[Vision2020] Question
J Ford
privatejf32 at hotmail.com
Tue Sep 4 17:23:43 PDT 2007
Thank you, Roger, for at least acknowledging that I wrote something.
Sometimes, when no one replies, I just figure my stuff did not go through.
That said, I would like to know if anyone caught the fact that Sen. Craig
said "It is my INTENT to resign." (My emphasis.) Anyone care to hazard a
guess as to the meaning of that?
Again, Sen. Craig did NOT write that statement, it was written for him by
the Republican Party for their benefit.
I can't wait to see what Democrat will be getting hung out to dry for
mis-behavior.
Oh yeah - that doesn't happen, does it? ESPECIALLY if the name is Kennedy!
J :]
>From: lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com>
>Reply-To: lfalen <lfalen at turbonet.com>
>To: "Tom Ivie" <the_ivies3 at yahoo.com>, vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Craig may resign
>Date: Tue, 04 Sep 2007 15:40:44 -0700
>
>Both you and J are correct. Whether he is guilty or not is irrelevant. The
>scandal could cause the seat to be lost. If he does resign, I favor Risch
>as a replacement
>
>Roger
>-----Original message-----
>From: Tom Ivie the_ivies3 at yahoo.com
>Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2007 09:42:20 -0700
>To: vision2020 at moscow.com
>Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Craig may resign
>
> > Many, and starting with the Republican Leadership, feel that his guilty
>plea only reinforced the rumors that have been floating around since the
>late 1960's. Many Republicans and conservatives are not tolerant of the
>kind of behavior he plead guilty to. Next year is an election year and the
>Republicans don't want any scandals to hurt them, so they will prompt him
>to resign. They only have a couple of Senate seats to lose in order to lose
>the majority of the Senate power. If they leave him in office now, they
>stand to lose a seat that they had counted on keeping. If he steps down
>and they appoint someone who can win, they keep the seat. It really comes
>down to the fact that it isn't as much about Craig as it is the Republicans
>fearing they would lose a seat. I hope my ramblings made some sense. I
>haven't had my coffee yet.
> >
> > J Ford <privatejf32 at hotmail.com> wrote: Ok...I've been listening to this
>sh*t for about as long as I can and not
> > made a single on-line comment...but today I will.
> >
> > Sen. Craig IS NOT CONSIDERING resigning and certainly is not doing so
>with
> > the idea that he did anything wrong. The REPUBLICAN PARTY has written a
> > statement that they would like Sen. Craig to sign and then read to the
> > public and then they would like him to go away. A HUGE part of all this
> > politiking at it's worst. It has so, so little to do with facts and the
> > "crime" allegedly involved as it does with some that are in power just
>want
> > Sen. Craig gone.
> >
> > I have been in contact with his office (I have known Sen. Craig for over
>15
> > years now) and they are totally devastated by this mess as is his
>family.
> > The Craigs' have been hounded by two newspapers this entire summer to
>the
> > point of distraction. Sen. Craig had the misfortune to get into a
>bathroom
> > where a seemingly rouge cop with a chip on his shoulder and a grudge
>against
> > the world (you hear in his own statements and his own voice if you
>listen to
> > the recording) because he was given "a duty that I did not want and was
>only
> > given to me as a 'punishment' for what the brass thought was bad
>behavior on
> > my part". This man obviously was out to get anyone and when he saw the
> > Senator standing outside of his stall for two minutes (while the Senator
>was
> > waiting for a stall to open up,) he saw his chance to land a big fish
>and
> > get back into the good graces of his supervisors. This is a very angry
>cop.
> >
> > Again, listening to the recording you can hear that the COP made the
>"first
> > move" (if that's what it was) and Mr. Craig's response was that "maybe
>our
> > feet did touch - I don't recall that they did."
> >
> > Also, you hear the cop say that he saw Sen. Craig's "left hand" come
>under
> > the stall and he knew it to be the left hand because of the "gold ring
>on
> > (Sen. Craig's) hand." Ok...figure this out. Sen. Craig was sitting on
>the
> > cop's left side, facing in the same direction. He'd have had to turn
>his
> > body totally around, which would have put his feet to the side of the
>toilet
> > and partially under the stall walls, and then he would have had to reach
> > completely under the stall wall in order for that cop to see that ring.
>Try
> > it your self - IF Sen. Craig did reach under the stall with just his
>finger
> > tips (cop's own description of what happened) there is NO WAY the ring
>is
> > visible. NO WAY. At most, the ring would be seen while the cop
>handcuffed
> > the Senator.
> >
> > I have talked to several police officials both in Idaho and in other
>places
> > and they all say the same things that I have to several of you off list
>-
> > where is the surveillance equipment that stings like this usually use in
> > order to back up these kind of "operations"? There was no recorder, no
> > camera, no NOTHING that says what this cop saw Mr. Craig do was what
>really
> > happened. Why isn't anyone else asking this?
> >
> > Why is everyone so eager to jump on this guy's back and claim "You did
>it
> > and you damn will know it. NOW QUIT!" What happened to presumed
>innocent
> > until proven otherwise?
> >
> > Yes, I do realize and acknowledge that he plead guilty to a MISDEMEANOR
> > charge of disorderly conduct. Again, you listen to the intimidation and
> > ridicule that cop heaps onto the Senator and you have to understand - he
>did
> > what he thought would best defuse the situation so his family and his
>state
> > would not suffer like they are now. Was it the right thing to do? No,
>but
> > how many of us would be willing to admit we have made mistakes (pleading
> > guilty to something he didn't do) and just looked for the easiest way to
> > explain them? Sen. Craig felt he had no choice...this cop was going to
>take
> > him to jail "unless (he) doesn't cooperate" with the cop and say things
>went
> > they way the COP says they did. Classic intimidation procedure.
> >
> > And how about what this Senator has done for the State of Idaho for over
>the
> > past 30 years? I mean, IF he did this, we are not talking about him
>taking
> > advantage of anyone under age, of a weaker status or handicapped. We
>are
> > talking about an alleged act of possible solicitation - when did that
>become
> > a capital crime worthy of this type of reaction and over-reaction? Why
>does
> > this one act negate 30 years of dedicated service to this state and its
> > families?
> >
> > Get a grip, peeps - this Senator did nothing that warrants this type of
> > out-crying of "Hang'em - hang'em high!"
> >
> > And before we all go jumping off another cliff - get the facts. As far
>as
> > his Office is concerned - Sen. Craig is NOT considering quitting. It is
>the
> > Republican Party that wants him out and has drafted a statement - not
>Sen.
> > Craig.
> >
> > Hell, if a Kennedy had done this, we'd all be saying "Oh well - they's
>at it
> > again." and let things continue on - business as usual.
> >
> > J :]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: Mark Solomon
> > >To: vision2020 at moscow.com
> > >Subject: [Vision2020] Craig may resign
> > >Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2007 07:47:30 -0700
> > >
> > >Craig May Resign, Republicans Say
> > >
> > >By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
> > >Published: August 31, 2007
> > >
> > >Filed at 9:42 a.m. ET
> > >
> > >
> > >WASHINGTON (AP) -- Idaho Sen. Larry Craig is considering resigning,
> > >Republican officials said Friday, after days of public and private
>pressure
> > >stemming from his arrest in June in a police undercover operation at an
> > >airport men's room.
> > >
> > >Craig pleaded guilty to disorderly conduct on Aug. 1, and while he has
> > >since said he did nothing wrong, the episode has roiled the Republican
> > >party and produced numerous calls for him to step down.
> > >
> > >As a measure of the pressure Craig faces, party officials said a
>statement
> > >had been drafted at Republican Party headquarters calling for the
> > >third-term senator to resign. It was not issued, these officials said,
>in
> > >response to concerns that it might complicate quiet efforts under way
>to
> > >persuade the 62-year-old lawmaker to give up his seat.
> > >
> > >Any resignation would clear the way for Gov. C.L. ''Butch'' Otter, a
> > >Republican, to name a replacement who would serve until the end of
>Craig's
> > >current term in 2009. Lt. Gov. James Risch and Rep. Mike Simpson were
>among
> > >the possible replacements, according to the GOP officials, who spoke on
> > >condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the
> > >matter publicly.
> > >
> > >Craig has not made any public statements about his case since an
>appearance
> > >earlier this week in Boise, Idaho, in which he said he had done nothing
> > >wrong. ''I am not gay. I never have been gay,'' he added emphatically.
> > >
> > >He said any additional comment would be posted on his official Web
>site,
> > >where the only reference to the incident as of Friday morning was a
>text of
> > >the statement he read before the television cameras.
> > >
> > >Craig, 62, served in the House before winning his first Senate term in
> > >1990, and compiled a strongly conservative voting record.
> > >
> > >He was arrested on June 11 by an undercover police officer in a
>Minneapolis
> > >airport men's room who said the senator had engaged in conduct ''often
>used
> > >by persons communicating a desire to engage in sexual conduct.''
> > >
> > >Minutes after he was arrested for lewd conduct, Craig denied soliciting
>for
> > >sex, saying ''I'm not gay. I don't do these kinds of things,''
>according to
> > >an audio tape released by police on Thursday.
> > >
> > >He denied that he had used foot and hand gestures to signal interest in
>a
> > >sexual encounter. The officer, Sgt. Dave Karsnia, accused the
>three-term
> > >senator of lying and grew exasperated with his denials.
> > >
> > >''Embarrassing, embarrassing. No wonder why we're going down the
>tubes,''
> > >Karsnia said.
> > >
> > >In the police interview, Craig, 62, never admitted doing anything wrong
>and
> > >said his actions had been misinterpreted. However, Karsnia wrote in his
> > >report that the gestures were consistent with efforts to find a sexual
> > >partner in the men's room.
> > >
> > >Craig later pleaded guilty to a reduced charge of disorderly conduct,
>which
> > >he now calls a mistake.
> > >
> > >More Republicans distanced themselves from Craig on Thursday. Sen. John
> > >Ensign of Nevada, who chairs the GOP's senatorial campaign committee,
> > >stopped short of calling on him to resign but suggested strongly that
>he
> > >should.
> > >
> > >''I wouldn't put myself hopefully in that kind of position, but if I
>was in
> > >a position like that, that's what I would do,'' Ensign told The
>Associated
> > >Press in his home state. ''He's going to have to answer that for
>himself.''
> > >
> > >The party's Senate leadership had previously called for the ethics
> > >committee to investigate, and on Wednesday took the highly unusual
>measure
> > >of asking him to give up his seniority in committee positions. Craig
> > >complied.
> > >
> > >On the tape, Craig and the arresting officer can be heard arguing over
>what
> > >happened in the men's room minutes earlier. Craig acknowledges that the
> > >men's feet bumped but says nothing improper happened.
> > >
> > >''Did we bump? Yes, I think we did. You said so. I don't disagree with
> > >that,'' Craig said.
> > >
> > >But Craig disputes the officer's account that he swept his hand under
>the
> > >stall next to him in an apparent effort to advance the encounter. They
>even
> > >disagree whether Craig used his right hand or his left hand.
> > >
> > >Craig said he was merely trying to pick up a piece of paper -- an
>account
> > >the officer disputes.
> > >
> > >''I'm telling you that I could see, so I know that's your left hand.
>Also I
> > >could see a gold ring on this finger, so that's obvious it was the left
> > >hand,'' Karsnia tells Craig.
> > >
> > >''Well we can dispute that,'' Craig says. ''I'm not going to fight you
>in
> > >court. I reached down with my right hand to pick up the paper.''
> > >
> > >Karsnia said in a police report that he recognized Craig's hand gesture
>as
> > >a signal aimed at initiating sex. ''It should be noted that there was
>not a
> > >piece of paper on the bathroom floor, nor did Craig pick up a piece of
> > >paper,'' he said in the report.
> > >
> > >Karsnia, 29, joined the airport police department just out of college
>in
> > >2000 and was promoted to sergeant in 2005. Last year, he earned a
>master's
> > >degree in criminal justice, leadership and education.
> > >
> > >------
> > >
> > >Associated Press writers Scott Sonner in Reno, Nev., Joshua Freed in
> > >Minneapolis, Todd Dvorak in Idaho and Liz Sidoti in Washington
>contributed
> > >to this report.
> >
> >
> > >=======================================================
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> > >=======================================================
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Now you can see troubleÂ…before he arrives
> >
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> >
> > Tom & Liz Ivie
> >
> > ---------------------------------
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> >
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