[Vision2020] Say What?
Wayne Price
bear at moscow.com
Thu Jul 30 11:47:22 PDT 2009
KIT,
I agree that the neighbor didn't do anything wrong. It;s the actions/
reactions/over-actions that is the problem.
On Jul 30, 2009, at 11:27 AM, Craine Kit wrote:
>> The lady that reported the burglary in the first place should be
>> reminded that not everyone trying to get in a stuck door is a
>> criminal.
>> Would she have called the police if Professor Gates was white? Who
>> knows.
>
> I have been told many times--by police officers--that they can't do
> their job without vigilant neighbors reporting suspicious activity.
> The lady did exactly what she was supposed to by reporting the
> incident to the authorities. On the 911 tape, she clearly says--more
> than once--that the men might live there but she did not know for
> sure. Given that there had been a recent break-in at that house, I
> file her actions under "being a good neighbor." Blaming her for doing
> the right thing and implying she is racist is way out of line.
>
> Kit Craine
>
>
>
>
>
> On Jul 30, 2009, at 10:04 AM, Paul Rumelhart wrote:
>
>> My take on the whole matter:
>>
>> The lady that reported the burglary in the first place should be
>> reminded that not everyone trying to get in a stuck door is a
>> criminal.
>> Would she have called the police if Professor Gates was white? Who
>> knows.
>>
>> Jumping immediately on Sgt. Crowley was an ill-advised move on Gates
>> part. He had to investigate the alleged burglary, he couldn't just
>> say
>> "this lady is probably wrong, I'll just let it go". As Gary
>> mentioned,
>> a polite response would have made this all not happen. He could then
>> have crowed about it to his heart's content, about how someone
>> thought
>> he was a burglar because he's black, what's this world coming to,
>> etc.,
>> etc. Now, to me at least, he comes across like a bad-tempered old
>> man
>> with a too short fuse when it comes to his race. If he had handled
>> it
>> calmly, I would have been right behind him when he talked about the
>> sorry state of race relations in this country still today. He should
>> not have followed Sgt. Crowley outside and continued to verbally
>> abuse
>> him. Maybe Sgt. Crowley could have shown a little fortitude and just
>> left, but I find it hard to find pity for Professor Gates in this
>> situation.
>>
>> President Obama, as human as everyone else, sided with his friend.
>> It
>> seems obvious to me. In my opinion, he should not have said what he
>> did
>> in the first place, and should have come out with an actual apology
>> afterwards. He should still do that. Saying you respect the other
>> person and maybe you could have worded it better without saying you
>> were
>> wrong is not an apology. Otherwise, you're adding insult to injury.
>>
>> Does this mean I think President Obama is unfit for office? No. It
>> does mean that I don't think he's incapable of doing wrong, and it
>> means
>> that I certainly don't think he's a "saint".
>>
>> This is all assuming, of course, that it was written up the way that
>> it
>> actually happened.
>>
>> As for the Sergeant entering Professor Gates' house, isn't this
>> acceptable when he's investigating a burglary? Especially since he
>> entered only the foyer, from what I remember.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> lfalen wrote:
>>> That is right, he was. The officer was responding to a potential
>>> burglary. Gates should have been appreciative. Instead he was
>>> verbally abusive.
>>> Roger
>>> -----Original message-----
>>> From: Wayne Price bear at moscow.com
>>> Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 11:05:10 -0700
>>> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
>>>
>>>
>>>> Roger,
>>>>
>>>> But he was in HIS OWN HOUSE!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 29, 2009, at 10:57 AM, lfalen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I think thar you are missing the point. Gate was belligerent from
>>>>> the git go before he finally identified himself. He at first
>>>>> refused to do so. He was arrested for verbal abuse of a police
>>>>> officer, not for burglary. If a black cop came to my house
>>>>> after I
>>>>> had locked myself out I would thank him for doing his job. About
>>>>> 20
>>>>> years ago when I was the Feed Plant Manager for Whitman County
>>>>> Grower I was working late one night, trying to finish up the
>>>>> monthly
>>>>> billings. I had turned off the lights and went to sleep in a
>>>>> sleeping bag. It was about 2:00 AM when a search light was shined
>>>>> in
>>>>> the window. A bull horn said " come out of there with your hands
>>>>> up"
>>>>> I said " as soon as I get my pants on". I identified myself
>>>>> telling
>>>>> them what I was doing and they went on their way.
>>>>> Roger
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>>>> Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 07:41:30 -0700
>>>>> To: "g. crabtree" jampot at roadrunner.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Look it up yourself. You don't trust my sources anyway! Trust
>>>>>> me, I'm
>>>>>> not going to waste my time trying to convince you of anything.
>>>>>> I'm
>>>>>> just here to note your errors.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course Gates could and should have handled it better. But
>>>>>> once
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> ID was shown, the officer should have left. His services were no
>>>>>> longer needed. Everything after that point was a waste of
>>>>>> taxpayer
>>>>>> dollars, something you usually care a lot about -- though it is
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> surprising you ignore it when it suits you. That is your MO.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 29, 2009, at 10:25 AM, "g. crabtree"
>>>>>> <jampot at roadrunner.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I failed to note it because I'm fairly sure that it didn't
>>>>>>> happen.
>>>>>>> Please provide a link to BHO's apology to either Sgt. Crowley
>>>>>>> or the
>>>>>>> Cambridge P.D.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Having actually read the police report, it's clear that had
>>>>>>> Gates
>>>>>>> simply and calmly shown his I.D. the officer would have left.
>>>>>>> It was
>>>>>>> Gates who continued to aggressively engage Sgt Crowley with
>>>>>>> demands
>>>>>>> and threats. Was Gates' arrest required? Probably not but,
>>>>>>> there is
>>>>>>> no question but what the professor was the one that was behaving
>>>>>>> stupidly.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Campbell" <philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To: "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>
>>>>>>> Cc: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>; "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 6:41 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If someone came to your house thinking you broke in and you
>>>>>>>> showed
>>>>>>>> him ID proving you lived there and he didn't leave
>>>>>>>> immediately,
>>>>>>>> I'd say he acted stupidly -- even if you took the race
>>>>>>>> elements
>>>>>>>> out of it. As it turns out, Obama even said he was sorry,
>>>>>>>> which of
>>>>>>>> course you failed to note.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Not that any of this will convince you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 29, 2009, at 9:12 AM, "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm not so sure that I'd go so far as to brand the POTUS a
>>>>>>>>> racist
>>>>>>>>> as it's a
>>>>>>>>> term that gets thrown around a little to casually, in my
>>>>>>>>> opinion.
>>>>>>>>> I would,
>>>>>>>>> however, like to know how you explain his standing in front
>>>>>>>>> of the
>>>>>>>>> nation
>>>>>>>>> and stating up front that he doesn't know the whole story with
>>>>>>>>> regard to his
>>>>>>>>> pal Henry Gates and Cambridge police sergeant James Crowley
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> yet went so
>>>>>>>>> far as to characterize law enforcements actions as "behaving
>>>>>>>>> stupidly?" How
>>>>>>>>> many other decisions does the man reach without being fully
>>>>>>>>> informed?
>>>>>>>>> Judging from other remarks I've heard him make I'd venture to
>>>>>>>>> say
>>>>>>>>> Cap and
>>>>>>>>> Trade and National Health Care might fall squarely into that
>>>>>>>>> same
>>>>>>>>> category.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> g
>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>> From: "Tom Hansen" <thansen at moscow.com>
>>>>>>>>> To: "Moscow Vision 2020" <vision2020 at moscow.com>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 5:41 AM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Vision2020] Say What?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "This president, I think, has exposed himself as a guy, over
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> over and
>>>>>>>>>> over again, who has a deep-seated hatred for white people or
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> white
>>>>>>>>>> culture, I don't know what it is. I'm not saying that he
>>>>>>>>>> doesn't like
>>>>>>>>>> white people. I'm saying he has a problem. This guy is, I
>>>>>>>>>> believe, a
>>>>>>>>>> racist.''
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> - Glenn Beck on President Obama (July 28, 2009)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIZDnpPafaA
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Seeya round town, Moscow.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Tom Hansen
>>>>>>>>>> Moscow, Idaho
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "The Pessimist complains about the wind, the Optimist
>>>>>>>>>> expects it
>>>>>>>>>> to change
>>>>>>>>>> and the Realist adjusts his sails."
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> - Unknown
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
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>>>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> =======================================================
>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>> =======================================================
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> =======================================================
>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>> http://www.fsr.net
>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>> =======================================================
>
> =======================================================
> List services made available by First Step Internet,
> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
> http://www.fsr.net
> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
> =======================================================
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