[Vision2020] gun shows

Sun Jan 27 20:14:41 PST 2013

All I know is what I read in state laws and ATF regulations, Area Man.

Errors you may (or may not) have committed is for you to determine.

I'm just an old retired Army platoon sergeant that thinks accountability ain't such a bad thing.

Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .

"Moscow Cares"
http://www.MoscowCares.com

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

"There's room at the top they are telling you still 
But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
If you want to be like the folks on the hill."

- John Lennon

On Jan 27, 2013, at 8:05 PM, Dan Carscallen <areaman at moscow.com> wrote:

> So Tom, you're telling me that I have erroneously filled out form 4473 every time I've purchased a long gun?
> 
> DC
> 
> On Jan 27, 2013, at 19:59, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
> 
>> g . . . g . . . g -
>> 
>> Yes. Apparently the Federal Form 4473 is required to be completed and submitted to the ATF ON FIREARMS THAT THEY (THE ATF) REQUIRE TO BE REGISTERED.
>> 
>> Again . . .
>> 
>> http://www.atf.gov/contact/faq/
>>  
>> "Some examples of the types of NFA firearms that must be registered are: Machine guns, frames or receivers of machine guns; any combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting weapons into machine guns; any part designed and intended solely and exclusively for converting a weapon into a machine gun; any combination of parts from which a machine gun can be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the control of a person; silencers and any part designed and intended for fabricating a silencer; short-barreled rifles and shotguns; molotov cocktails, anti-tank guns (over caliber .50), bazookas, and mortars.
>> 
>> A few examples of 'any other weapon' are: H&R Handyguns, Ithaca auto-burglar guns, cane guns, gadget-type firearms and “pen” guns which fire a projectile by the action of an explosive."
>> 
>> Another thing:  I NEVER suggested/implied that local authorities are stupid.  I never will, as my father was a police officer for 36 years.  Some day I will have to post a photo of my dad (in uniform) next to a scanned photo of his retirement badge that I proudly maintain in my family archives . . . but not for a while, a LOOOOOOONG while.
>> 
>> Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>> 
>> "Moscow Cares"
>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>   
>> Tom Hansen
>> Moscow, Idaho
>> 
>> "There's room at the top they are telling you still 
>> But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
>> If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>> 
>> - John Lennon
>>  
>> 
>> On Jan 27, 2013, at 7:25 PM, "Gary Crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Federal form 4473 must be filled out for every firearm purchase. They are on file and local law enforcement has access to them. If you purchased the weapon through a private sale they will contact the original purchaser and then follow the chain of ownership. The cops aren't as stupid as you make them out to be.
>>>  
>>> g
>>> 
>>> From: Tom Hansen
>>> Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2013 7:04 PM
>>> To: Dan Carscallen
>>> Cc: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] gun shows
>>> 
>>> What federal form did they have you fill out?
>>> 
>>> According to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and FIREARMS [my emphasis] . . .
>>> 
>>> http://www.atf.gov/contact/faq/
>>> 
>>> "Some examples of the types of NFA firearms that must be registered are: Machine guns, frames or receivers of machine guns; any combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting weapons into machine guns; any part designed and intended solely and exclusively for converting a weapon into a machine gun; any combination of parts from which a machine gun can be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the control of a person; silencers and any part designed and intended for fabricating a silencer; short-barreled rifles and shotguns; molotov cocktails, anti-tank guns (over caliber .50), bazookas, and mortars."
>>> 
>>> Here's a little something for your bookshelf . . . 
>>> 
>>> The National Firearms Act Handbook
>>> http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/nfa-handbook/
>>>   
>>> 'Nuff said!
>>> 
>>> Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>>> 
>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>   
>>> Tom Hansen
>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>> 
>>> "There's room at the top they are telling you still 
>>> But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
>>> If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>>> 
>>> - John Lennon
>>>  
>>> 
>>> On Jan 27, 2013, at 6:53 PM, Dan Carscallen <areaman at moscow.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Well, the Feds know what rifles and/or shotguns I have purchased (or can easily find out) because each of the reputable dealers where the sale was made had me full out the federal form. Each form has my name and the serial number of the firearm, thereby linking it to me.  Is that in a state or national database? I don't know. I'm not a gun dealer, just a buyer and owner.
>>>> 
>>>> Maybe not registration in the purest sense, but a form of it nonetheless.
>>>> 
>>>> DC
>>>> 
>>>> On Jan 27, 2013, at 18:46, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Ahem, mr. Carscallen 
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://crime.about.com/od/gunlawsbystate/f/gunlaws_id.htm
>>>>> 
>>>>> Rifles and Shotguns
>>>>> Permit to purchase rifles and shotguns? No
>>>>> Registration of rifles and shotguns? No
>>>>> Licensing of owners of rifles and shotguns? No
>>>>> Permit to carry rifles and shotguns? No
>>>>> My claim is also supported by Idaho state law at:
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://www.211.idaho.gov/elibrary/FirearmLaws.html
>>>>> 
>>>>> Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>>>>> 
>>>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>>>   
>>>>> Tom Hansen
>>>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>>> 
>>>>> "There's room at the top they are telling you still 
>>>>> But first you must learn how to smile as you kill 
>>>>> If you want to be like the folks on the hill."
>>>>> 
>>>>> - John Lennon
>>>>>  
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 27, 2013, at 6:26 PM, Dan Carscallen <areaman at moscow.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Tom says:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Rifles are not registered
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Yes they are. I've filled out the requisite paperwork.  
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> DC
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>               http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>> =======================================================
>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>               http://www.fsr.net
>>>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> =======================================================
>>> 
>>> =======================================================
>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>               http://www.fsr.net
>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
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