[Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .

Art Deco art.deco.studios at gmail.com
Fri Nov 2 07:50:44 PDT 2012


Tiara?  Only if I get to choose the accompanying gown and sash.

But here's a serious question for you: Being a fiscal conservative would
you back a candidate for a local office who has filed three times for
bankruptcy -- once to avoid paying a federal court judgment for a civil
rights violation?

w.

On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Gary Crabtree <jampot at roadrunner.com> wrote:

> **
> I don't care for ice cream and Lord knows I'll be winning no pageants. I
> cede both "bests" to you. I really think that you might look good in a
> tiara.
>
> g
>
>  *From:* Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, November 02, 2012 6:05 AM
> *To:* Gary Crabtree <jampot at roadrunner.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>
> Yes Gary, you are right.
>
> "*Blue litmus* paper turns red under acidic conditions and red *litmus*paper turns
> *blue* under basic (i.e. alkaline) conditions..."
>
> This would certainly give us a reliable indication of our general
> respective political/social perspectives.  But would it show which of us is
> the most handsome or the best ice cream critic?
>
> w.
>
> On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Gary Crabtree <jampot at roadrunner.com>wrote:
>
>> **
>> Perhaps there ought to be a litmus test?
>>
>> g
>>
>>  *From:* Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, November 01, 2012 8:02 PM
>>  *To:* vision2020 at moscow.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>>
>> Maybe it's rap-speak where some words mean the opposite of what they
>> ordinarily mean.
>>
>> w.
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 6:26 PM, Gary Crabtree <moscowlocksmith at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Acidulous? You really need to make up your mind, Wayne. Everything
>>> you've posted with regard to my character to date would have the vision
>>> readership think me rather base.
>>>
>>> g
>>>
>>>  On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 11:10 AM, Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I thoroughly resent the implication that there are more insulting,
>>>> acidulous posters on Vision 2020 than myself and Gary Crabtree!
>>>>
>>>> w.
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 2:06 PM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>  Really Joe?  I think my rants are of vastly higher quality than
>>>>> Tom's and also more appropriate than Tom's because they're in direct
>>>>> response to his low quality / ridiculous ones.  If you don't see it you're
>>>>> probably biased in favor of Tom which I don't take issue with.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Scott
>>>>>
>>>>>  ------------------------------
>>>>> CC: thansen at moscow.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> From: philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>>>>> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 10:48:44 -0700
>>>>> To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there some reason that your insulting rants are better than those
>>>>> of others? I don't see it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 1, 2012, at 10:29 AM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  Reposting - I grabbed the wrong Tom Hansen thread the first time
>>>>> being's that there are so many of them...
>>>>>
>>>>> Well golly gee Mr. Hansen, I'm downright shocked that things aren't as
>>>>> simple and as black & white as you first presented them to be and that
>>>>> since you jumped the gun on this and trumped it up - as you do on a lot of
>>>>> thing - that you now are reversing course and asking folks to contact you
>>>>> off list so you can further explain in order to try and save face.  And
>>>>> this despicable thread is what you so now nonchalantly refer to a 'venting
>>>>> [your] concern'???  You're pathetic.
>>>>>
>>>>>  ------------------------------
>>>>> From: thansen at moscow.com
>>>>> Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 08:39:27 -0700
>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>>>>>
>>>>> Upon further off-list review and discussion, I have decided  not to
>>>>> pursue this matter any further.
>>>>>
>>>>> If any of you fine V-Peeps are interested in how I reached this
>>>>> decision, contact me off-list.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the interim, thank you for permitting me to vent my concern.
>>>>>
>>>>> Seeya at the polls, Moscow, because . . .
>>>>>
>>>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>>>
>>>>>  Tom Hansen
>>>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>>>
>>>>> "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.  The
>>>>> college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."
>>>>>
>>>>> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 1, 2012, at 4:46 AM, Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  Laws are only as firm as those that enforce them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Stay tuned, V-Peeps
>>>>>
>>>>> Seeya at the polls, Moscow, because . . .
>>>>>
>>>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>>>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>>>
>>>>>  Tom Hansen
>>>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>>>
>>>>> "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.  The
>>>>> college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."
>>>>>
>>>>> - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 1, 2012, at 12:09 AM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  Sounds reasonable to me Kit and I'd think this all could be handled
>>>>> by just having a non-accusatory (if possible) conversation with this
>>>>> council member and getting a better understanding about his situation
>>>>> (should he choose to want this publicly disclosed) and his ability to
>>>>> continue fulfilling his duties.  The tenor of the comments here on the Viz
>>>>> from the regular contributors of group thinkers is that he's not well liked
>>>>> and not at all trusted, so I don't really foresee the V2020 mob - fully
>>>>> equipped with pitchforks and torches in hand - having a cordial and honest
>>>>> conversation with this particular council member.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not a politician and nor will I ever be so it's kind of tough for
>>>>> me to put myself in this guy's situation to say what I'd do, but my sense
>>>>> is that I would simply have 'no comment' to anyone or any group who was
>>>>> acting hostile toward me and jumping to conclusions that I was operating in
>>>>> an underhanded and dishonest manner and was making statements to the effect
>>>>> that they wanted me to resign or be forcibly removed from my position.
>>>>> What other choice is there...be forthcoming and cooperative and have your
>>>>> admitted enemies use all that against you as they can and would do?  I
>>>>> think the legal requirements can easily be addressed, but would then lead
>>>>> to your subsequent point regarding gaming the system to meet Tom's
>>>>> supposedly all important 'letter of the law' - which is really only
>>>>> important in terms of how effective the law is to DQ this guy immediately
>>>>> from his position.  I'll give Tom credit that he is transparent on that end
>>>>> goal.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  > CC: thansen at moscow.com; kmmos1 at frontier.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> > From: kcraine at frontier.com
>>>>> > To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com
>>>>> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>>>>> > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2012 21:46:58 -0700
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I think this basic question is two fold:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 1. Does the councilor involved met the legal requirement that he
>>>>> > resides in the district he represents?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > 2. Does the councilor's heart reside in the district he represents?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > In the first instance, if the councilor does not reside -- or is
>>>>> > gaming the system to claim he resides -- in the district he
>>>>> > represents, should he be in office (morally or legally) when he does
>>>>> > not belong to the group he claims to represent? The question is
>>>>> > whether we (the citizens of Moscow, Idaho) should accept being ruled
>>>>> > by an outsider (e.g. someone from Troy, Pullman, Spokane, New York,
>>>>> > Mars) who will not suffer the consequences of his decisions.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > In the second instance, should a person who does not have an
>>>>> interest
>>>>> > in the future of a community he represents (because he knows he will
>>>>> > not live with the consequences of his decisions) have a moral
>>>>> > obligation to step down from an office he holds?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > City councilors determine the policies which run this city. Their
>>>>> > decisions impact every member of the population. Regardless of of
>>>>> the
>>>>> > legal status of a councilor's claimed residence, the question is
>>>>> > whether that councilor is willing to live with the consequences of
>>>>> his/
>>>>> > her decisions (i.e, will they be residing in Moscow after their
>>>>> > term?). The community has the right to ask why a suspected out-of-
>>>>> > community councilor ran for the position AND why the councilor
>>>>> should
>>>>> > continue to be retained in the position. The councilor has an
>>>>> > obligation to answer -- AND to justify his continued membership of
>>>>> the
>>>>> > council in terms of the long-term benefits of a community he had
>>>>> left.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Kit Craine
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On Oct 31, 2012, at 8:58 PM, Scott Dredge wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > > I'd hope that the city council members would ignore most of your
>>>>> > > numerous petty requests Tom, but let me know how this all works
>>>>> out
>>>>> > > for you. If this guy isn't carrying out his duties (e.g. was not
>>>>> > > involved in any way) then that'd be the reason to jettison him. If
>>>>> > > this residency thing is a huge fricken' big deal and anyone in the
>>>>> > > powers that be gives one wit I'm sure there can be some monumental
>>>>> > > waste of time and effort put forth to meet the letter of the law,
>>>>> > > but what'd be the point since you'd just go snooping for some
>>>>> other
>>>>> > > minor infraction to yell 'throw the bum out'. What a joke.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > From: thansen at moscow.com
>>>>> > > Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2012 04:19:31 -0700
>>>>> > > To: kmmos1 at frontier.com
>>>>> > > CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> > > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Bottom line: The law is the law; the spirit of the law being that
>>>>> > > our governing city council WILL NOT be comprised of nonresidents.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Reasoning for noncompliance: There was no explanation given as to
>>>>> > > why the city code will not be enforced.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Options: As residents, subject to city code enforcement, we can
>>>>> > > either request, in a letter to the city council and Mayor Chaney,
>>>>> > > that action be taken or we can join Mr. Dredge in burying our
>>>>> heads
>>>>> > > in the proverbial sand.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > I have NEVER been known to sit on my hands.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > As one quote goes . . .
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > "Lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way!"
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > This IS important, Moscow, because . . .
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > "Moscow Cares"
>>>>> > > http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Tom Hansen
>>>>> > > Moscow, Idaho
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > On Oct 31, 2012, at 3:34 AM, Kenneth Marcy <kmmos1 at frontier.com>
>>>>> > > wrote:
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > On 10/30/2012 11:12 PM, Scott Dredge wrote:
>>>>> > > It's a non-issue.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > One of the essential characteristics of municipal government is
>>>>> that
>>>>> > > it is relatively local, i.e., close to those who are governed and,
>>>>> > > ipso facto, those who are governed are close to those who govern
>>>>> > > them. If one of those governing changes one of his characteristics
>>>>> > > from local to non-local, that change creates an incongruity with
>>>>> > > local government characteristics which may be resolved by
>>>>> > > resignation from office by the incongruous person.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > It's tantamount to claiming Obama is ineligible to be president
>>>>> > > because many believe he was born in Kenya.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > That is maldirective nonsense. Many people believe incorrect
>>>>> > > information to their individual and our collective detriment. The
>>>>> > > fact of their belief does not justify it, nor does it serve as a
>>>>> > > basis for argument that because it is true that anything else is
>>>>> true.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > If this Tim Brown character is not eligible to be sitting on the
>>>>> > > council, then someone who cares about this should follow the
>>>>> > > processes in place to remove / replace him.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Tim Brown initiated the processes necessary to place himself into
>>>>> > > membership of the Moscow City Council at a time when his
>>>>> > > characteristics were consonant with such membership. Apparently he
>>>>> > > has changed those characteristics, so he should initiate the
>>>>> > > processes necessary to remove himself from membership of the
>>>>> Moscow
>>>>> > > City Council.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > That'd just be far too logical and it won't happen so this flap is
>>>>> > > much ado about nothing.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Asking other people to expend the energy to collectively act to do
>>>>> > > what the incumbent could, and should, do individually with less
>>>>> > > energy, and more grace, is neither "logical" nor efficient, and
>>>>> > > represents a level of counterproductivity that is counterintuitive
>>>>> > > to better local government.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > "Much ado about nothing" serves better as a Shakespearean play
>>>>> title
>>>>> > > than as a description of this discussion.
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > Ken
>>>>> > > =======================================================
>>>>> > > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>> > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>> > > http://www.fsr.net
>>>>> > > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> > > =======================================================
>>>>> > >
>>>>> > > ======================================================= List
>>>>> > > services made available by First Step Internet, serving the
>>>>> > > communities of the Palouse since 1994. http://www.fsr.net
>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>> > > =======================================================
>>>>> > > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>> > > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>> > > http://www.fsr.net
>>>>> > > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> > > =======================================================
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>  =======================================================
>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>               http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ======================================================= List services
>>>>> made available by First Step Internet, serving the communities of the
>>>>> Palouse since 1994. http://www.fsr.net mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com<Vision2020 at moscow.com>=======================================================
>>>>>
>>>>>  =======================================================
>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>               http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>          mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com <Vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>> =======================================================
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>>
>> =======================================================
>>  List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>  serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>                http://www.fsr.net
>>           mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>
>
>
>


-- 
Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
art.deco.studios at gmail.com
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