[Vision2020] How Mitt Romney Dodged the Draft . . .

Tue Sep 4 09:37:23 PDT 2012

A lot of us here on the viz are 'slow' which is why we continue to bother you with clarifications on your posts.  It seems the bottom line is that you feel Obama has integrity and Romney lacks it.  Is this accurate?  FWIW, I think they're about the same in the integrity department.

-Scott

CC: scooterd408 at hotmail.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
From: thansen at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] How Mitt Romney Dodged the Draft . . .
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2012 04:59:00 -0700
To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com

No, Mr. Arnold.  That is NOT what I am saying.  You really are struggling with the English language, huh?
Seeya round town, Moscow.
Tom HansenMoscow, Idaho “Wording plays a big part in understanding the nature and meaning a verse written two thousand years ago in a different language, and some Bibles just have it plain wrong.”

- Donovan Arnold (August 23, 2005)

On Sep 3, 2012, at 8:35 PM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:

Tom,

So what you are saying is that you joined the US Army against your own principles to fight in a war you vehemently disagreed with because you needed a job? This is, "SAY WHAT YOU MEAN and MEAN WHAT YOU SAY !" ? 

So Romney didn't fight in a war he supported? Just because someone believes in a cause doesn't mean they are a help to a cause if they personally participate in the action. I was all for flying into Afghanistan and taking out Bin Laudin. However, I think I would have been more of an obstruction to the task had I personally tried to participate in the operation with Seal Team Six. Knowing me, I would have passed out in a fast moving low flying helicopter with a door open, it would have taken us longer to get there too because I would have to stop and go pee a lot on account of the fact that I drink a 1/2 of coffee in the morning. And I surely
 I would have slowed the team down trying to get over the compound wall as I don't have the upper body strength to quickly climb so high. I'm very clumsy too, I might have actually shot one of our own team members or at least tripped and taken an eye out. 

No, I think there are different ways to support a cause then to directly do the hands on work itself. To tell you the truth, I just really don't like people questioning others patriotism, it isn't fair. Just as it is unfair to question faith, how much they love their spouse, and other personal beliefs. We don't know, and we honestly cannot know. Lets concentrate on the issues, the policies, and records of accomplishments of the candidates, not sling mud at their characters. 

Donovan J. Arnold

From: Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
To: thansen at moscow.com; donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com 
Cc: viz <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Monday, September 3, 2012 6:22 PM
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] How Mitt Romney Dodged the Draft . . .

>Tom wrote: 'People have the right to know the level of patriotism and honor those seeking to become president.'

There is no objective measure for 'level of patriotism and honor' and thus everyone simply has his or her own right to believe what they want to believe and weight it accordingly to whatever else they like / dislike against any candidate.  A high percentage of military veterans and those presently active military duty will vote for Romney which would suggest that he's done a sufficient job of being photographed with the United States Flag.

-Scott

From: thansen at moscow.com
Date: Mon, 3 Sep 2012 17:36:36 -0700
To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] How Mitt Romney Dodged the Draft . . .

People have the right to know the level of patriotism and honor those seeking to become president.

Mitt Romney demonstrated IN FAVOR of the Vietnam War.  Yet, when his number is called, he whimpers away.  What an EFFING joke!

Let me tell you something . . .

In June of '69, a week after I graduated from high school, I actively demonstrated in Canoga Park (California) against Vietnam.  A group of us (including yours truly) were arrested for unlawful assembly.  Being the son of a police officer, I was escorted to the Devonshire LAPD station where my father was on duty as Desk Sergeant.  They let him decide what was to be done with me.  My own father locked me up for the weekend.  When I was released on Monday morning, my father lectured me about how wrong it was to associate myself with VIVA (Voices in Vital America), a group of people that became friends of mine and "scum" to my father.  The next day I went to the recruiting offices in Sherman Oaks.  The waiting list for the national guard and reserve was 18 months long.  The waiting list for the Navy was six months long.  

Jobs were virtually null for 17-year olds fresh out of high school.

So, there I stood in the hallway of the recruiting station, looking at two doors; one marked "US Marine Corps Recruiter" and one marked "US Army Recruiter".  I flipped a coin.

Being 17, and two months from my 18th birthday, my father was required to sign a permission slip, which he did.

On December 3rd, less than six months after the Canoga Park demonstration I arrived at Tan Son Nuht Air Base, Vietnam . . . a brand new Army private.

I stood my ground at home against my father and refused to cave in.  And now, 44 years later as I think back on it, I wouldn't have changed a damn thing!

You see, Mr. Arnold, it is a matter of integrity.  SAY WHAT YOU MEAN and MEAN WHAT YOU SAY !

I expect that from friends as (I am sure) they expect it from me.  We CANNOT expect anything less from our Commander-in-Chief.

'Nuff said.

Seeya round town, Moscow.

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.  The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."

- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)

On Sep 3, 2012, at 3:50 PM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:

I don't think we should judge people based on their military status. Honestly, I would have tried to get out of fighting in Vietnam War too, as I think the slaughter or innocent people over there was unjustifiable, especially towards the end of the war when we knew it was a lost and unworthy cause. "We had to destroy the village in order to save it!", should have been a clue it was time to pack up and go home. 

People that served during that time were patriotic because they were putting their life at risk, and those that resisted fighting overseas were patriotic because they knew it was war that hurt the nations involved and resolved nothing. In their minds, and I think rightfully so, saw carpeting bombing little girls with napalm in remote villages as unjustifiable. 

Donovan J. Arnold

From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
To: Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Monday,
 September 3, 2012 2:20 PM
Subject: [Vision2020] How Mitt Romney Dodged the Draft . . .

"Demonstrating in favor of the Vietnam War at Stanford University, Willard "Mitt" Romney, however, would face uncertain odds in a Selective Service College Qualification Test. Most college men could not make the cut to postpone being drafted. Romney left Stanford after one year, and pursued his Mormon religion's mandatory ministry for males: two years in France in his case. When the Selective Service System (the draft) noticed so many young Mormon men taking S2 deferments for ministry, they restricted it to one Mormon minister per district. Mitt's father, Gov. George Romney, was influential in the Mormon church. The chosen one in the district was Mitt."

(audio)
http://archive.org/details/HowMittRomneyDodgedTheDraft

With Air Force veteran H. Bruce Franklin who taught at Stanford at the time. He teaches a course on the Vietnam War. Franklin's article on Romney and the draft appears in CounterPunch . . .

http://counterpunch.org/

------------------------------------

Seeya round town, Moscow.

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.  The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."

- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)

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