[Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

Wed Aug 29 16:17:22 PDT 2012

Scott, 

Oh I think for most of us, tolerant believers and non-believers alike, it’s something more than a  minor irritation, particularly when the prayer is obviously a denominational piece.  For instance, I get very uncomfortable with the Christian practice of praying, “in Jesus name,” when the audience is comprised of different religious groups.  But I think it is getting better.  When I first started teaching in MHS the major role of the student body vice president was to lead the opening prayer in school assembly. (Already declared unconstitutional)  The kids themselves decided to dispense with the practice, and that was that.  No big deal.  And in the 70s when I was going throughout the state explaining a very unpopular State Board Rule, I got prayed over a lot in teachers’ meetings.  Mostly it was to let God know they hated the rule, but liked me ok because I was just the messenger.  So I agree, this isn’t the most significant religious intrusion, but it is an irksome one.   

Sue H.

From: Scott Dredge 
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 11:38 PM
To: suehovey at moscow.com ; philosopher.joe at gmail.com 
Cc: viz 
Subject: RE: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

I get your point Sue about prayers / non-believers, but IMO the Democrats should embrace diversity and should have a big enough tent to encompass believers as well as non-believers and simply make it clear that they champion freedom of religion without government interference as well as governing the people without enshrining Biblical law into secular law.  I'm not sure how damaging opening / closing prayers are to the non-believers, but I'd guess they're all over the map from some who cover their ears to others who simply play along and close their eyes to others who just give a blank stare through all of it. 

Maybe some day we'll get to the point where only a very few Religious Fundies would not fall apart at the mere mention of 'Evolution' and that only a very few non-believers would not freak out at the mention of 'God'.  Until then, I'll still tease them both with those forbidden words :)

In God Some Trust!

-Scott

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: suehovey at moscow.com
To: scooterd408 at hotmail.com; philosopher.joe at gmail.com
CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2012 22:03:02 -0700

I don’t think so.  Political parties are not government entities and they aren’t funded by taxes.  The conventions are held in public buildings but I think they could argue “equal access” in this regard.  Tax funded protection services are used all the time for churches locally.    I think the more important question is, “why have prayers where there are groups who aren’t believers?”  That one isn’t going to be considered anytime soon. 

And maybe the RNC used the KOC just to ensure no women were allowed to take part.  Seems to follow their “war on women” theme for the election season. 

Sue H

From: Scott Dredge 
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 7:50 PM
To: Joe Campbell 
Cc: Moscow Vision2020 
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

This isn't at odds with the 1st Amendment, is it?  It's just a closing prayer at a DNC.  It just seems like an easy way to try and siphon some votes from the GOP. 

-Scott

On Aug 28, 2012, at 7:41 PM, "Joe Campbell" <philosopher.joe at gmail.com> wrote:

  It is interesting, that in an age when the right to religious belief has run amok, that this part of the 1st Amendment (the Establishment Clause) often gets overlooked.

  On Tue, Aug 28, 2012 at 7:28 PM, Rosemary Huskey <donaldrose at cpcinternet.com> wrote:

    What happened to the separation of church and state?  

    Rose

    From: Ron Force [mailto:rforce2003 at yahoo.com] 
    Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 7:16 PM
    To: Rosemary Huskey; 'Moscow Vision2020'

    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

    Democrats, too:

    Sister Simone Campbell And Cardinal Timothy Dolan To Bless The Democratic Convention
    Religion News Service  |  By David Gibson Posted: 08/28/2012 6:31 pm Updated: 08/28/2012 6:31 pm

    <image001.jpg>
    NEW YORK (RNS) In a move that could recast the reigning political narrative about the Catholic bishops, Cardinal Timothy Dolan has accepted an invitation to deliver the closing benediction at the Democratic National Convention, a week after he gives a similar blessing to the Republicans in Tampa, Fla.

    From the start, Dolan, who is also president of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, made it clear that he would be willing to pray at the Democratic convention. There were doubts, however, that the Democrats would invite Dolan.

    The Obama campaign also revealed Tuesday (Aug. 28) that Sister Simone Campbell, the popular face of the recent "Nuns on the Bus" tour for social justice, will be addressing the Democrats in Charlotte, N.C., the night before Dolan's appearance.

    That is kind of a Catholic "two-fer" that threatens to upstage GOP nominee Mitt Romney's Catholic outreach and highlights the importance of this swing vote in a deadlocked race...

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/28/cardinal-timothy-dolan-sister-simone-campbell-democratic-convention_n_1837848.html 

    Ron Force
    Moscow Idaho USA

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: Rosemary Huskey <donaldrose at cpcinternet.com>
    To: 'Ron Force' <rforce2003 at yahoo.com>; 'Moscow Vision2020' <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
    Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 5:05 PM
    Subject: RE: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

    Splendid, kissing the bishop’s ring. . . how can Evangelical Republicans stand this blatant pandering?   Remember how Repubs used to worry about John Kennedy bringing Rome to Washington?  

    Yowsa!!!!!!

    Rose Huskey

    From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com [mailto:vision2020-bounces at moscow.com] On Behalf Of Ron Force
    Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 3:52 PM
    To: Moscow Vision2020
    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

    Here's why the KOC:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/the-catholic-vote-is-the-2012-bellwether/2012/05/03/gIQAXkJhyT_blog.html 

    Ron Force
    Moscow Idaho USA

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com>
    To: Rosemary Huskey <donaldrose at cpcinternet.com> 
    Cc: viz <vision2020 at moscow.com> 
    Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 11:44 AM
    Subject: Re: [Vision2020] absolutely unbelieveable.

    The RNC opening ceremony WITHOUT a military honor guard to present the colors?!?!

    WHAT AN EFFING PILE OF CRAP!!!

    Who else is the GOP going to disrespect?

    Seeya round town, Moscow.

    Tom Hansen

    Moscow, Idaho

    "We're a town of about 23,000 with 10,000 college students.  The college students are not very active in local elections (thank goodness!)."

    - Dale Courtney (March 28, 2007)

    On Aug 28, 2012, at 11:13 AM, "Rosemary Huskey" <donaldrose at cpcinternet.com> wrote:

      I am gobsmacked beyond belief…..  even in my most cynical, sarcastic mood never would I have imagined that the Republican Party would invite the Knights of Columbus – with their silly plumed hats and swords to present the colors at the opening of their convention this morning – followed by the worst tenor ever heard straining out the National Anthem.  It is a rich satire complete with audience shots of frumpy old white women decked out in a super heavy application of pancake makeup and deep blue eye shadow.  I’m frightened!!!!!.  

      Rose Huskey

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