[Vision2020] Concerning the Government Shutdown . . .

Wed Oct 2 17:29:50 PDT 2013

Good thoughts, Scott.  This business of delaying the Affordable Care Act for a year is bogus.  That would simply give the Rs another whole year to shoot it down.  It twas passed by Congress, survived a Supreme Court test, now lets get on with it.  To delay it at all would simply provide its enemies new ways to subvert it.  What we must do is extend Medicaid  to cover those who need it, put the exchanges in place and ultimately work toward a single payer system.  For the life of me I do not understand how folks such as myself can rail against the Affordable Care Act and call it socialized medicine, then use their Medicare the next day.  And don’t give me the crap about having paid for it.  If you live to use it for a few years you will find the cost you paid for it is completely outstripped by the medical bills you incur.  I’m not sure to whom I am speaking, so the you is directed mostly to the elderly who don’t want the younger generation to have the medical benefits which their own Medicare provides.  OK, I’m off my soapbox for the rest of the day.  

Sue h

From: Scott Dredge 
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2013 1:55 PM
To: Nicholas Gier ; lfalen 
Cc: viz 
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Concerning the Government Shutdown . . .

FIrst off, I agree with everyone Nick has written.

As for Roger's comment:
<What needs to be done but won't be is either that that Obamacare is delayed for a year for everyone or that everyone is subject to the law now. Big  business, labor unions and congress should all be subject to the law at the same time.>

Everyone is subject to the same law.  In short, the law requires (I believe) everyone to be covered since everyone is a liability.  Those working for big business, labor unions, and in Congress have insurance coverage.  There is no reason to force them over to Obamacare unless they themselves opt out from their organizations health care plan and would otherwise represent an uncovered liability.  I've heard this same argument about everyone being forced over to Obamacare on right wing radio.  It's bogus and it's simply a ploy the Republicans to try and weaken Obamacare and as Nick points out, isn't it funny all of the sudden that the free market Republicans now want 'equality' for everyone.

Roger continues:
<I believe it is unconstitutiionzl for Obama to let some people of the hook. He does not have the constitutional authority to decide on his own who to apply it to and who gets a delay.>

If it is indeed unconstitutional then you should be jumping for joy since a simple lawsuit run up the flagpole to the Supremes could quickly smash this to bits and at the same time validate your belief of unconstitutionality.  Good luck with that.  I think this statement is should be filed in the category of 'blowing smoke'.

-Scott

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Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2013 12:09:57 -0700
From: ngier006 at gmail.com
To: lfalen at turbonet.com
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Concerning the Government Shutdown . . .

Hi Roger, 

This whole idea of "fairness" is bogus, especially for a party whose members say to all us "bleeding hearts": "Life is unfair."  I say that more taxes on super rich is "fair," but the GOP says it's not.  I like my idea of equity better than yours.

Even hundreds of GOP congressional aides rose up and said "Unfair!" when their employers tried to strip them their government health plans. They saw how phony this charade is.  Thanks to the Great Goddess, who is always fair, the majority of your sad party refused to do it.

Except for some computer problems, the individual mandate is ready to go, none too late, for millions of people without coverage. Such as a friend's sister with cancer who was arbitrarily kicked off Medicaid. She will now have coverage, no questions asked.  I ask you:  Is it fair, if you had your way, that millions of uninsured will not be able to sign up in the exchanges???  I can't believe that you would answer Yes.

The situation with employer coverage is very different, and some fixes are begging to be made. Already employee hours are being cynically cut because their bosses don't want to cover them.  Thanks to the individual mandate--a conservative idea by the way--they can find their own coverage on the exchanges.  Your charge that the delay for employer coverage is "unconstitutional" is absurd.

Your history lesson is misguided. After piling up debt year after year (finally tripling it, primarily in an unnecessary escalation of the Cold War), Reagan was never threatened by the Democrats not to extend the debt limit.  They never attached "do or die" amendments to their budget proposals.  They made of their budgets, passed them on time, with Reagan's approval. The current GOP has blocked every single budget compromise (spending cuts contingent on modest tax increases).  It's the GOP's fault that there is no budget.

If Reagan were here today, he would agree with your 2008 GOP presidential candidate John McCain: this Tea Party madness must stop.  Reagan would certainly not agree with your defense of this egregious, terrorist-like obstruction of government.

I challenge you to call your GOP representatives and relay McCain's message to them. Even Boehner did not want this to happen, but he caved into his radical right.  He will eventually have to come back and drop this insane Obamacare provision. The number of House Republicans ready to do this is growing day by day.  They know very well that Obama will not give in to blackmail and extortion.

Roger, I can't believe you really want to be left standing on the extreme, extreme right.  You don't do it locally, and you should not do it nationally.
Why the inconsistency?

Eagerly waiting and wishing for the GOP, particularly its cowardly House Speaker, to come to its senses, or collapse under the weight of own irrationality and stupidity,

Nick

On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 11:32 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:

  The shutdown will hurt a lot of people. Most people live paycheck to paycheck. They have bills to pay. Also some people who need medical care may not be able to get it. 

  What needs to be done but won't be is either that that Obamacare is delayed for a year for everyone or that everyone is subject to the law now. Big  business, labor unions and congress should all be subject to the law at the same time. I believe it is unconstitutiionzl for Obama to let some people of the hook. He does not have the constitutional authority to decide on his own who to apply it to and who gets a delay. 
  The Democrats and the lamestream media are doing their best to blame the shutdown on the Republicans and they will probably get away with it. But it is not so. They are all responsible. The Democrats say that the Republicans wont deal unless they get their way on Obamacare. But the Democrats are just as recalcitrant. the House has sent a variety of different bills to the Senate and they have rejected them all. Now the House is sending over bills to fund various portions of the government and the Senate seems bound and determined to reject these. So just who is responsible for the continued shutdown. I long for the the days of Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Neil.

  Roger

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    -----Original Message-----
    From: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
    To: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
    Date: 10/02/13 10:46
    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Concerning the Government Shutdown . . .

    "In the event of a shutdown, stateside commissaries, including Alaska and Hawaii, will be open for a full business day on Oct. 1 to reduce the amount of perishables on-hand before beginning a systematic closure process to account for unsold products and secure facilities.

    Jeu recommends that customers stay tuned in to their local news outlets for information about any impact to services on their installations.

    During a shutdown, commissary customers should be able to access the DeCA website. However, that site and the agency's social media platforms - Facebook, Twitter and other sites - would not be updated after Oct. 1 until the shutdown is over. Customers should be able to access the Department of Defense website, and its social media platforms for any updated information and breaking news that affects service members and federal government civilian employees."

    Source:

    http://www.commissaries.com/press_room/press_release/2013/DeCA_67_13.cfm

    Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .

    "Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)
    http://www.MoscowCares.com

    Tom Hansen
    Moscow, Idaho

    "There's room at the top they are telling you still  
    But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
    If you want to be like the folks on the hill." 

     - John Lennon

    On Oct 2, 2013, at 9:27 AM, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:

      Although the Military Pay Act was passed and signed virtually seconds before midnight Monday, thus ensuring that our soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines will continue to be paid . . .

      Commissaries on military installations, funded by the Department of Defense budget, closed their doors yesterday morning.  This may not be much of an inconvenience to Installations like Fort Benning (Columbus, Georgia is just outside the main gate) or Fort Dix (Wrightstown, New Jersey is just outside its main gate).  

      But, when the commissary at Fort Irwin (home of the 11th Armored Cavalry Regiment, 916th Support Brigade, and the National Training Center Operations Group), suddenly the nearest location for grocery shopping became Barstow, California . . . 45 (that's right, FORTY-FIVE) MILES AWAY.

      I'm guessing that there is not one member of congress who suddenly had that inconvenience thrust upon them!

      Seeya 'round town, Moscow, because . . .

      "Moscow Cares" (the most fun you can have with your pants on)
      http://www.MoscowCares.com

      Tom Hansen
      Moscow, Idaho

      "There's room at the top they are telling you still  
      But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
      If you want to be like the folks on the hill." 

      - John Lennon

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