Tiara? Only if I get to choose the accompanying gown and sash.<br><br>But here's a serious question for you: Being a fiscal conservative would you back a candidate for a local office who has filed three times for bankruptcy -- once to avoid paying a federal court judgment for a civil rights violation?<br>
<br>w.<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 9:57 AM, Gary Crabtree <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com" target="_blank">jampot@roadrunner.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<u></u>
<div style="PADDING-LEFT:10px;PADDING-RIGHT:10px;PADDING-TOP:15px" name="Compose message area">
<div><font face="Calibri">I don't care for ice cream and Lord knows I'll be
winning no pageants. I cede both "bests" to you. I really think that you might
look good in a tiara.</font></div>
<div><font face="Calibri"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Calibri">g</font></div>
<div style="FONT:10pt Tahoma">
<div><br></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND:#f5f5f5">
<div><b>From:</b> <a title="art.deco.studios@gmail.com" href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">Art Deco</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 02, 2012 6:05 AM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title="jampot@roadrunner.com" href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com" target="_blank">Gary Crabtree</a> </div><div><div class="h5">
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .</div></div></div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
<div><br></div>Yes Gary, you are right.<br><br>"<span><i>Blue
litmus</i> paper turns red under acidic conditions and red <i>litmus</i>
paper turns <i>blue</i> under basic (i.e. alkaline)
conditions..."</span><br><br>This would certainly give us a reliable indication
of our general respective political/social perspectives. But would it show
which of us is the most handsome or the best ice cream critic?<br><br>w.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Gary Crabtree <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jampot@roadrunner.com" target="_blank">jampot@roadrunner.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:#ccc 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex" class="gmail_quote"><u></u>
<div style="PADDING-LEFT:10px;PADDING-RIGHT:10px;PADDING-TOP:15px" name="Compose message area">
<div><font face="Calibri">Perhaps there ought to be a litmus test?</font></div>
<div><font face="Calibri"></font> </div>
<div><font face="Calibri">g</font></div>
<div style="FONT:10pt Tahoma">
<div><br></div>
<div style="BACKGROUND:#f5f5f5">
<div><b>From:</b> <a title="art.deco.studios@gmail.com" href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">Art Deco</a> </div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, November 01, 2012 8:02 PM</div>
<div>
<div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title="vision2020@moscow.com" href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a>
</div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . .
.</div></div></div></div></div>
<div>
<div>
<div><br></div>Maybe it's rap-speak where some words mean the opposite of what
they ordinarily mean.<br><br>w.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 6:26 PM, Gary Crabtree <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:moscowlocksmith@gmail.com" target="_blank">moscowlocksmith@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:#ccc 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<div>Acidulous? You really need to make up your mind, Wayne. Everything
you've posted with regard to my character to date would have the
vision readership think me rather base.</div><span><font color="#888888">
<div> </div>
<div>g<br><br></div></font></span>
<div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 11:10 AM, Art Deco <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">art.deco.studios@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex" class="gmail_quote">I thoroughly resent the implication that there are more
insulting, acidulous posters on Vision 2020 than myself and Gary Crabtree!
<br><br>w.<br><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 2:06 PM, Scott Dredge <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" target="_blank">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT:rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid;MARGIN:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;PADDING-LEFT:1ex" class="gmail_quote">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Really Joe? I think my rants are of vastly higher
quality than Tom's and also more appropriate than Tom's because they're
in direct response to his low quality / ridiculous ones. If you
don't see it you're probably biased in favor of Tom which I don't take
issue with.<br><br>-Scott<br><br>
<div>
<div></div>
<hr>
CC: <a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>; <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>From: <a href="mailto:philosopher.joe@gmail.com" target="_blank">philosopher.joe@gmail.com</a>
<div><br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . .
.<br></div>Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 10:48:44 -0700<br>To: <a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" target="_blank">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a>
<div>
<div><br><br>
<div>Is there some reason that your insulting rants are better than
those of others? I don't see it.<br><br>On Nov 1, 2012, at 10:29 AM,
Scott Dredge <<a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" target="_blank">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Reposting - I grabbed the wrong Tom Hansen thread the
first time being's that there are so many of them...<br><br>Well golly
gee Mr. Hansen, I'm downright shocked that things aren't as simple and
as black & white as you first presented them to be and that since
you jumped the gun on this and trumped it up - as you do on a lot of
thing - that you now are reversing course and asking folks to contact
you off list so you can further explain in order to try and save
face. And this despicable thread is what you so now nonchalantly
refer to a 'venting [your] concern'??? You're pathetic.<br><br>
<div>
<div></div>
<hr>
From: <a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a><br>Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2012 08:39:27
-0700<br>To: <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>Subject: Re: [Vision2020]
Question, V-Peeps . . .<br><br>
<div>Upon further off-list review and discussion, I have decided
not to pursue this matter any further.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>If any of you fine V-Peeps are interested in how I reached this
decision, contact me off-list.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>In the interim, thank you for permitting me to vent my
concern.<br><br>
<div>Seeya at the polls, Moscow, because . . .</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>"Moscow Cares"</div>
<div><a href="http://www.MoscowCares.com" target="_blank">http://www.MoscowCares.com</a></div>
<div> </div>
<div>
<div>Tom Hansen</div>
<div>Moscow, Idaho</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.
The college students are not very active in local elections
(thank goodness!)."</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<div> </div></div></div>
<div><br>On Nov 1, 2012, at 4:46 AM, Tom Hansen <<a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div>Laws are only as firm as those that enforce them.</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>Stay tuned, V-Peeps<br><br>
<div>Seeya at the polls, Moscow, because . . .</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>"Moscow Cares"</div>
<div><a href="http://www.MoscowCares.com" target="_blank">http://www.MoscowCares.com</a></div>
<div> </div>
<div>
<div>Tom Hansen</div>
<div>Moscow, Idaho</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>"We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.
The college students are not very active in local elections
(thank goodness!)."</div>
<div><br></div>
<div>- Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<div> </div></div></div>
<div><br>On Nov 1, 2012, at 12:09 AM, Scott Dredge <<a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" target="_blank">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">Sounds reasonable to me Kit and I'd think this all
could be handled by just having a non-accusatory (if possible)
conversation with this council member and getting a better
understanding about his situation (should he choose to want this
publicly disclosed) and his ability to continue fulfilling his
duties. The tenor of the comments here on the Viz from the
regular contributors of group thinkers is that he's not well liked
and not at all trusted, so I don't really foresee the V2020 mob -
fully equipped with pitchforks and torches in hand - having a
cordial and honest conversation with this particular council
member.<br><br>I'm not a politician and nor will I ever be so it's
kind of tough for me to put myself in this guy's situation to say
what I'd do, but my sense is that I would simply have 'no comment'
to anyone or any group who was acting hostile toward me and
jumping to conclusions that I was operating in an underhanded and
dishonest manner and was making statements to the effect that they
wanted me to resign or be forcibly removed from my position.
What other choice is there...be forthcoming and cooperative and
have your admitted enemies use all that against you as they can
and would do? I think the legal requirements can easily be
addressed, but would then lead to your subsequent point regarding
gaming the system to meet Tom's supposedly all important 'letter
of the law' - which is really only important in terms of how
effective the law is to DQ this guy immediately from his
position. I'll give Tom credit that he is transparent on
that end goal.<br><br><br>
<div>
<div></div>> CC: <a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a>; <a href="mailto:kmmos1@frontier.com" target="_blank">kmmos1@frontier.com</a>; <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>
> From: <a href="mailto:kcraine@frontier.com" target="_blank">kcraine@frontier.com</a><br>> To: <a href="mailto:scooterd408@hotmail.com" target="_blank">scooterd408@hotmail.com</a><br>> Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .<br>> Date: Wed, 31 Oct
2012 21:46:58 -0700<br>> <br>> I think this basic question
is two fold:<br>> <br>> 1. Does the councilor involved met
the legal requirement that he <br>> resides in the district he
represents?<br>> <br>> 2. Does the councilor's heart reside
in the district he represents?<br>> <br>> In the first
instance, if the councilor does not reside -- or is <br>>
gaming the system to claim he resides -- in the district he
<br>> represents, should he be in office (morally or legally)
when he does <br>> not belong to the group he claims to
represent? The question is <br>> whether we (the citizens of
Moscow, Idaho) should accept being ruled <br>> by an outsider
(e.g. someone from Troy, Pullman, Spokane, New York, <br>>
Mars) who will not suffer the consequences of his
decisions.<br>> <br>> In the second instance, should a
person who does not have an interest <br>> in the future of a
community he represents (because he knows he will <br>> not
live with the consequences of his decisions) have a moral <br>>
obligation to step down from an office he holds?<br>> <br>>
City councilors determine the policies which run this city. Their
<br>> decisions impact every member of the population.
Regardless of of the <br>> legal status of a councilor's
claimed residence, the question is <br>> whether that councilor
is willing to live with the consequences of his/ <br>> her
decisions (i.e, will they be residing in Moscow after their
<br>> term?). The community has the right to ask why a
suspected out-of- <br>> community councilor ran for the
position AND why the councilor should <br>> continue to be
retained in the position. The councilor has an <br>> obligation
to answer -- AND to justify his continued membership of the
<br>> council in terms of the long-term benefits of a community
he had left.<br>> <br>> Kit Craine<br>> <br>> <br>>
On Oct 31, 2012, at 8:58 PM, Scott Dredge wrote:<br>> <br>>
> I'd hope that the city council members would ignore most of
your <br>> > numerous petty requests Tom, but let me know
how this all works out <br>> > for you. If this guy isn't
carrying out his duties (e.g. was not <br>> > involved in
any way) then that'd be the reason to jettison him. If <br>>
> this residency thing is a huge fricken' big deal and anyone
in the <br>> > powers that be gives one wit I'm sure there
can be some monumental <br>> > waste of time and effort put
forth to meet the letter of the law, <br>> > but what'd be
the point since you'd just go snooping for some other <br>>
> minor infraction to yell 'throw the bum out'. What a
joke.<br>> ><br>> > From: <a href="mailto:thansen@moscow.com" target="_blank">thansen@moscow.com</a><br>> > Date: Wed, 31
Oct 2012 04:19:31 -0700<br>> > To: <a href="mailto:kmmos1@frontier.com" target="_blank">kmmos1@frontier.com</a><br>> > CC: <a href="mailto:vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>
> > Subject: Re:
[Vision2020] Question, V-Peeps . . .<br>> ><br>> >
Bottom line: The law is the law; the spirit of the law being that
<br>> > our governing city council WILL NOT be comprised of
nonresidents.<br>> ><br>> > Reasoning for
noncompliance: There was no explanation given as to <br>> >
why the city code will not be enforced.<br>> ><br>> >
Options: As residents, subject to city code enforcement, we can
<br>> > either request, in a letter to the city council and
Mayor Chaney, <br>> > that action be taken or we can join
Mr. Dredge in burying our heads <br>> > in the proverbial
sand.<br>> ><br>> > I have NEVER been known to sit on
my hands.<br>> ><br>> > As one quote goes . .
.<br>> ><br>> > "Lead, follow, or get the hell out of
the way!"<br>> ><br>> > This IS important, Moscow,
because . . .<br>> ><br>> > "Moscow Cares"<br>>
> <a href="http://www.MoscowCares.com" target="_blank">http://www.MoscowCares.com</a><br>> ><br>>
> Tom Hansen<br>> > Moscow, Idaho<br>> ><br>>
><br>> ><br>> ><br>> > On Oct 31, 2012, at
3:34 AM, Kenneth Marcy <<a href="mailto:kmmos1@frontier.com" target="_blank">kmmos1@frontier.com</a>> <br>> >
wrote:<br>> ><br>> > On 10/30/2012 11:12 PM, Scott
Dredge wrote:<br>> > It's a non-issue.<br>> ><br>>
> One of the essential characteristics of municipal government
is that <br>> > it is relatively local, i.e., close to those
who are governed and, <br>> > ipso facto, those who are
governed are close to those who govern <br>> > them. If one
of those governing changes one of his characteristics <br>>
> from local to non-local, that change creates an incongruity
with <br>> > local government characteristics which may be
resolved by <br>> > resignation from office by the
incongruous person.<br>> ><br>> > It's tantamount to
claiming Obama is ineligible to be president <br>> > because
many believe he was born in Kenya.<br>> ><br>> > That
is maldirective nonsense. Many people believe incorrect <br>>
> information to their individual and our collective detriment.
The <br>> > fact of their belief does not justify it, nor
does it serve as a <br>> > basis for argument that because
it is true that anything else is true.<br>> ><br>> >
If this Tim Brown character is not eligible to be sitting on the
<br>> > council, then someone who cares about this should
follow the <br>> > processes in place to remove / replace
him.<br>> ><br>> > Tim Brown initiated the processes
necessary to place himself into <br>> > membership of the
Moscow City Council at a time when his <br>> >
characteristics were consonant with such membership. Apparently he
<br>> > has changed those characteristics, so he should
initiate the <br>> > processes necessary to remove himself
from membership of the Moscow <br>> > City Council.<br>>
><br>> > That'd just be far too logical and it won't
happen so this flap is <br>> > much ado about
nothing.<br>> ><br>> > Asking other people to expend
the energy to collectively act to do <br>> > what the
incumbent could, and should, do individually with less <br>>
> energy, and more grace, is neither "logical" nor efficient,
and <br>> > represents a level of counterproductivity that
is counterintuitive <br>> > to better local
government.<br>> ><br>> > "Much ado about nothing"
serves better as a Shakespearean play title <br>> > than as
a description of this discussion.<br>> ><br>>
><br>> > Ken<br>> >
=======================================================<br>>
> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>>
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>>
> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a><br>> > <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> >
=======================================================<br>>
><br>> >
======================================================= List
<br>> > services made available by First Step Internet,
serving the <br>> > communities of the Palouse since 1994.
<a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a>
<a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a>=======================================================<br>>
>
=======================================================<br>>
> List services made available by First Step Internet,<br>>
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>>
> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a><br>> > <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>> >
=======================================================<br>>
<br></div></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote>
<blockquote>
<div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span>List
services made available by First Step
Internet,</span><br><span>serving the communities of the Palouse
since
1994.</span><br><span> <a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a></span><br><span> <a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com</a></span><br>
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=======================================================</div></div></div></blockquote>
<blockquote>
<div><span>=======================================================</span><br><span>List
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<span><font color="#888888"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<br><a href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">art.deco.studios@gmail.com</a><br><br><img src=""><br><br></font></span><br>
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communities of the Palouse since 1994.<br>
<a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a><br>
mailto:<a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>=======================================================<br></blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all">
<br>-- <br>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<br><a href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">art.deco.studios@gmail.com</a><br><br><img src="http://users.moscow.com/waf/WP%20Fox%2001.jpg"><br><br></div></div>
<p></p>
<hr>
<div>
<p></p>=======================================================<br> List
services made available by First Step Internet,<br> serving the
communities of the Palouse since
1994.<br>
<a href="http://www.fsr.net" target="_blank">http://www.fsr.net</a><br>
mailto:<a href="mailto:Vision2020@moscow.com" target="_blank">Vision2020@moscow.com</a><br>=======================================================</div>
<p></p></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Art Deco (Wayne A.
Fox)<br><a href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">art.deco.studios@gmail.com</a><br><br><img src="http://users.moscow.com/waf/WP%20Fox%2001.jpg"><br><br></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)<br><a href="mailto:art.deco.studios@gmail.com" target="_blank">art.deco.studios@gmail.com</a><br><br><img src="http://users.moscow.com/waf/WP%20Fox%2001.jpg"><br>
<br>