[Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On Game

Tue Apr 22 05:35:59 PDT 2014


----------------------------------------
> From: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm
> To: fotopro63 at hotmail.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On Game
> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2014 02:06:22 -0700
>
> Gosh, Kai -- I guess you didn't want to have a serious discussion because
> you've managed to avoid the necessary clarification before any serious
> discussion can take place -- if we don't understand where each is coming
> from by defining the scope -- something you've studiously avoided and
> decided to instead attack me -- it's pointless to engage in discussion, it
> seems to me.
>
> For the record, though, I know quite a few tea-baggers who use that term to
> describe themselves. Indeed, the last time I used "TPers" rather than
> tea-baggers on V2020, I got a nice note from someone I know to be actively
> involved in the movement (from the beginning, not one of Christian Right and
> looney militia-types who have co-opted the movement) who found "TPer"
> offensive and suggested I stick instead with "tea-baggers" because that's
> how he & his cohorts refer to themselves. But, I guess it's much easier for
> you to go after a straw man rather than address the topic, right, Kai?
>
> Now, if you self-identify with the movement and would prefer that I refer to
> *you* as a TPer, I'm happy to extend to you that courtesy -- just let me
> know. Otherwise, I'm not going to defer to a Wikipedia article when I've
> had someone who reads V2020 I know -- and respect -- tell me that he
> prefers tea-bagger to TPer.
>
> As for the topic at hand, I'll give you a clue: I'm against hunger. I'm
> all for providing an adequate safety net where NO ONE needs to break the law
> to feed herself or her family . . . and I don't even really care why the
> person or family is hungry. How about you -- do you care? Like Roger
> Hayes, the poachers I'm aware of didn't seem to poach out of necessity but
> rather out of a screwy sense of entitlement and blatant disregard for those
> pesky laws they abhor. If you have stats to support a claim that
> "necessity" poachers are the ones that are taking an incredibly heavy toll
> on game in northern Idaho, I'm all ears.
>
> Unlike you, I'll take it a step further and say I'm not limiting my "hunger
> is bad" position just to the unemployed. I know far too many working poor
> who go hungry, and I think it's as big an evil for them as it is for the
> unemployed. Since in another post you mentioned delivering food to the
> hungry every week in this area, I'm disappointed that you limited your moral
> question to the unemployed.
>
> However, you also wrote, " I see the face of hunger every week and I
> understand why someone would poach." Do you similarly understand why those
> who are hungry resort to other illegal self-help remedies to feed
> themselves? I certainly do. And, would you advocate the same "slack" for
> them as you seem to want to see for poachers? I certainly would.
>
> I hope you prove me wrong, but I'll not be holding my breath waiting for you
> to answer the questions I've raised in this email since you've *still* not
> provided the clarification I requested in my first response to you. But, do
> everyone a favor and save your cheap shots while professing to be interested
> in any discussion on a moral question.
>
> In case you lost track, my initial requested clarifications to you were:
>
> "Before I can participate in your interesting moral question, I need you to
> clarify for me: are you asking about those "lazy" unemployed & "welfare
> queens" the GOP & tea baggers are so quick to attack, cut off at the knees,
> and leave hanging out to dry?
>
> Or, are you talking about anyone who is unemployed for any reason
> whatsoever, including the families with children where an adult is an
> undocumented immigrant?"
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kai Eiselein [mailto:fotopro63 at hotmail.com]
> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2014 1:48 PM
> To: Saundra Lund; vision2020 at moscow.com
> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On Game
>
>
>
> Too bad we can't have discussion without bring politics and name calling
> into it. It's rather pathetic, actually.
>
> This should make it clear enough. I'm sure you are using the term
> "teabagger" out of respect, right?
>
> From wikipedia:
> The term teabagger was initially[when?] used[by whom?] to refer to Tea
> Partiers after conservatives[who?] used tea bag as a verb on protest signs
> and websites.[citation needed] Some members of the movement adopted the term
> as a verb, and a few others referred to themselves as
> "teabaggers."[212][213][214] News media and progressive commentators outside
> the movement began to use the term mockingly and derisively, alluding to the
> sexual connotation of the term when referring to Tea Party protesters. Most
> conservatives do not use the term with its double entendre meaning; rather
> it seems the political left has adopted the derogatory joke.[214][215][216]
> It has been used by several media outlets to humorously refer to Tea
> Party-affiliated protestors.[217] Some conservatives have advocated that the
> non-vulgar meaning of the word be reclaimed.[214] Grant Barrett, co-host of
> the A Way with Words radio program, has listed teabagger as a 2009 buzzword
> meaning, "a derogatory name for attendees of Tea Parties, probably coined in
> allusion to a sexual practice".[218]
>
>
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------
>> From: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm
>> To: fotopro63 at hotmail.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On
>> Game
>> Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2014 13:25:48 -0700
>>
>> What name-calling? I hardly consider it "name-calling" on my part to
>> simply repeat the words of the GOP & tea-baggers. Funny you take
>> exception at that but not at what they do to the poor.
>>
>> And, what's the matter -- don't care to answer the question? Why? Is
>> there some hypocrisy involved on your part or what?
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Kai Eiselein [mailto:fotopro63 at hotmail.com]
>> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2014 1:13 PM
>> To: Saundra Lund; vision2020 at moscow.com
>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On
>> Game
>>
>> Can't leave politics out of anything, Saundra? Not even a moral question?
>>
>> I have to give you points for coming out swinging with the name
>> calling though. That burning hatred IS impressive.
>>
>> ----------------------------------------
>>> From: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm
>>> To: fotopro63 at hotmail.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On
>>> Game
>>> Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2014 11:25:02 -0700
>>>
>>> Before I can participate in your interesting moral question, I need
>>> you to clarify for me: are you asking about those "lazy" unemployed &
>>> "welfare queens" the GOP & tea baggers are so quick to attack, cut
>>> off at the knees, and leave hanging out to dry?
>>>
>>> Or, are you talking about anyone who is unemployed for any reason
>>> whatsoever, including the families with children where an adult is an
>>> undocumented immigrant?
>>>
>>> Looking forward to your clarification!
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Kai Eiselein [mailto:fotopro63 at hotmail.com]
>>> Sent: Saturday, April 19, 2014 8:33 AM
>>> To: Saundra Lund; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On
>>> Game
>>>
>>> This also brings up an interesting moral question.
>>>
>>> Let's say a person is unemployed and needs to feed his/family poaches
>>> a deer or an elk for food, should that person be treated the same as
>>> a trophy or money poacher who only takes the rack, hide or parts that
>>> have
>> cash value?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>> From: v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm
>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2014 02:23:12 -0700
>>>> Subject: [Vision2020] North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On Game
>>>>
>>>> If anyone can post the LMT article referenced, I'm sure I'm not the
>>>> only one who would appreciate it. It seems to me our tax dollars
>>>> would be far, far better spent hunting down these damn poachers than
>>>> caving to the paranoia of the mentally unhinged "big bad wolf" crowd.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://boisestatepublicradio.org/post/north-idaho-poachers-taking-he
>>>> a
>>>> v
>>>> y-toll
>>>> -game
>>>>
>>>> North Idaho Poachers Taking Heavy Toll On Game
>>>>
>>>> State wildlife officials in northern Idaho say poachers are killing
>>>> far more game animals than wolves.
>>>>
>>>> Officials tell the Lewiston Tribune that last year in northern Idaho
>>>> they confirmed poaching of 30 elk, four moose, 13 mule deer and 57
>>>> whitetail deer.
>>>>
>>>> Officials say a realistic detection rate is 5 percent, meaning
>>>> poachers are likely killing about 600 elk, 80 moose, 260 mule deer
>>>> and
>>> 1,000 whitetail.
>>>>
>>>> Idaho Fish and Game District Conservation Officer Barry Cummings
>>>> says many people don't report wildlife crimes because they don't
>>>> consider it a crime against them.
>>>>
>>>> The fine in Idaho for illegally killing an elk is $750, while the
>>>> fine for illegally killing a moose is $10,000.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet, serving the
>>>> communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>