[Vision2020] Jesus Had a Wife, Newly Discovered Gospel Suggests or Now The Fin Begins

Thu Sep 20 06:04:01 PDT 2012

"Googling 'The canon of the bible' evolution can provide some insight.To those interested, the reading is fascinationing."--w.

Ahh yes, nobody can doubt the truthiness of The Gospel according to Google and the Holy Book of Wikipedia. 

Donovan J. Arnold

From: Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>
To: vision2020 at moscow.com 
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 4:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Jesus Had a Wife, Newly Discovered Gospel Suggests or Now The Fin Begins

The process of how the various versions of the Bible came into being and then evolved provides a great deal of insight into irrationally accepting the Bible as the alleged inerrant word of some alleged God.  Googling "The canon of the bible" evolution can provide some insight.To those interested, the reading is fascinationing.w. 
On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 9:51 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote: 
The DaVinci Code is actually based on a book called "Holy Blood, Holy Grail" by Michael Baigent, Richard Leigh, and Henry Lincoln.  I have a copy somewhere, but I can't find it.  This book is non-fiction, though it's been widely criticised for being far too speculative and not based on solid research.  Their main source may even have been a hoax, which they took to be true.  Nevertheless, the book describes how Jesus was married to Mary, how she was smuggled out of Jerusalem and ended up in France.  There are lots of ties to the Templars and to a supposedly real Priory of Sion.  Mary's bloodline merged with the bloodlines of French nobles that eventually became the Merovingian dynasty.  The Holy Grail is supposed to be both Mary's womb, and the bloodline of Jesus.  I can't remember all of it, but it was definitely an interesting read.There are other reasons to think that Jesus might have been married, you can find many of them on the web.  One
 common one is that Jesus was often called Rabbi (teacher) and that at the time Rabbis would have been looked on with disapproval if they weren't married.  The counter to that is that the disciples might have been merely using the title of Rabbi because he was a teacher to them, not that he was an actual Rabbi in the Jewish faith.I've also heard that biblically, there are parables of biblical men meeting their brides at a well, with the well symbolising something about their purity.  Jesus had an encounter with a woman by a well.Anyway, not trying to step on anyone's faith, I just find this interesting.
>
>Paul 
>On 09/19/2012 04:09 PM, Donovan Arnold wrote:
>The DaVinci Code isn't real. Even if so this doesn't mean they were married. Talk about reading into something that isn't there. They didn't know about germs and viruses spreading through the mouth, so it would not be uncommon to kiss people you care about on the mouth. Many affectionate societies and families do this among same sex friends and even family. 
>> 
>>Donovan J. Arnold
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>>
>>From: Paul Rumelhart mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com
>>To: Art Deco mailto:art.deco.studios at gmail.com; mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com 
>>Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 1:37 PM
>>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Jesus Had a Wife, Newly Discovered Gospel Suggests or Now The Fin Begins
>>
>>I thought this was already "known" from the Gospel of Philip, one of the New Testament apocrypha from the Nag Hammadi scrolls.  It was quoted in The DaVinci Code, too, I think." 59: The wisdom which (humans) call barren is herself the Mother of the Angels.¹ And the companion of the [Christ] is Mariam the Magdalene. The [Lord loved] Mariam more than [all the (other)] Disciples, [and he] kissed her often on her [mouth].² The other [women] saw his love for Mariam,c they say to him: Why do thou love [her] more than all of us? || The Saviorº replied,³ he says to them: Why do I not love you as (I do) her?"
>>
>>From this web page:  http://www.metalog.org/files/philip.html
>>
>>I'll have to look in my copy of the Nag Hammadi library when I get a chance and see how it's translated there.
>>
>>The more interesting Apocryphal  book, in my opinion, is The Infancy Gospel of Thomas: http://www.gnosis.org/library/inftomb.htm, which covers some of Jesus' life when he was around 8 years old.  
>>
>>Paul
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>>From: Art Deco mailto:art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>To: vision2020 at moscow.com 
>>Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 4:55 AM
>>Subject: [Vision2020] Jesus Had a Wife, Newly Discovered Gospel Suggests or Now The Fin Begins
>>
>> 
>>Jesus Had a Wife, Newly Discovered Gospel Suggests
>>Life's Little Mysteries Staff
>>Date: 18 September 2012 Time: 04:30 PM ET   
>>
>> 
>>A Harvard historian has identified a faded, fourth-century scrap of papyrus she calls "The Gospel of Jesus's Wife." One line of the torn fragment of text purportedly reads: "Jesus said to them, 'My wife …'" The following line states, "she will be able to be my disciple."
>>The finding was announced to the public today (Sept. 18) by Karen King, a historian of early Christianity, author of several books about new Gospel discoveries and the Hollis professor of divinity at Harvard Divinity School. King first examined the privately owned fragment in 2011, and has since been studying it with the help of a small group of scholars.
>>According to the New York Times, King and her collaborators have concluded that the business card-size fragment is not a forgery, and she is presenting the discovery today at a meeting of International Congress of Coptic Studies in Rome. 
>>The fragment, written in Coptic, the language of a group of early Christians in Egypt, has an unknown provenance, and its owner has opted to remain anonymous. Questions about the fragment abound, but scholars say it will nonetheless reignite several old debates: Was Jesus married? If so, was Mary Magdalene his wife? And did he have a female disciple? [Jesus Christ the Man: Does the Physical Evidence Hold Up?]
>>Scholars say these controversies date to the early centuries of Christianity, but they remain relevant today. In the Roman Catholic Church, for example, women and married men are barred from priesthood because of the model thought to have been set by Jesus.
>>King has cautioned that the new discovery should not be taken as proof that Jesus was actually married. The text appears to have been written centuries after he lived, and all other early Christian literature is silent on the question of his marital status.
>>But the scrap of papyrus — the first known statement from antiquity that refers to Jesus speaking of a wife — provides evidence that there was an active discussion among early Christians about whether Jesus was celibate or married, and which path his followers should choose, King told the Times.
>>"This fragment suggests that some early Christians had a tradition that Jesus was married," she said. "There was, we already know, a controversy in the second century over whether Jesus was married, caught up with a debate about whether Christians should marry and have sex."
>>The significance of this fragment was known by scholars previously, and then forgotten. When its current owner acquired it in a batch of papyri in 1997 from its previous owner, a German, it came with a handwritten note. The note cited a now-deceased professor of Egyptology in Berlin as having called the fragment "the sole example" of a text in which Jesus claims a wife.
>>According to the Times, papyrologists and Coptic linguists who have studied the artifact thus far say they are convinced by its genuineness by the fading of the ink on the papyrus fibers and the traces of ink adhered to the bent fibers at the edges. The Coptic grammar, handwriting and ideas represented in the text would also have been nearly impossible to forge.
>>"It's hard to construct a scenario that is at all plausible in which somebody fakes something like this. The world is not really crawling with crooked papyrologists," Roger Bagnall, director of the Institute for the Study of the Ancient World, at New York University, told the New York Times.
>>Certain lines of the text resemble snippets from the Gospels of Thomas and Mary, both believed to have been written in the late second century and later translated into Coptic. King surmises that this fragment is also copied from a second-century Greek text.Further study will be needed to work out the details, but the meaning of the words "my wife" is beyond question, King said. The text beyond "Jesus said to them, 'My wife …'" is cut off.-- Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)art.deco.studios at gmail.com=======================================================List services made available by First Step Internet,serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.              http://www.fsr.net/          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com==============================================================================================================List services made available by First Step Internet,serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.           
   http://www.fsr.net/          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com=======================================================-- Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)art.deco.studios at gmail.com=======================================================List services made available by First Step Internet,serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.              http://www.fsr.net/          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com=======================================================
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