[Vision2020] Banditry is Not an Option Was: Economists

Sun Mar 2 14:12:46 PST 2008

Hansen,

  You don't seem to be aware of the fact that we are already a government controlled commerce. This will be obvious to you when you are unable to list any commerce in the United States that is not government regulated.

  In a communist government, all the means of industry and production are controlled by the government and distributed evenly. There is a clear difference. The US Government sells money at a certain rate to control interest rates, why not do the same with oil? It is clearly just as vital to the US economy. 

  The government already has means to try and control oil prices. I just think we should use means that don't require the use of bombs and taking over nations. 

  Before we start bombing other nations, and trying to force them into submission of doing our own will, we should first control our own behavior and habits of US companies and industry. 

  I would much rather send our National Guard to a Gulf of Oil Rigs than a Gulf of War. If it is our companies that are misbehaving, we should address them first, not go to other nations and force them to do what we want them to do because we don't want to make any changes ourselves even when we are wrong. 

  Best Regards,

  Donovan

Tom Hansen <thansen at moscow.com> wrote:
  The US Government seizing control of oil rigs in order to maintain oil 
prices.

Government-controlled commerce? Hmmm.

This sounds all too familiar.

Now, how does this distinguish our form of government from . . . oh, 
say . . . er . . . uh . . . Communism?

Tom Hansen
Moscow, Idaho

> 
> I am relieved that your plan does not involve taking over oil rigs in
othe> r countries. 
> 
> I don't know that I want soldiers running oil rigs though. Your plan
still> involves a taxpayer subsidy, since it requires government workers 
running
> these rigs, and additionally there is a 'takings' problem when we seize
pri> vate property.
> 
> Sunil
> 
> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 13:08:14 -0800
> From: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Banditry is Not an Option Was: Economists
Predict> ed $90/Barrel...
> To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> 
> Sunil, You have way too much of an overactive imagination. You are
obvi> ously unaware that many oil rigs are sitting in the ocean unmanned, 
and
tur> ned off so that it drives up the oil prices. We don't have to go to 
other
n> ations, or take anything the government and taxpayers didn't pay for in
one> way or another. We don't need to kill or shoot anyone. Just take back
what> is US property that was abandoned. The United States Government
shoul> d produce its own oil, 30% of US supply, so it can control the 
market rate
> for oil, in much the same way we control interest rates. If the United
Stat> e produced its own oil, it could sell oil at a lower rate to drive 
down
its> market price down. If it sold oil for $80 a barrel, it would drive 
the
bar> rel price down. It would also eliminate our dependence on foreign 
nations,
> and our need to readily invade other nations that do produce it and won't
g> ive it to us
> at an affordable rate. Regards, Donovan 
> 
> Sunil Ramalingam wrote: Snide? 
Snide? 
> I credit you with 'Swiftian' and I get 'snide?'
> 
> Donovan, it seems to me the oil rigs you think we should consider taking
ov> er are in other countries and belong to other people. You appear to be
adv> ocating invasions of other countries to steal their property. So we
should> underwrite immense war debt to subsidize fuel prices? (I'm 
setting aside
> the moral aspects here for simplicity's sake, so we'll leave out the dead
f> oreign people for a moment.)
> 
> Or did I miss something? Were all the oil
> wells here in the US?
> 
> Sunil
> 
> Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 01:13:55 -0800
> From: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Banditry is Not an Option Was: Economists
Predict> ed $90/Barrel...
> To: sunilramalingam at hotmail.com
> CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> 
> Sunil, Thanks for the snide remarks. It certainly adds to the
quality> of emails here on the community Viz. Best Regards, 
Donovan
> 
> Sunil Ramalingam wrote: The President
ha> s already embarked on phase 1 of Donovan's Swiftian proposal. It's
> called the Iraq War, and thus far it hasn't worked as planned.
> 
> Sunil
> 
> > Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 17:56:42 -0800
> > From: chasuk at gmail.com
> > To: donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com
> > CC: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > Subject: [Vision2020] Banditry is Not an Option Was: Economists
Predicted> $90/Barrel...
> > 
> > On Sat, Mar 1, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Donovan Arnold
> > wrote:
> > 
> > > What if the next president did the same thing with oil? What if the
mil> itary
> > > forced itself onto oil rigs and started pumping more oil, and build 
and
> > > opened more oil refiners to make sure we had affordable energy in the
> > > country? What would be the consequences of that action?
> > > If the president forced the private energy market to charge 
reasonable
> > > prices by releasing its own oil production efforts and releasing oil
fr> om
> > > its reserve?
> >
> 
> > I would be uncomfortable with our military acting as bandits so that
> > our obese pampered citizenry could continue to make midnight runs to
> > WinCo for Twinkies and Mountain Dew. I know, I'm simplifying, but not
> > by much. Sometimes, these midnight runs include Twinkies, Mountain
> > Dew, and Doritos.
> > 
> > Now, being really, sincerely serious, I would never, ever condone
> > using our miltary as bandits, for whatever reason. Of course, this
> > "never, ever" has three exceptions, but I'm fairly confident that
> > these three exceptions are far removed from reality.
> > 
> > 1. I'm starving to death. My three bowls of rice and beans have
> > diminished to a single bowl of rice and beans, and then to a bowl of
> > rice without beans. The menu might vary, but my bare nutritional
> > needs are not being met. Banditry is okay by me when it is necessary
> > to guarantee my literal survival, no other
> proviso required.
> > 
> > 2. The government spends at least $1 trillion on developing
> > alternative energy sources. If we can spend that much money killing
> > people, we can spend that much money developing ways to unyoke the
> > world from the petroleum beast. If our scientists are given that much
> > money to spend -- with oil companies, oil company lobbyists and oily
> > politicians put on firm leashes -- thn we would find an oilless
> > solution.
> > 
> > 3. Walk. I didn't get my driver's license until I was 26 years old.
> > It expired when I turned 30, which I didn't renew for the next twelve
> > years. Somehow, I managed. Generally, i walked everywhere. This
> > obviously isn't viable for everyone, but it is viable for millions of
> > USians who live two minutes from the supermarket and yet still drive
> > to the store to pick up that loaf of bread, or that all-important
> > Snickers. In other
> words, for my able-bodied peers who complain about
> > the price of gas and yet still walk only when their car is in the
> > shop, I whip out my smallest violin while simultaneously singing "boo
> > hoo hoo."
> > 
> > Chas
> > 
> >
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2007)

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