainly creates an atmosphere that celebrates and bestows unique privilege for male members.  And, what could possibly more be patriarchal than controlling women’s reproductive choices?

Rose Huskey

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List services made available by First Step Internet,
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              http://www.fsr.net <http://www.fsr.net/> 
          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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 List services made available by First Step Internet,
 serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
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