[Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
Art Deco
deco at moscow.com
Mon Dec 27 15:50:37 PST 2010
Chuck wrote:
1. "So, Tom, if the "guy" was 18 and the girlfriend was 17, how long should he be placed in prison for rape? Just curious."
2. "Okay, the "guy" is 18 and his girlfriend is 15 years and 11 months and 29 days old and he is a senior in high school and she is a sophomore."
Are we now referring to Hunter Martin Hursh or is this a hypothetical question? Hunter Martin Hursh was born in 1988 so in 2009 he was either 20 or 21.
What is the real truth here? Is this how the PA and the court are flummoxed? If so, pity the public.
So that we do not lose track of the criminal background of Hursh:
https://www.idcourts.us/repository/caseHistory.do?roaDetail=yes&schema=LATAH&county=Latah&partySeq=87230&displayName=Hursh%2C+Hunter+Martin
Hursh is not some innocent who in the heat of passion had sex with a 15 year old. He has shown either that he cares little for the law, is a very slow learner, and/or he is a psychopath/sociopath.
I do not believe that successful completion of a six month term in Cottonwood is a reliable indication that Hursh (or anyone) has learned their lesson and is/are rehabilitated. What Hursh has probably learned is how to game the system, how to avoid being caught, and if caught, how to minimize the probability of conviction and/or a stiff sentence.
There are several factors that a judge must consider when deciding upon a reasonable sentence. These include the probability or recurring criminal behavior, personal and general deterrence, danger to the public, probability of rehabilitation, and retribution. These are elements that must be taken very seriously, especially if a plea bargain is offered.
In my opinion neither the prosecutor nor at least two judges in the Second Judicial District take these duties seriously enough. They especially fail in considering the public interest/safety enough. In one case of the judges, in my opinion, laziness/nonchalance is a factor. In the other, a dangerously mistaken belief that everyone can be rehabilitated (dangerous especially in Idaho where rehabilitation programs are minimal) is a factor. The prosecutor and his staff are much less than stellar in the courtroom so they are the mercy of some quite competent defense attorneys whose sworn duty is to accede to the wishes (within the canons of ethics) of their clients.
A rape has occurred. A guilty plea to rape [IC 19-6101] was entered. The defendant has a serious criminal record. Prior to the handing down of the sentence for rape, the defendant was convicted of several more serious crimes.
So is $305 fine, five years of probation, a withheld judgment, and 30 days of discretionary jail time going to:
1. Deter Hursh from further crimes?
2. Make the public safer from further offences?
3. Offer rape and other serious crime victims the assurance that reporting the offense(s) and being subjected to the trauma of court process is worth the probable outcome in the criminal justice system?
4. Motivate law enforcement to expend the effort to work up winnable cases?
5. Rehabilitate the now habitually criminal defendant?
I doubt it.
I am guessing that we have another case like that of James Curtis Leonard (see below) who murdered his friend with several shots at point blank range and then served an initial sentence of five months. A real triumph for defense attorneys; a blatantly black eye for the prosecutor and the belief in the integrity and good sense of judges; a real loss for society. Thank goodness a probation officer monitored Curtis enough so that probation was finally revoked (after two attempts).
We do not know enough about who can be rehabilitated and by what means to err on the side of leniency at the risk of putting members of the public at risk especially in the case of a defendant with a criminal history like the one in the present case.
I do not know exactly how many years of prison would be enough to protect the public, to encourage the reporting of rape and other serious crimes, to show law enforcement that their efforts are not in vain, and to deter the defendant and others in this case. I suspect that five years would not be too many.
Wayne A. Fox
1009 Karen Lane
PO Box 9421
Moscow, ID 83843
waf at moscow.com
208 882-7975
__________________________________________
----- Original Message -----
From: Art Deco
To: Vision 2020
Sent: Friday, November 06, 2009 12:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] WTF?
What this decision says is that in slightly modified form the unwritten law (It's OK to kill your spouse's lover) is in full operation in Latah County. Wonderful! Would this apply also if the adulterer killed was a prominent local parson?
I thought the original sentence was perhaps a little weak, but at least it sent a message that alleged adultery is not a justification of murder (usage: ordinary language, not one of the many different shades of legalese to describe a chickenshit slaying). But 5 months soft jail time?
According the DN here is part of the murderer's statement of remorse:
"There is not a day that goes by that I don't think about what happened."
This doesn't sound like remorse to me, but rather indulgent self-pity.
The victim, Tyler Pace Lee, will never know the joy or sorrow of anything anymore. His friends and family, instead enjoying his presence, are left with numbing sorrow, emptiness, and bewilderment at the judge and whole criminal justice system.
'Lee's father, Loftin Lee, listened to the proceedings via conference call and also addressed the court. Ultimately his pleas for Leonard to remain incarcerated were not heeded. "Five months incarceration is not enough punishment for the person who took my son's life," he said.'
And it's 15 years of probation, not parole.
At least Prosecutor Bill Thompson opposed this absurd reduction:
'Prior to Brudie's decision, Prosecutor Bill Thompson argued against granting probation. He cited concerns over lack of suitable supervision in Leonard's probation plan and also over what he said seemed to be a lack of remorse over the incident. "I have to wonder if we are creating a situation that is destined to fail," he said.'
Maybe in addition to murderer James Leonard, the judge and recommending Cottonwood officials ought be in prison too. In my opinion they represent a far greater threat to society than Leonard because they are likely to be continuous repeat offenders in this regard.
Wayne A. Fox
1009 Karen Lane
PO Box 9421
Moscow, ID 83843
waf at moscow.com
208 882-7975
___________________________
Leonard charged with second-degree murder
Posted on: Thursday, May 08, 2008
James Curtis Leonard has officially been charged with second-degree murder for the June shooting death of Tyler Pace Lee.
Leonard, 24, was to face trial for voluntary manslaughter, but that charge was dismissed just before the trial was slated to begin last week. Prosecutors filed the second-degree murder charge Wednesday in Latah County District Court.
Police allege Leonard shot Lee, 25, of Moscow multiple times with a handgun and killed him after a June 19 argument at Leonard's Sprenger Road home near Genesee.
Leonard pleaded not guilty to the voluntary manslaughter charge in August.
Lee's ex-girlfriend, Amanda Draper, testified during an August preliminary hearing that Lee threatened to kill her, Leonard and Leonard's wife after learning Leonard had an affair with Draper. Draper also testified that Lee said he would rape Leonard's wife in front of Leonard before killing them.
The motion for dismissal of the voluntary manslaughter charges stated that new information had come to light in the case.
An affidavit of Detective Margaret Lehmbecker filed Friday states that she spoke April 22 to Lee's sister, who said Draper had told several different stories about what happened the morning of June 19. One story indicated Lee had caught Draper and Leonard having sex.
Lehmbecker interviewed Draper again April 23. According to the affidavit, Draper said she did not have sex with Leonard that morning, but said they were "messing around" and Lee may have seen them.
Lehmbecker's affidavit also states that Sunny Namauu, who lived at the Sprenger Road home with Leonard, told an Idaho State Police officer in July that Leonard "tried to dispose of Lee's body." Namauu said Leonard asked him for a shovel, which Namauu gave him. Namauu said he did not help Leonard with the body.
Leonard's preliminary hearing has been scheduled for 10 a.m. June 26.
___________________________________________
James Leonard granted probation
Man faces 15 years probation after five months in prison for 2007 shooting death
By Mark Williams Daily News staff writer
Posted on: Thursday, November 05, 2009
Leonard
James Curtis Leonard was granted probation Wednesday for the 2007 shooting death of Tyler Pace Lee.
Leonard pleaded guilty to voluntary manslaughter last February for shooting Lee, 25, of Moscow multiple times with a handgun and killing him after an argument at Leonard's Sprenger Road home near Genesee.
Second District Judge Jeff Brudie originally sentenced Leonard last May to a term of no less than five years in prison and no more than 15.
Leonard will now face a probation period of 15 years from the date of his original sentencing in May. He soon will be processed and released, then required to report to an assigned probation officer.
Both Brudie and defense attorney Sunil Ramalingam indicated Leonard ultimately would seek to move out of the Moscow/Latah County area while completing the probation.
Brudie retained jurisdiction in order to determine whether Leonard should be eligible for probation upon completion of several state programs at the North Idaho Correctional Institution in Cottonwood, where Leonard was held for the past five months.
Leonard received a recommendation of probation from the Idaho Department of Corrections based on his work at the Cottonwood facility. Brudie said he was not obligated to follow the recommendation but said Leonard had met the requirements placed before him to earn probation.
Leonard was originally charged with voluntary manslaughter in 2007 and entered a plea of not guilty. In May 2008, the state sought a second-degree murder charge as further details of the case emerged. Leonard pleaded not guilty to the second-degree charge in August 2008.
Prior to Brudie's decision, Prosecutor Bill Thompson argued against granting probation. He cited concerns over lack of suitable supervision in Leonard's probation plan and also over what he said seemed to be a lack of remorse over the incident.
"I have to wonder if we are creating a situation that is destined to fail," he said.
Lee's father, Loftin Lee, listened to the proceedings via conference call and also addressed the court. Ultimately his pleas for Leonard to remain incarcerated were not heeded.
"Five months incarceration is not enough punishment for the person who took my son's life," he said.
A soft-spoken, visibly nervous Leonard also made a short statement prior to Brudie's decision and asked Lee's family for forgiveness.
"There is not a day that goes by that I don't think about what happened," he said.
Mark Williams can be reached at (208) 882-5561, ext. 301, or by e-mail at mwilliams at dnews.com.
----- Original Message -----
From: donald edwards
To: vision2020 at moscow.com
Sent: Friday, November 06, 2009 7:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] WTF?
I sympathize with the "crime of passion" argument from personal experience with a similar situation involving a cheating fiancee' in our own living room while I was home. I guess I chose to swallow my ego, go out and learn Craps that night at the Flamingo Hilton down the street, then move out the next day. What was I going to do that would change her mind? Kill us all? It took maybe a few weeks of introspection to weigh my own part in what maybe inspired her to that action of longing something different.
"If you don't like the punishment for the various degrees of crime, then go to your legislator and have the law changed." Chuck Kovis
Chuck is right. The laws suck. I think it's because most of our lawmakers don't care about serving the common man but are whores for big business. This is obvious in a system where we allow private owned prisons to lobby congress for mandatory minimum sentences and three-strikes laws that would put away a petty thief for 25yrs. with no parole because he stole a loaf of bread after being out of jail for 5 years and holding a job the entire time. No compassion allowed for him.
Or the man who loses his house and family and serves a min. 10yrs. no-parole for planting a seed in his backyard that keeps him calm and non-violent while combatting the law of supply and demand that allows the Mexican Mafia to profit thus saving lives of law enforcement. Nope, we'd rather he be out spending his money, drinking and driving and waving his guns around or doped up on Merck Meds and Alcohol.
Here's an idea for a legislative change: why not encourage responsible gun control that would require anyone wanting the great responsibility of owning an arsenal have to take the same safety and law course policemen do? These teach case studies of when lethal force is appropriate and the consequences even officers have had to suffer for making that split second decision to pull the trigger. This might have been invaluable to the shooter who would have been better equipped to decide if his life was truly in danger or if it could have been handled with a call to 911 first, then a baseball bat, phone cord, neck tie or even his own two feet in the meantime.
Apparently though, 5-15yrs. somehow translates to 5mo. Great message for the next generation of lawmakers and the rational/logical thinking young adults running around screwing eachother.
Don "backasswards" common sense
----- Original Message -----
From: Chuck Kovis
To: Art Deco ; Vision 2020
Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 12:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
Okay, the "guy" is 18 and his girlfriend is 15 years and 11 months and 29 days old and he is a senior in high school and she is a sophomore. How long should he go to prison? What the hell is so hard about saying how long he should go to prison? How long? Chuck Kovis
----- Original Message -----
From: Art Deco
To: Vision 2020
Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
Chuck wrote:
"So, Tom, if the "guy" was 18 and the girlfriend was 17, how long should he be placed in prison for rape? Just curious."
So how does this fit the definition of rape?
TITLE 18
CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS
CHAPTER 61
RAPE
18-6101. Rape defined. Rape is defined as the penetration, however slight, of the oral, anal or vaginal opening with the perpetrator's penis accomplished with a female under any one (1) of the following circumstances:
(1) Where the female is under the age of sixteen (16) years and the perpetrator is eighteen (18) years of age or older.
(2) Where the female is sixteen (16) or seventeen (17) years of age and the perpetrator is three (3) years or more older than the female.
(3) Where she is incapable, through any unsoundness of mind, due to any cause including, but not limited to, mental illness, mental disability or developmental disability, whether temporary or permanent, of giving legal consent.
(4) Where she resists but her resistance is overcome by force or violence.
(5) Where she is prevented from resistance by the infliction, attempted infliction, or threatened infliction of bodily harm, accompanied by apparent power of execution; or is unable to resist due to any intoxicating, narcotic, or anaesthetic substance.
(6) Where she is at the time unconscious of the nature of the act. As used in this section, "unconscious of the nature of the act" means incapable of resisting because the victim meets one (1) of the following conditions:
(a) Was unconscious or asleep;
(b) Was not aware, knowing, perceiving, or cognizant that the act occurred.
(7) Where she submits under the belief that the person committing the act is her husband, and the belief is induced by artifice, pretense or concealment practiced by the accused, with intent to induce such belief.
(8) Where she submits under the belief, instilled by the actor, that if she does not submit, the actor will cause physical harm to some person in the future; or cause damage to property; or engage in other conduct constituting a crime; or accuse any person of a crime or cause criminal charges to be instituted against her; or expose a secret or publicize an asserted fact, whether true or false, tending to subject any person to hatred, contempt or ridicule.
The provisions of subsections (1) and (2) of this section shall not affect the age requirements in any other provision of law, unless otherwise provided in any such law. Further, for the purposes of subsection (2) of this section, in determining whether the perpetrator is three (3) years or more older than the female, the difference in age shall be measured from the date of birth of the perpetrator to the date of birth of the female.
W.
----- Original Message -----
From: Chuck Kovis
To: Tom Hansen ; Sunil Ramalingam ; vision 2020
Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 11:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
So, Tom, if the "guy" was 18 and the girlfriend was 17, how long should he
be placed in prison for rape? Just curious. Chuck Kovis
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
To: "Sunil Ramalingam" <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com>; "vision 2020"
<vision2020 at moscow.com>; <alford at dnews.com>; <lrozen at dnews.com>
Sent: Monday, December 27, 2010 11:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
> The guy has a criminal history. Sunil, and he was convicted of rape for
> God's sake!!!!!!!!!!
>
>
> Probation for rape?????????????
>
> Thank God he wasn't caught with marijuana. We'd have to lock him up then,
> huh?
>
> JEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESH!!!!!
>
> Tom Hansen
> Moscow, Idaho
>
> On Mon, December 27, 2010 10:40 am, Sunil Ramalingam wrote:
>>
>> It seems to me that if people are going to rail and shout, they should at
>> least make sure they report matters correctly. Hursh just came back from
>> a
>> retained jurisdiction, which means he was in the prison system and had to
>> be recommended for probation based upon his performance in the prison
>> system programming. On the Grand Theft charge he was sentenced to two to
>> seven years in the custody of the Idaho Department of Corrections.
>>
>> (Note to the Daily News: He is now on probation, not parole. They are not
>> interchangeable terms.)
>>
>> Having had clients go to prison after convictions of rape or child
>> molestation, I know it's ignorance to argue that those crimes go
>> unpunished in Latah County. I understand that people have their agendas,
>> but that does not excuse falsehoods.
>>
>> Sunil
>>
>>> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 09:45:13 -0800
>>> From: thansen at moscow.com
>>> To: deco at moscow.com; vision2020 at moscow.com; alford at dnews.com;
>>> lrozen at dnews.com
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Our Wonderful Latah County Justice System
>>>
>>> A THREE HUNDRED AND FIVE DOLLR fine!!?!?!?
>>>
>>> At Christmas time?
>>>
>>> Now, there's a couple taverns that'll just have to go without this
>>> season,
>>> huh?
>>>
>>> Any guesses who the judge was?
>>>
>>> Welcome to Latah County . . .
>>>
>>> Where RAPE and PEDOPHILIA rank supreme!
>>>
>>> Seeya round town. Moscow.
>>>
>>> Tom Hansen
>>> Moscosw, Idaho
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, December 27, 2010 9:12 am, Art Deco wrote:
>>> > The following appeared in the Daily News Public Records section on
>>> > Saturday:
>>> >
>>> > Sentencings
>>> >
>>> > Monday -- Hunter Marsh Hursh, 21, of Moscow was convicted of rape. He
>>> was
>>> > fined $305 and sentenced to five years of probation and 30 days of
>>> > discretionary jail time, and he cannot contact the victim for five
>>> years.
>>> >
>>> > Missing from this report is the fact that Hursh (with an extensive
>>> > criminal history) also received a withheld judgment for this rape.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > WTF?
>>> >
>>> > A $305 fine and 30 days discretionary jail time? And a withheld
>>> judgment?
>>> > For rape? A felony?
>>> >
>>> > Hursh is no stranger to the criminal justice system. And since the
>>> crime
>>> > of rape [04-28-2009], he has been convicted of other crimes for which
>>> he
>>> > also received probation. Hursh will soon, if not now, be out in our
>>> > community, free to pursue his habitual ways. Who will be his next
>>> > victims? Is this what we want to happen in our community? Do we not
>>> care
>>> > enough about each other to take some time and effort to prevent this
>>> kind
>>> > of public endangering infamy by the prosecutor and court?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Read Hursh's criminal history and the bumblings of the prosecutor and
>>> > judges here (Have a barf bag at the ready!):
>>> > https://www.idcourts.us/repository/caseHistory.do?roaDetail=yes&schema=LATAH&county=Latah&partySeq=87230&displayName=Hursh%2C+Hunter+Martin
>>> >
>>> > Also you can do a search in the online Daily News [sorted by date] for
>>> > more information.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > What's going on in Latah County?
>>> >
>>> > Besides inept, public disinterested prosecution and lazy, soft-headed
>>> > judges, where is the intensive media attention that allows this kind
>>> of
>>> > outrage to escape public attention?
>>> >
>>> > Is the Daily News deliberately shielding the horrible ineptitude of
>>> the
>>> > prosecutor's office and the lack of judgment of certain judges, or is
>>> the
>>> > Daily News also practitioners of lassitude and ineptitude? How can
>>> the
>>> > public respond to this continued kind of ineptness and poor judgment
>>> in
>>> > the criminal justice system if the media does not cover and comment
>>> upon
>>> > it? Without competent reporting and comment are we doomed to continue
>>> to
>>> > experience these kinds of outrages ad nauseam?
>>> >
>>> > And without intensive media coverage where is the general deterrence
>>> that
>>> > is allegedly part of the goals of criminal sentencing? How do law
>>> > enforcement personnel feel when they spend much time and effort
>>> working up
>>> > a case only to find it handled in such a horrendously nonchalant
>>> manner by
>>> > the prosecutor and the courts? Over the long term wouldn't this kind
>>> of
>>> > event be likely to demotivate law enforcement?
>>> >
>>> > We need competent, public interest motivated reporting, and we need to
>>> > somehow motivate the prosecutor and court to serve the public interest
>>> or
>>> > change the inept and lazy out, by recall if necessary.
>>> >
>>> > And if the local media are not willing to act responsibly, perhaps it
>>> is
>>> > time to start talking to their advertising clients who bear some
>>> > responsibility for supporting this fifth-rate media arrogance and
>>> careless
>>> > ineptitude about serious crimes taking place and adversely effecting
>>> > member of our community.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Wayne A. Fox
>>> > 1009 Karen Lane
>>> > PO Box 9421
>>> > Moscow, ID 83843
>>> >
>>> > waf at moscow.com
>>> > 208 882-7975
>>> > =======================================================
>>> > List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> > serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> > http://www.fsr.net
>>> > mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> > =======================================================
>>>
>>>
>>> "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it to
>>> change
>>> and the Realist adjusts his sails."
>>>
>>> - Unknown
>>>
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>
>
> "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist expects it to change
> and the Realist adjusts his sails."
>
> - Unknown
>
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
=======================================================
List services made available by First Step Internet,
serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
http://www.fsr.net
mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
=======================================================
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
=======================================================
List services made available by First Step Internet,
serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
http://www.fsr.net
mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
=======================================================
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