[Vision2020] Say What?

[Joe Campbell]

Can someone be charged with “public nuisance” if they are in their  
own home? This is a genuine question, not a rhetorical question.

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 2, 2009, at 11:12 AM, Sunil Ramalingam <sunilramalingam at hotmail.com 
 > wrote:

> I mistakenly thought my last post would make it clear that Gates'  
> acts did not rise to criminal behavior, but I was apparently wrong.   
> So let me just cut and paste some annotations from cases dealing  
> with the MA law that he was charged with violating:
>
> Arrest under Massachusetts “idle and disorderly person” statute  
> was unlawful under Massachusetts law, where defendant was arrested f 
> or yelling, screaming, swearing and generally causing a disturbance  
> but, though the yelling was undoubtedly loud enough to attract the a 
> ttention of other guests in hotel, it did not rise to level of “riot 
> ous commotion” or “public nuisance.” U.S. v. Pasqualino, D.Mass. 
> 1991, 768 F.Supp. 13.
> And –
> Defendant who did not physically resist his arrest arising out of a  
> domestic violence incident could not be convicted of disorderly  
> conduct based solely on his loud and angry tirade, which included  
> profanities, directed at police officers as he was being escorted to  
> police cruiser, even if spectators gathered to watch defendant;  
> defendant did not make any threats or engage in violence, and his  
> speech did not constitute fighting words. Com. v. Mallahan (2008) 72  
> Mass.App.Ct. 1103, 889 N.E.2d 77, 2008 WL 2404550.
> And –
> Defendant's conduct, namely, flailing his arms and shouting at  
> police, victim of recent assault, or both, after being told to leave  
> area by police, did not amount to “violent or tumultuous  
> behavior” within scope of disorderly conduct statute, absent any cla 
> im that defendant's protestations constituted threat of violence, or 
>  any evidence that defendant's flailing arms were anything but physi 
> cal manifestation of his agitation or that noise and commotion cause 
> d by defendant's behavior was extreme. Com. v. Lopiano (2004) 805 N. 
> E.2d 522, 60 Mass.App.Ct. 723.
> Here is more from that case:
> [Officer] Garrett asked the defendant to exit the vehicle. As the  
> defendant was getting out of the car, he “kept saying no problem her 
> e, no problem here, everything is all set, no problem.” The police a 
> dvised the defendant that he would be summonsed to court for assault 
>  and battery, that he was not to be arrested at Carins's [the allege 
> d victim] request, and that he had to leave the motel parking lot. H 
> e began to walk away. [Officer] O’Connor testified: “He took a  
> few steps from me, ten steps, turned around, began flailing his arms 
> , yelling that I was violating his civil rights.” He was advised a s 
> econd time to leave, and the defendant was “yelling at me, you're vi 
> olating my civil rights, then he began yelling at Ms. Carins, why ar 
> e you doing this to me, you'll never go through with this.” At that  
> time, he was placed under arrest. It is not disputed that only the d 
> efendant's conduct after he left the car forms the basis of the diso 
> rderly conduct charge.
> I won't pretend I have done extensive research on this, as I have  
> not.  But I think these cases make it pretty clear why Gates' case  
> was dismissed. I don't think he broke the law at all.
>
> Now, simply because such behavior may be legal, I don't recommend  
> anyone engage in it. I try to advise people of their rights, but I  
> always tell them to do so politely. The people with the badges,  
> guns, and tasers may also be having a bad day, and while the citizen  
> might eventually be exonerated, the immediate future can sometimes  
> be quite unpleasant.
> As I keep saying in this thread, bad manners are not criminal  
> offenses. Let me now add, good manners are often more helpful in  
> these situations
>
> Sunil
>
>
>
>
> > Date: Sat, 1 Aug 2009 18:05:43 -0700
> > From: godshatter at yahoo.com
> > To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> > CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Say What?
> >
> > It depends upon whether Gates really was violating the law or not.  
> Is
> > refusing to let someone who is technically breaking the law slide
> > because you are angry an abuse of your power? It's a dick move,  
> sure,
> > but if Gates really was breaking the law then he can't exactly claim
> > abuse if he's arrested.
> >
> > I don't know the specifics of the law he was arrested for. Is it
> > disorderly conduct when you are on your front porch yelling at  
> someone
> > who is on the public sidewalk? I don't know.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > Sunil Ramalingam wrote:
> > > As far as I'm concerned, pity has nothing to do with this. The  
> issue
> > > is the unlawful arrest.
> > >
> > > http://volokh.com/posts/1248465451.shtml
> > >
> > > Both men let their anger override their judgment, but one had the
> > > power of the state behind him, and abused it.
> > >
> > > Sunil
> > >
>
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