[Vision2020] Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
Joe Campbell
philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Mon Jun 25 13:09:33 PDT 2012
Financial ineptitude? So far he's got $2 mill in his pocket and he's not in jail. Allegedly.
On Jun 25, 2012, at 3:15 PM, Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com> wrote:
> A newer address for Michael Hoffmann:
>
> <TerraMark 2012 Corporate Report 6-25-2012 11-52-37 AM.png>
>
> This whole debacle in which Germer Construction, Inc stands to be deadbeat out of over a half million dollars gives some lessons, including:
>
> 1. Christ Church Cult Congregants ought see this venture which was born of Cultmaster's Douglas Wilson's extreme egotism, arrogance, and financial ineptitude as a glaring counterexample to the Calvinistic Prosperity Gospel which they are constantly hosed with. And especially after the resounding, humiliating defeat of the principles found in Wilson's magnum opus Federal Vision, 1350 to 50 by those most likely to be in sympathy with his views -- http://pcaac.org/2007GeneralAssembly/Fed%20%20Vision%20Rept%20%205-11-07.pdf
>
> 2. The MO of "Find them, fool them, and fleece them" does not always work even among the very gullible.
>
> In my opinion up until about a year ago Wilson would have had a good chance of using a "Liquidate and Evacuate Strategy." A successful liquidation is now most likely impractical and improbable. The window for a successful evacuation is rapidly closing due to a number of possible events, among them, health repercussions.
>
>
> w.
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>
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> On Sun, Jun 24, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com> wrote:
> WOW ! ! !
>
> Yes. I have hard-copies of letters (which I have digitized) sent by you and another family in the area to the city concerning something along these lines.
>
> Maybe I ought to find 'em and post 'em to the Viz under the subject line of "Remember When . . . "
>
> Whatcha think?
>
> Tom
>
> "If not us, who?
> If not now, when?"
>
> - Unknown
>
>
>
> On Jun 24, 2012, at 17:19, "Bev Bafus" <bevbafus at frontier.com> wrote:
>
>> Also, do a business entity search on the Secretary of State’s page. Look up Greensides.
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>> The Homeowner’s Association has been dissolved (having one was a requirement of the City’s Planned Unit Development)
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>> Greensides, Inc. is supposedly in goodstanding, but the report is late. The question is, Where is Mike Hoffmann?
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>> There is a new “Greensides” listing the agent as Mark Wintz. He’s the one doing the new homes right on N. Polk.
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>> I told the City this would be a clusterf***, but they didn’t listen.
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>> Thanks
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>> Bev
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>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Art Deco
>> Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 3:34 PM
>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
>>
>>
>>
>> Saundra hits on some of the big mysteries/questions in this case (not a small one with at least about $546,000 allegedly owing as of today, and growing at the rate of about $323 per day).
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>> Allegedly a loan of an alleged $2,000,000 was allegedly negotiated by loan officer Craig Knott of U.S. Bank for the development of Greensides. Questions: Why wasn't Germer paid from the proceeds of that loan? Did the bank pay the proceeds of the loan directly to the corporation instead of paying it to directly to the contractors upon approval by the corporation as is the usual case? Looking at the development, how could they have spent $2,000,000 on what has been done?
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>> The complaint alleges unjust [personal] enrichment by Douglas Wilson of Christ Church, and his number one boy, Matt Gray, both residents of Greensides. This means that corporate funds were allegedly used to enrich Wilson and Gray either by services rendered or directly. If so, that raises two issues:
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>> Were those corporate funds/debt incurment used reimbursed to the corporation by Wilson and Gray?
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>> If not:
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>> 1. Then possible theft/fraud from the corporation has occurred, thus rendering shareholder immunity from corporate debt/liability null and void for Wilson and Gray, and
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>> 2. If the alleged enrichment was not reported on Wilson and/or Gray's tax returns, then that is concealing income. If anyone is found to have concealed income, the the IRS may audit many years into the past beyond the normal three or four years. I've seen this happen, and the results are not pretty for the misreporter. Such audits are aggressive and deeply probing.
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>> Not much has happened in the case lately. Perhaps the attorneys are working it out. But if not, during the discovery phase of the case, I am sure there will be a most meticulous and demanding probe of all corporate transactions and the associated money trails among other things.
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>> I live in rural Latah County so I seldom am around the morning/afternoon coffee klatches that occur particularly among local business persons, but news of some discussions reaches me through some of the participants. Business persons are usually very guarded in discussing in public Douglas Wilson/Christ Church et al because of fear of reprisal (e.g. like one that happened when a local vendor signed a petition supporting human rights). But after the Germer complaint was filed, there has been more public freewheeling discussion. An alleged half million dollar deadbeat understandably sends shock waves through the local business and financial communities.
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>> That said, what the discussion amount to could be said this way: If you had bought stock in Douglas Wilson' credibility, integrity, and fiscal responsibility late last year, and then sold it today, you would probably take a hell of a loss.
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>> Business persons rightly abhor deadbeats. The enterprise system doesn't work unless customers/clients pay for goods and services rendered. Which may make some business persons now quite wary to do business with Douglas Wilson and/or his associated enterprises on much credit -- one can hardly blame them: there appears to be at least a half million good reasons.
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>> If Wilson/Gray/Greensides et al have other unsettled debts, especially debts due private lenders, then more trouble may loom. Some private lenders prefer to use other means, antithetical to legal ones, to enforce collection, and such means are not pleasant. It would behoove debtors to these kind of private lenders to promptly pay their debts or to carry very good health insurance.
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>> w.
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>> --
>> On Sun, Jun 24, 2012 at 1:34 PM, Saundra Lund <v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm> wrote:
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>> Like Paul, I’m not an attorney, nor have I ever played one on TV <g>, but my reading of the complaint is a little different than is his.
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>> Paul wrote:
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>> “Greensides was not setup correctly as a corporation that they can try to get the money they allege is owed to them directly from Doug and the two other defendants and apparently 5 "John Does" which are presumably other Greensides Inc board members.”
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>> Actually, I think that part of the complaint pertains to unjust personal enrichment in addition to some failure to properly incorporate Greensides, Inc. Certain defendants apparently took positive action to have their homes included in the subdivision and received personal gain/benefits from the work Germer did.
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>> Now, which defendants those are and what personal benefit those defendants gained is difficult to tell because where’s the contract? It’s referenced in the Complaint as an attached exhibit, but it doesn’t seem to be included in the Complaint Tom has posted.
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>> This whole thing is confusing to me. I definitely am not up on the complexities of subdivision development, but it seems to me US Bank financed at least some part of Greensides because I remember seeing their sign out there for a very long time.
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>> Anyway, what happened to all that money? Did they just hand the lump sum over to Greensides, Inc.? Isn’t that kind of money typically doled out to the borrower/developer as expenses are incurred? And, if that’s the case, what happened to that money if it wasn’t used to pay companies like Germer Construction?
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>> But, as long as we’re on the topic of Greensides, this certainly isn’t the first time those associated with the development have tried to skip out on paying what’s owed. As I recall, several liens were placed on the initial two new units constructed because local businesses weren’t paid for their work, and Design Craft Homes, LLC doesn’t pay its debts, either.
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>> There certainly seems to have been more than the normal amount of smoke & mirrors involved with the Greensides development!
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>> It will be interesting to see how this case plays out. I’m surprised a case of this magnitude hasn’t been covered by the local press, but then again, perhaps the Moscow-Pullman Daily News is a little embarrassed that they wrote an extensive front page article about Mike Hoffman basically presenting him as the best thing to happen to Moscow development since the arrival of sliced bread. Oops.
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>> Saundra
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>> Moscow, ID
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>> I distrust those who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires.
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>> ~ Susan B. Anthony
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>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Paul Rumelhart
>> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 3:30 PM
>> To: Joe Campbell
>> Cc: Moscow Vision 2020
>>
>>
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
>>
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>> Germer Construction is apparently alleging that the work they did by contract for Greensides Inc was not paid for, and that they are owed the original amount plus interest plus $200 a day for an extended period due thanks to particulars in the contract.
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>> They are also alleging that Tom's old friend Doug Wilson is one of the board members of Greensides and that as they believe that Greensides was not setup correctly as a corporation that they can try to get the money they allege is owed to them directly from Doug and the two other defendants and apparently 5 "John Does" which are presumably other Greensides Inc board members.
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>> Take the above with a grain of salt, I just skimmed it. I am not a lawyer, etc, etc.
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>> I'm sure Tom is saddened to know that Doug is named in this court document and is trying to garner community support for his plight :)
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>> Paul
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>> From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
>> To: Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com>; Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 2:04 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
>>
>>
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>> What is it?
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>> On Jun 22, 2012, at 4:43 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
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>> You must be positively giddy about this :)
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>> Paul
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>> From: Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com>
>> To: Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>> Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 11:55 AM
>> Subject: [Vision2020] Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
>>
>>
>> As I am busy converting and formatting various documents, you are free to browse . . .
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>> Case No. CV-2011-1234 (Germer Const., Inc. v. Greensides Inc, Wilson, Gray, and Hoffman)
>> http://www.MoscowCares.com/GermerGreensides/
>>
>> Stay tuned, V-Peeps, because . . .
>>
>> "Moscow Cares"
>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>
>> Tom Hansen
>> Moscow, Idaho
>>
>> "If not us, who?
>> If not now, when?"
>>
>> - Unknown
>>
>>
>>
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>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
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>>
>>
>>
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>
>> <~WRD000.jpg>
>
>
>
> --
> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>
>
>
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> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
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