[Vision2020] Religion, Moscow Billboards, and the First Amendment (Part 2)
Tom Hansen
thansen at moscow.com
Mon Dec 10 09:45:32 PST 2012
Mr. Dredge -
You are reading way too deep into something that simply isn't there. This seems to be a trait of yours.
What color is the sky in your world?
Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
"Moscow Cares"
http://www.MoscowCares.com
Tom Hansen, CPL (Commie Pinko Liberal)
Moscow, Idaho
On Dec 10, 2012, at 9:26 AM, Scott Dredge <scooterd408 at hotmail.com> wrote:
> Is there some inconsistency you're trying to point out in something Donovan posted 7+ years ago regarding 'some Bibles' have it wrong versus what he's written now regarding 'people believe in God because of the evidence God has presented to them'?
>
> -Scott
>
> On Dec 10, 2012, at 8:33 AM, "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
>
>> “Wording plays a big part in understanding the nature and meaning a verse written two thousand years ago in a different language, and some
>> Bibles just have it plain wrong.”
>>
>> - Donovan Arnold (August 23, 2005)
>>
>> http://mailman.fsr.com/pipermail/vision2020/2005-August/019660.html
>>
>> Seeya round town, Moscow, because . . .
>>
>> "Moscow Cares"
>> http://www.MoscowCares.com
>>
>> Tom Hansen, CPL (Commie Pinko Liberal)
>> Moscow, Idaho
>>
>>
>> On Dec 9, 2012, at 11:51 AM, Donovan Arnold <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Christianity, Islam, and Judaism is a fact. Billions around the world practice what they believe is a form of it. I don't have a problem with someone not believing in God. But I am rightfully offended for someone to claim people that believe in God or a superior being or beings do so because they have stupid naive childlike minds that don't understand science. This is arrogant thinking because many people believe in God because of the evidence God has presented to them as an individual in their life. You mock billions and their personal experiences only because you have not had the experiences they have had. I feel sorrow for these people, and pray they seek the evidence they so desperatly need to fill the giant hole they have in their life, heart and mind that there is something out there bigger and smarter than them waiting for them to find and be embraced by. I would be empty without my faith and God. I can only the imagine that horror of being stuck an atheist seeking something with only a human understanding of science that science cannot ever expose. Believing everyday was a chance, and that love, and my meaning in life were simply a fictitious story written by our imaginations, how empty a life. Don't assume why people believe in God, just accept and respect that they do, and we will accept and respect that you don't.
>>>
>>> Donovan J. Arnold
>>>
>>> From: Art Deco <art.deco.studios at gmail.com>
>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 8, 2012 4:00 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Religion, Moscow Billboards, and the First Amendment (Part 2)
>>>
>>> One could easily argue that teaching children that Christianity, Islam, Judaism, or etc as fact rather than fantasy based on faith/hope is child abuse, and abuse which can have an long term deleterious consequences.
>>>
>>> w.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 4:05 AM, Saundra Lund <v2020 at ssl1.fastmail.fm> wrote:
>>> Paul, after listening to Judd Wilson’s & his pal Greg Evan’s complaints, they think that their offense at having their Christianity “mocked” on a billboard (you can bet neither would give a rip if the Islamic faith was a specific target since both men supported a candidate who distributed an ugly attack on that faith) is more important than the First Amendment.
>>>
>>> No, the City didn’t put up the billboard nor does it own the billboard or the land. The billboard & land are privately owned AFAIK, and the American Humanist Association (AHA) paid for the content, just like they’ve done periodically for several years now.
>>>
>>> As Ted pointed out, Christianity isn’t specifically targeted on the billboard, but both Christian men took offense nonetheless, and I doubt either would care if some other religion had been targeted as neither men are known for their religious tolerance or acceptance.
>>>
>>> Additionally, Judd Wilson stooped to a particularly low level dragging his young child into the argument when his comments make it clear that it wasn’t his daughter who was offended but rather he himself. Not that it would matter, IMHO: when a child’s offense at being pressured (I hope they aren’t still required!) to participate or witness in vivisection doesn’t matter, mere words on a billboard certainly don’t.
>>>
>>> As to why they took it to the City Council, I imagine they were hoping they could sucker the City into a costly effort to suppress the First Amendment. Religious bigots like those men have a long history, especially in this area, of trying to use the law to force their religious beliefs on the rest of us. I imagine they were hoping they could whip enough other religious bigots (similar to 2004) into a frenzy to get the City to do something stupid.
>>>
>>> I don’t know why Judd Wilson thinks the billboard is any different than the unsolicited offensive crap pretending to be a legit newspaper he sent out via the USPS.
>>>
>>> Oh, wait, I guess I do know: it’s just another example of rank hypocrisy. His personal offense matters; no one else’s does.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Saundra
>>> Moscow, ID
>>>
>>> Compassion is the basis of all morality.
>>> ~ Arthur Schopenhuaer
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Joe Campbell
>>>
>>> Sent: Friday, December 07, 2012 3:50 PM
>>> To: Paul Rumelhart
>>> Cc: Lois; Friends of the Clearwater; Moscow Vision 2020; Jeanne McHale; Fritz Knorr; Friends of the Palouse Ranger District
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Religion, Moscow Billboards, and the First Amendment (Part 2)
>>>
>>> Another good question! My answer: Because by bringing it to the City of Moscow he'll get more attention.
>>> On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Paul Rumelhart <godshatter at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't understand why he's petitioning the city council. Did the City of Moscow put that billboard up? Do they own the land or the billboard itself? Does he think it's breaking the law in some way?
>>>
>>> Sorry if it's all laid out in the video, I haven't had the time to watch it yet.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>> From: Joe Campbell <philosopher.joe at gmail.com>
>>> To: Ted Moffett <starbliss at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Lois <loisb at q.com>; Friends of the Clearwater <foc at friendsoftheclearwater.org>; Moscow Vision 2020 <vision2020 at moscow.com>; Jeanne McHale <jeannemchale at hotmail.com>; Fritz Knorr <fritzknorr at gmail.com>; Friends of the Palouse Ranger District <fprd09 at gmail.com>
>>> Sent: Friday, December 7, 2012 3:31 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Religion, Moscow Billboards, and the First Amendment (Part 2)
>>>
>>> Good point, Ted. Joe
>>> On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 2:10 PM, Ted Moffett <starbliss at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> I'm listening to this presentation at this moment, and it appears that Wilson thinks the billboard was specifically aimed at Christianity, when given what I saw on this billboard, it does not target Christianity any more than any religion that has "God" as a belief. The billboard indeed could apply to Islam or Judaism, etc. or even perhaps belief in "Gaia" which some think is a unscientific "God" substitute for pagans.
>>> ------------------------------------------
>>> Vision2020 Post: Ted Moffett
>>> On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 3:34 PM, Moscow Cares <moscowcares at moscow.com> wrote:
>>> Mayor Chaney's, and the Moscow City Council's, Response to Judd Wilson's November 19th Complaint
>>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoozIpwfo5U
>>>
>>> <image001.jpg>
>>>
>>> Stay tuned, Visionaires, because . . .
>>>
>>> "Moscow Cares"
>>> http://www.moscowcares.com/
>>>
>>> Tom Hansen
>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Art Deco (Wayne A. Fox)
>>> art.deco.studios at gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net/
>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
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