[Vision2020] Alive at 25 (Sept 29, 2013)

Thu Sep 5 13:25:14 PDT 2013

Just to be clear, I agree with all of this. I won't try to make what I was
trying to say since this message is more important anyway. Joe

On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 12:57 PM, Saundra Lund <v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm>wrote:

> I believe that impaired driving – from *any cause* – is something to be
> actively discouraged and educated against.  And, I’ll state the obvious
> that apparently isn’t so obvious to far too many.  Impaired driving
> includes those taking prescription drugs exactly as prescribed that may
> alter consciousness and/or reflexes, and impaired driving includes “drowsy
> driving” (driving when you’ve not gotten sufficient rest), which is
> estimated to be a factor in 3-33% of traffic fatalities.  Impaired driving
> also includes those who get behind the wheel after consuming too much
> caffeine, for that matter.****
>
> ** **
>
> For the record, I’m also staunchly against distracted driving, and believe
> that, too should be actively discouraged and educated against.  Perhaps the
> most frequent car conversation when my daughter was growing up was her
> saying, “Mom!  Look at XYZ,” followed by my response, “I can’t right now –
> I’m *driving*!”  I was almost run over by an adult female idiot on a cell
> phone in the mall parking lot a couple of years back, and my
> then-five-year-old daughter & I were almost backed over in the Jackson St.
> parking lot by an idiot young adult male driver in a carload of idiots with
> blaring music and a driver who couldn’t be bothered to look in his mirror
> before gunning it to back out of a parking spot.  Idiots.****
>
> ** **
>
> All of that said, back when I lived in CA, I had a friend who was a police
> officer in a large city, and he often told the story that he & his cop pals
> could easily differentiate impaired drivers who’d been smoking marijuana as
> opposed to those who had been drinking.  The marijuana-impaired drivers
> where the ones going way below the speed limit and stopping way before the
> pavement limit line of traffic lights and stop signs whereas drunk drivers
> were all over the road, swore they were only going 25 MPH when they were
> clocked at much higher actual speeds, frequently blew through lights & stop
> signs, and so forth.****
>
> ** **
>
> In any case, my cop friend’s experience has stuck with me through all
> these years.  I don’t want to cross paths with an impaired *or*distracted driver, but I’d much rather cross paths with a driver impaired
> by marijuana only than with an alcohol-impaired driver . . . hands down.**
> **
>
> ** **
>
> YMMV****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Saundra****
>
> Moscow, ID****
>
> ** **
>
> Atrocities are no less atrocities when they occur in laboratories and are
> called research.****
>
> ~ George Bernard Shaw****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:
> vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] *On Behalf Of *Joe Campbell
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 04, 2013 8:08 PM
> *To:* Scott Dredge
> *Cc:* viz
> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Alive at 25 (Sept 29, 2013)****
>
> ** **
>
> Look, I'm not denying that the advice is good. Nor would I advocate
> drinking and driving, smoking pot and driving, etc. But who needs these
> messages? Does any "good" kid think that drinking and driving, smoking pot
> and driving is a good decision to make? Are there folks who are confused
> about this fact? Thus, you are preaching to the choir. Now some folks
> genuinely need the advice no doubt. But acting as if what those folks are
> missing information is just way out of touch with the actual situation.
> They know they shouldn't do it, too, but for some of those folks that is
> precisely why they do it. For others, they know they shouldn't and do it
> anyway for reasons unclear.
>
> All of this is just status quo; it is just the very situation we have in
> the USA. There are good folks and they get the message and bad folks who
> don't and for the latter we lock them up in prison where they belong. And
> that's where we're at now, where we keep locking folks up but somehow the
> problems persist. One day we need to wake up to the fact that the "bad"
> folks fall into a few distinct categories: they are poor, they have at most
> one parental role model (though more likely just one parent and no models),
> or they suffer from some form of mental illness. And then what purpose was
> the advice doing? Didn't you already make that clear to your kids in the
> first place? And sharing it on the V is good because somehow one of us
> forgot to tell our sons or daughters that drinking and driving was bad?***
> *
>
> ** **
>
> On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 6:36 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
> wrote:****
>
> I've never claimed to be a libertarian. Why are you bent about any of
> this? 'Alive at 25' is a class that teaches about the reality of the
> statistically increased probably of injury or death to younger / less
> experienced drivers.  My only comment was that I hoped marijuana would be
> considered as one of the 'party drugs' they'd mentioned on the web site. To
> put it bluntly, they should advise people to not ever drive when they're
> stoned, drunk, or in any other impaired condition.  How can you even argue
> against such sane advice?
>
> -Scott****
>
>
> On Sep 4, 2013, at 6:04 PM, "Joe Campbell" <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
> wrote:****
>
> People die from skiing, from driving, from walking, from living. Should we
> resist those activities? Here is my view. Let people do whatever they want
> as long as it doesn't interfere with others. Sure there are costs but not
> nearly as much as the costs of our high cost prison system. Some wish that
> they could believe in a nice white guy in the sky that will give them life
> ever after if only they choose to believe. Others cannot buy that because
> it sounds to them like a bunch of crap. (I'm still on the fence.) Life is
> hard and the fear of death causes folks to avoid thinking about it in all
> kinds of ways, sometimes (ironically) to the extent in which their
> indulgences make them that much closer too it. Arrest folks who drive
> drunk, high, whatever -- whenever their actions place risk upon the lives
> and interests of others -- but stop judging people and just let them live
> their own lives the best they can.****
>
> By the way, you are officially NO libertarian in my book, Scott.****
>
> ** **
>
> On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 5:19 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
> wrote:****
>
> I would hope "marijuana" would be considered a subset of "party drugs" and
> thus would be discouraged.*
>
> From the website:
> DDC-Alive at 25 teaches young adults that:* ****
>
>    - People in their age group are more likely to be hurt or killed in a
>    vehicle crash.****
>    - Inexperience, distractions, and peer pressure cause unique driving
>    hazards.****
>    - Speeding, alcohol, and "party drugs" greatly increase their risk of
>    injury or death.****
>    - As a driver or passenger, they can greatly reduce their risk by
>    taking control.****
>    - Committing to changing their driving behavior makes personal, legal
>    and financial sense.****
>
> ** **
> ------------------------------
>
> From: skalasz at ci.moscow.id.us
> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2013 21:11:47 +0000
> Subject: [Vision2020] Alive at 25 (Sept 29, 2013)****
>
>  ****
>
> *Our Next Class:  *****
>
> *Sunday, September 29, 2013, 3:30 pm to 8:00 pm *****
>
> *at the Moscow Police Department.*****
>
>  ****
>
> *Alive at 25 *is a young driver intervention program developed by the
> National Safety Council for drivers between 14 and 24 years of age. *Alive
> at 25* was implemented in *Idaho* in 2010. This course is a 4.5 hour
> program that focuses on the decision making processes and behaviors that
> young drivers and passengers display in a motor vehicle and is designed to
> prevent the number one killer of teens, automobile crashes.****
>
> *Alive at 25* is taught exclusively by law enforcement officers who hold
> candid conversations with students about what can happen if they practice
> risky behavior or make other poor decisions in an automobile. This highly
> interactive program encourages young drivers between the ages of 14 and 24
> to take responsibility for their driving behavior. ****
>
> Our next class is scheduled for September 29, 2013.  There is no cost.  If
> you are interested in your child or young adult attending this class,
> please *register on line* at www.AliveAt25.us****
>
> If you have any questions, please feel free to contact either myself or
> Cpl. Bruce Lovell at the Moscow Police Department.****
>
> <image004.jpg>****
>
>  ****
>
>
> ****
>
> <image003.png>Cpl. Art Lindquist****
>
>             Moscow Police Department****
>
>             118 East 4th Street ****
>
>             Moscow, Idaho  83843****
>
>             alindquist at ci.moscow.id.us****
>
>             208-883-7129****
>
>  ****
>
>
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> ****
>
>
> =======================================================
>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
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>
> ** **
>
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