[Vision2020] Coulter's Dream - from CNN (post oops)

[g. crabtree]

Don't know what happened there, lets try again.

Since the bulk of your post is the same old poor Joe nonsense, I'll simply 
make a few points and let this go for now

Point 1. Dale and I are not living in one another's pockets. I do my thing
and he does his. I do occasionally post to his site and I do occasionally
(rarely) reprint something from his site to the V. We do not co-ordinate or
collude in any way other then that and we make it plain where the words are
coming from when we do. If you have a problem with something on Dale's site,
talk to him. If it appears over my name I'll answer for it.

Point 2. Congratulations, you have graduated from buffoon to liar. That I 
"CHALLENGED" you to come to my place of employment is prevarication at its 
finest. I challenge you to release that private E-mail along with any of 
yours leading up to it or following it. Rest assure that with your 
permission (or for clarification should you fail to provide the complete 
picture) I am only too willing to post the contents of my deleted items file 
where they concern any of my off-line dealings with you.

No surprise that you don't want to answer questions and the part about no 
longer engaging in conversation I've heard from you many times before. Like 
a bad penny you always come back.

g

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe Campbell" <joekc at adelphia.net>
To: "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com>
Cc: "Donovan Arnold" <donovanjarnold2005 at yahoo.com>; 
<vision2020 at moscow.com>; "Ted Moffett" <starbliss at gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2007 2:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coulter's Dream - from CNN


Crabtree,

You are deliberately misconstruing and mischaracterizing my views.

I never said that my BELIEFS were ambiguous. It is my words that are 
deliberately
ambiguous. This is because they often appear out of context and on the 
website of your
friend, Dale -- a website where people openly post thoughts about the 
justifiable killing
of gays. You don't want to discuss issues with me. You want to create 
opportunities
where my views are deliberately misrepresented and publicly ridiculed.

More examples?

You keep repeating the lie that I favor abortion, another lie that is 
repeated on Dale’s
website. I've addressed this issue on a number of occasions in town crier 
columns and on
these pages but you ignore these words. Legal distinctions are deliberately 
cast as moral
distinctions; knowledge is conflated with belief.

I sent you a private e-mail that is not posted on Dale's blog. It is not 
possible for me to
make a point without Dale bringing it up. Does he bring up the fact that I 
quickly
apologized? Or that recently you INVITED me, CHALLENGED me to come to your
place of work when I asked you to meet with me? These are never mentioned.

I'd be happy to discuss the matter in more detail if you'd give me some 
sense that your
goal was to understand my view and not ridicule it in public. As long as I 
get
mischaracterized, I won’t engage with you in conversation, won’t answer your 
questions.

Which is not to say that I won’t point out your fallacious arguments!

--
Joe Campbell

---- "g. crabtree" <jampot at roadrunner.com> wrote:

=============
And what exactly would be your point here, Mr. Moffett? The comment I made 
did not express any opinion good or bad about religious ambiguity. That was 
left for the reader to determine. The point I was making in the original 
post was that Mr. Campbell was in no position to determine how I might feel 
about any given topic were I Jewish (or black, or female, or homosexual, 
etc.) as was his assertion. Aside from the absurdity of such speculation (If 
a fish had feet instead of flippers, how would he feel about formal 
footwear?) I'm fairly certain that I am ever so slightly more expert in all 
that is me then most others can be. Philosophy teachers included.

g
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Ted Moffett
  To: Joe Campbell
  Cc: g. crabtree ; vision2020 at moscow.com ; Donovan Arnold
  Sent: Monday, October 15, 2007 10:34 PM
  Subject: Re: [Vision2020] Coulter's Dream - from CNN


  Gary wrote:

    I don't recall making any comment as to whether I believed your 
assertion of being a Christian or not and I certainly make no judgment with 
regard to your level of commitment to whatever it is you do believe but,It 
certainly seems to me that reasonable people could come to the conclusion 
that you are disposed toward a certain religious ambiguity.

    g

  If Mother Teresa (Agnes Bojaxhiu), winner of the Nobel Peace Prize, can 
have moments of doubt about God, faith and religion, so can anybody who 
professes belief about anything:

  http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1655415,00.html

  "...the Teresa of the letters lived in a state of deep and abiding 
spiritual pain. In more than 40 communications, many of which have never 
before been published, she bemoans the "dryness," "darkness," "loneliness" 
and "torture" she is undergoing. She compares the experience to hell and at 
one point says it has driven her to doubt the existence of heaven and even 
of God."

  "The church anticipates spiritually fallow periods. Indeed, the Spanish 
mystic St. John of the Cross in the 16th century coined the term the "dark 
night" of the soul to describe a characteristic stage in the growth of some 
spiritual masters. Teresa's may be the most extensive such case on record. 
(The "dark night" of the 18th century mystic St. Paul of the Cross lasted 45 
years; he ultimately recovered.) Yet Kolodiejchuk sees it in St. John's 
context, as darkness within faith. Teresa found ways, starting in the early 
1960s, to live with it and abandoned neither her belief nor her work. 
Kolodiejchuk produced the book as proof of the faith-filled perseverance 
that he sees as her most spiritually heroic act."
  ------------
  Vision2020 Post: Ted Moffett