[Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

Mon Dec 17 20:58:32 PST 2012

The chart that Saundra included in her email is a rational and fair way to regulate firearms.  How could anyone object to such a reasonable approach?  Actually, if I had my druthers all firearms would be sold through a law enforcement office.  Background checks could easily be conducted.  (Although, I am not forgetting that someone in the sheriff’s office provided murderer Jason Hamilton with a concealed gun permit . ).  Perhaps before any sale is final at a private business the purchaser should be required to pay the sheriff’s office to electronically forward the background check directly to the vendor.  The vendor could reply electronically with the serial number, type of firearm, etc. so that the state would have sale information in a database.  The merchant could retain a copy of the transaction and related information as a backup copy in case it was needed.  

Rose Huskey

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Saundra Lund
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 8:14 PM
To: 'Paul Rumelhart'; 'vision 2020'
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

Paul wrote:

“Anything we try to do in the meantime will almost certainly be an overreaction.”

Hogwash.  

Given the horrendous regularity of gun violence in this nation, how convenient for people to propose  that after violence isn’t the time to look at much needed and long overdue reforms.  That position guarantees reform will never happen because there will never be enough time between incidents.  And, frankly, I don’t know how those who’ve continued to advocate the “hands off” approach to meaningful reform dare to look in their damn mirrors anymore.

Fortunately, many people are far more capable of reasoned thinking in crisis than you want to give us credit for.  Besides, Paul, quite a few people, including a lot of really smart ones, have been discussing reasonable reform long before the SHES tragedy.  It’s not like the lunacy of gun violence in America is new.

Long before the SHES tragedy, I was beyond heartbroken by the nearly daily news coverage of this child or that being accidentally shot – and often killed -- by their parents’ weapons.  And, I was beyond weary of this person or that being killed by a stolen gun or a gun purchased through the gun show loophole that never should have been sold to an individual.  It’s crystal clear to me that far too many “gun enthusiasts” take advantage of their right to have whatever weapons their hearts’ desire without taking the responsibility that goes along with having those weapons, and anyone who argues that isn’t the case is a damn fool or a damn liar.  When products have hurt or killed far, far fewer than those who are victims or survivors of gun violence, we demand reform.  What on earth is wrong with people who choose to accept the shameless fear-mongering of the despicable NRA over good-ol’  American  common sense?!?

Paul also wrote:

“For instance, if I said "the second amendment is about more than protecting kindergartners from being shot", I would currently be lambasted as an uncaring person who is dancing on the graves of 6 year-olds or something.”

Nonsense, and I’m getting pretty tired of your very frequent “everybody always picks on me” belly-aching.  Is this paranoia a part of your daily life, or do you just show it here?

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/184429_419049228164756_1572175596_n.png

Saundra

From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Paul Rumelhart
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 4:39 PM
To: Sue Hovey; Sunil Ramalingam; vision 2020
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

A few days after the accident when they are discussing the funerals on TV of the kids and are interviewing bereaved parents and getting the "man on the street's" view of things is a horrible time to try to sit down and have a rational conversation about what we can and cannot do to help strengthen our gun laws or figure out a better way to deal with mental health problems.  It's a great time to act if you are a group that has a preset agenda and just happens to have a bill all written up that you have been dying to pass, but that won't help anyone but the people with the agendas.  See our reaction as a country to 9/11 as a good lesson on this topic.

I'm hoping lawmakers will wait until the passion of the moment has died down and we have some distance before we try to rework the gun laws.  Fat chance, I know.

For instance, if I said "the second amendment is about more than protecting kindergartners from being shot", I would currently be lambasted as an uncaring person who is dancing on the graves of 6 year-olds or something.  *Maybe* in a few weeks we'll be able to really discuss it.  Anything we try to do in the meantime will almost certainly be an overreaction.

Paul

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From: Sue Hovey < <mailto:suehovey at moscow.com> suehovey at moscow.com>
To: Sunil Ramalingam < <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>; vision 2020 < <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com> vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Cc: Paul Rumelhart < <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com> godshatter at yahoo.com> 
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

“Knee-jerk reaction or fear-driven acts.”  Those are interesting but patronizing ways to characterize the responses to these killings, and of the same mindset, I think, as “guns don’t kill people.”   We need to be considering all our options and we should have been doing that for a very long time.   Those of us who live here, own guns, and use them for hunting and self-protection need to be willing to look at the cultural issues that are bigger than our own mindsets.  Might it not be that we need to consider restating the Second Amendment in such a way as to prohibit private ownership of certain types of armament?  We already do some of that within the scope of the amendment; why not look further?  Why not consider the way we publicize the events...the murderer, who may have never had much in the way of self gratification, can be sure if his, yes his, crime is of a certain magnitude, he will be remembered for the way it was publicized with his face on every newscast and every front page? A First Amendment question....dare we consider it?    There are a lot of issues here, none of them trivial.  

Sue H.

From:  <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> Sunil Ramalingam 

Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 2:06 PM

To:  <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com> vision 2020 

Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

But the cartoon doesn't advocate banning all guns. It shows someone leaving the NRA, which opposes the regulation you find reasonable.

The NRA's response to regulation is fear-driven. It's one of their marketing techniques, or to use another of your terms below, a knee-jerk reaction.

Sunil

  _____  

Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 14:01:04 -0800
From:  <mailto:godshatter at yahoo.com> godshatter at yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .
To:  <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> sunilramalingam at hotmail.com;  <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com> vision2020 at moscow.com

There's a difference between being prepared and simply reacting to something.  I take a blanket and a flashlight with me on winter trips in the car, I carry jumper cables in the trunk, I have smoke alarms and a fire extinguisher in my house, I bring a space blanket, some matches, and a folding knife with me when I go hiking, and I keep a gun at home in case I need to protect myself.

Banning all guns because someone used one in a horrifying way appears to me to be more of a fear-driven act.  There is definitely room for improvement in who we sell guns to and how well we learn how to use them but that's a discussion that should happen after the knee-jerk reactions have passed.

Paul

  _____  

From: Sunil Ramalingam < <mailto:sunilramalingam at hotmail.com> sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>
To: vision 2020 < <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com> vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 1:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

Paul,

Doesn't that apply to both sides of the argument?

Sunil

  _____  

Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:27:10 -0800
From: godshatter at yahoo.com
To: thansen at moscow.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

If you want your life to be ruled by fear-driven reflex, sure.

Paul

  _____  

From: Tom Hansen < <mailto:thansen at moscow.com> thansen at moscow.com>
To: Moscow Vision 2020 < <mailto:vision2020 at moscow.com> vision2020 at moscow.com> 
Sent: Monday, December 17, 2012 12:44 PM
Subject: [Vision2020] Isn't it about time . . .

Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .

"Moscow Cares"
http://www.MoscowCares.com

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

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