[Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial Crisis
Joe Campbell
philosopher.joe at gmail.com
Tue Apr 28 15:39:55 PDT 2009
Right but the issue is, share the burden as widely as possible, or
narrow it to employees of the state? Which do you prefer?
Joe Campbell
On Apr 28, 2009, at 11:40 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
> I retired at 69, two years ago. I was 71 yesterday. The only way I
> could participate would be to return something to PERSI or to send
> more to the state. Reducing all PERSI payments might be an option.
> Roger
> -----Original message-----
> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2009 05:52:01 -0700
> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial
> Crisis
>
>> That is what my wife is doing too.
>>
>> Are you doing it Roger? Are you saying I should do it but you don't
>> have to do it?
>>
>> Joe Campbell
>>
>> On Apr 27, 2009, at 10:42 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> That is what my wife is doing.
>>> Roger
>>> -----Original message-----
>>> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>> Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2009 10:37:18 -0700
>>> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to Financial
>>> Crisis
>>>
>>>> I'm sorry to hear about your wife's situation, Roger. Staff is
>>>> getting
>>>> the worst of it at WSU, too.
>>>>
>>>> But I still think Nick has a point. Here is one way to put it.
>>>> Would
>>>> you or anyone else on this list be willing to "cut" your pay by
>>>> giving
>>>> 3% more to the state of ID to help prevent folks at UI from being
>>>> fired? If you and others say "yes," then I'm on board, as well!
>>>>
>>>> Joe Campbell
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 27, 2009, at 10:03 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Joe
>>>>> I do no want you or any one else to lose their job. I think that
>>>>> pay
>>>>> cuts are preferable to layoffs.It is inevitably that some programs
>>>>> will be cut. there are no students or very few for a class it will
>>>>> be cut. My wife is staff in the PSES department at UI. She runs
>>>>> the
>>>>> Soils Pedology Lab. She will receive an award for 40 years of
>>>>> service today. She puts in 10 to 12 hours a day and does not get
>>>>> comp. time. She had cancer in 2003. She had surgery, chemo,
>>>>> radiation and the whole ball of wax. She is still suffering from
>>>>> the after affects. She takes a lot of Ibuprofen and diuretics to
>>>>> keep on going. She is not yet eligible for full Social Security.
>>>>> There have already been severe cut backs at PSES. Sixteen
>>>>> positions
>>>>> will not be filled. There are very few students in soils. If it
>>>>> were
>>>>> not for the environmental students there would be even less. If
>>>>> things get any worse she could be in danger. She is willing to
>>>>> take
>>>>> the 3% decrease. Everyone else should also.
>>>>> Roger
>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>>>> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2009 19:48:06 -0700
>>>>> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>> Financial
>>>>> Crisis
>>>>>
>>>>>> I am not guarenteed a job, Roger. As I understand it, cutting the
>>>>>> department provides justification for firing me. That is how my
>>>>>> chair
>>>>>> explained it. I have some security, of course, and I'm thankful
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> that. But not of the sort you imagine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Joe Campbell
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 24, 2009, at 9:34 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You are still guarenteed a job.In bad times that should be
>>>>>>> enough.
>>>>>>> Why should not everyone share in the cuts? Why should you be
>>>>>>> placed
>>>>>>> on an elevated pedestal at the expense of peasants(staff)?
>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>> From: Joe Campbell philosopher.joe at gmail.com
>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 19:30:51 -0700
>>>>>>> To: lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>> Financial
>>>>>>> Crisis
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Maybe I should have expressed my question more clearly, What is
>>>>>>>> tenure
>>>>>>>> without the salary? What do you get with that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Joe Campbell
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Apr 23, 2009, at 8:43 AM, lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> All I am saying is that pay cuts should affect everyone,
>>>>>>>>> starting
>>>>>>>>> with administrators. It makes no sence to cut the pay of those
>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> the lowest end of the pay scale while excluding those that
>>>>>>>>> make
>>>>>>>>> more. If the rules for tenure do not allow for this, then the
>>>>>>>>> rules
>>>>>>>>> need to be changed.
>>>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>>>> From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
>>>>>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 14:22:01 -0700
>>>>>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com, lfalen lfalen at turbonet.com, "Gier,
>>>>>>>>> Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>> Financial
>>>>>>>>> Crisis
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If tenure protects base salary, as two legal cases indicate
>>>>>>>>>> that it
>>>>>>>>>> does, then a contract that invalidated that aspect of tenure
>>>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>>>> be illegal and no faculty member should agree to it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>>>>> ---- lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> You are reading in things that arn't there. I said only that
>>>>>>>>>>> future tenure contract should not lock in salaries in the
>>>>>>>>>>> event
>>>>>>>>>>> that every one else takes a pay cut. In this narrow regard,
>>>>>>>>>>> no
>>>>>>>>>>> one should be immuned.
>>>>>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Gier, Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 14:01:58 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>> To: "lfalen" lfalen at turbonet.com, nickgier at roadrunner.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Here are your exact words:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "If this is prohibited by tenured rules, these should be
>>>>>>>>>>>> changed
>>>>>>>>>>>> going forward. Contracts should be honored as the early
>>>>>>>>>>>> retires
>>>>>>>>>>>> contracts should be honored. The thing is do not make these
>>>>>>>>>>>> kinds
>>>>>>>>>>>> of contracts in the future."
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Perhaps you did not mean to say it, but you wrote this
>>>>>>>>>>>> and it
>>>>>>>>>>>> clearly implies that future contracts for faculty would not
>>>>>>>>>>>> include tenure.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: lfalen [mailto:lfalen at turbonet.com]
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wed 4/22/2009 1:53 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Gier, Nicholas; nickgier at roadrunner.com;
>>>>>>>>>>>> vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I did not say anything about eliminating tenure, only that
>>>>>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>>>>> should be subject to same rules as staff when it comes to
>>>>>>>>>>>> pay
>>>>>>>>>>>> cuts.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Gier, Nicholas" NGIER at uidaho.edu
>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 10:42:01 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "lfalen" lfalen at turbonet.com,
>>>>>>>>>>>> nickgier at roadrunner.com, vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Roger,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you are suggesting that Idaho eliminate tenure, then
>>>>>>>>>>>>> prospective faculty members will not apply for jobs on
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Idaho's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> campuses. That of course would be disastrous for Idaho
>>>>>>>>>>>>> higher
>>>>>>>>>>>>> education.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tenure is necessary for academic freedom and that means,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> after a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> rigorous probationary period of 5-7 years, tenured
>>>>>>>>>>>>> professors
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have career-long protection from political interference in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>>>>>>>> teaching, research, and service.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: vision2020-bounces at moscow.com on behalf of lfalen
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wed 4/22/2009 10:39 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: nickgier at roadrunner.com; vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Financial Crisis
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nick
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with you on administrative position and athletics,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> though not necessarily on tenure. If cuts do get down to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> staff
>>>>>>>>>>>>> positions, it should also include tenured faculty. If this
>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> prohibited by tenured rules, these should be changed going
>>>>>>>>>>>>> forward. Contracts should be honored as the early retires
>>>>>>>>>>>>> contracts should be honored. The thing is do not make
>>>>>>>>>>>>> these
>>>>>>>>>>>>> kinds of contracts in the future.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Roger
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nickgier at roadrunner.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:54:37 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Vision2020] State Faculty Union Responds to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Financial
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Crisis
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IFT HIGHER EDUCATION COUNCIL RESPONDS TO FINANCIAL CRISIS
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On April 15, 2009 the Higher Education Council of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Idaho
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federation of Teachers, AFT/AFL-CIO met in a phone
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> conference
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to discuss the financial crisis.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Those present were Valia Tatarova, Idaho State University
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (physics); Lynn Lubamersky, Boise State University
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (history);
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chris Riggs, Lewis-Clark State College (history); Lynne
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Haagensen, University of Idaho (art); Joyce Lider, North
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Idaho
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> College (English); Susan Andrews, IFT Vice-President for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Higher
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Education; and Nick Gier, IFT President.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I. Salary Reduction Proposal. According to a legal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> opinion
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the AFT national office, academic tenure protects base
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> salary.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tenure is a property right and at least two court cases
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> recognized that base salary is part of that property. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IFT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Higher Education Council voted to oppose any salary
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reductions
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for tenured faculty. We join the BSU Faculty Senate
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> President
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in vowing to file a case action suit if tenured faculty
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> forced to take a pay cut. In a related decision the IFT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Higher
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Education Council voted that classified staff, lecturers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-tenured faculty be exempt from salary reductions and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> proposed that salary savings be taken from those making
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than $100,000.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> II. Teaching positions should have priority over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> administrative
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> positions. Nation-wide administrative positions have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> generally
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grown at a greater rate than teaching positions. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> example
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of BSU is especially egregious: from 2005-2007 BSU had
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 100
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more administrators than its peers but 191 fewer faculty
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> members instructing students than peer institutions.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Administrative salaries have also outpaced faculty pay.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1982 the salaries of 11 top UI administrative positions
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> increased 260 percent while full professor salaries
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> increased
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 198 percent. (CPI for the period was 215.) (For more see
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/salaries.htm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .) The IFT Higher Education Council voted to recommend
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> administrative positions be cut before teaching
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> positions.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> III. Appropriated funds are for academics not athletics.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1987 state subsidies for athletics at the UI has grown
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 338
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> percent while appropriations for Idaho higher education
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grown 159 percent. Currently the state subsidies for UI
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ISU athletics are over $3 million. Since 1999 private
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contributions to UI athletics rose 246 percent,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indicating
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> potential for it to wean itself, as any non-academic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> program
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> should, from its state subsidy. (For more see <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/athletics.htm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> .) The IFT Higher Education Council voted to request
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state monies for athletics on all Idaho campuses be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> phased
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over 4-6 years.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IV. Program reduction procedures must be revised. In
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2002
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Idaho State Board of Education (SBOE) instituted new
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> procedures
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for program reduction. At that time the IFT objected
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lack
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of protection for tenured faculty and requested that the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> procedures be revised. As no revisions have been made,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IFT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> president asked in December 2008 for a legal opinion
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> national office. The response was that these procedures
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> undermine tenure and do not comply with Idaho law. (For
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> see <www.home.roadrunner.com/~nickgier/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ProgramReduction.htm>.)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The IFT Higher Education Council voted to urge the SBOE
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> revise these procedures such that tenured faculty have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> same
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> protection as under the procedures for financial
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> exigency.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
>>>>>>>>> List services made available by First Step Internet,
>>>>>>>>> serving the communities of the Palouse since 1994.
>>>>>>>>> http://www.fsr.net
>>>>>>>>> mailto:Vision2020 at moscow.com
>>>>>>>>> =======================================================
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